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And back to 2nd we go!

ouryears

Bench
Messages
3,195
Yeah this is the worry. During his tenure he’s improved (again, from a very low base) a number of facets of his coaching;
Building/overseeing an effective Plan A
Improving, or at least letting players improve attacking structures/set plays
Team cohesiveness and morale
Mental resilience of the team in close tough matches (recruitment obv a big part of this too)
Team fitness/some skill building (a little)

But - his tactical use of the bench, ability to adjust tactics in game, conservatism in player selections, trust in younger players - are all deficiencies that I wish we saw evidence of improvement.

At our best, with our best 16 (and option of using our 17) the team can beat anyone, and they can sustain it for 4 weeks. We could win. And in the same way he’s ultimately responsible for the bad, he’s gotta get some credit for the good.
As with every team there’s plenty that needs to go right for that to happen. And if he was a better coach in those areas then the list of variables that could prevent that would be shorter.
For all that though - he ain’t going anywhere this season or next, so here’s hoping anyways.
A coach worth their salary gets his troops ready and cracking at the business end of the season.

Top 4 may still elude us.

And we must not bow out in straight sets in the finals, if we do, the club should Sack him.
 

ouryears

Bench
Messages
3,195
Sure with our full team we could have covered an injury.
But that brings us to everyone’s second point.
Why when we had lost 4 of our starting pack and had to throw ISP player into the game did McGregor go into the game with an ageing winger and a back up hooker on the bench?

You can argue that there were no other forwards in ISP ready to play first grade, but at least Kerr, Allgood and Ford are actual forwards.
Exactly, put a forward in the role.

Putting a lightweight older winger in the heat of the oven is dead set sackable stupidity.

Nighty isn't Radradra or Wendell Sailor for goodness sakes.

Stupidity.
 
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ouryears

Bench
Messages
3,195
The panic is down to coaching.
An actual coach who watched that game would have recognised that leaving Nightingale on the field for 70 minuites, while you had recognised forwards on the bench, while he looked increasingly exhausted and busted, while the opposition coach directed all his forwards to run straight at him, was not a great idea.

McGregors bench use has been a frustration all year, this time it bit us on the ass.

That’s the panic, the non recognition of a problem during the game and the faliure to fix it on the fly.
We all know and we aren't even on the payroll.

Mary is an oxygen theif as a coach.
 

ouryears

Bench
Messages
3,195
My take for what’s its worth, Nichols did ok, gave Widdop good ball, kicks a little ordinary , the forwards did very well until the last 15 minutes I think they just ran out of petrol, not match fit at the level they played at last night plus injury to Host. Enough has been said about Nightie, very sad. All in all to me great game and very proud of the effort.
Ummm, the game goes for 80, not 65.

So not proud. Could have been.

But wasn't.
 

Saint_JimmyG

First Grade
Messages
5,067
Nichols is fine for a back up.

He came up against the defending premiers at home in a depleted team, and a winger defending next to him where an edge backrower should have been.

Can’t see him playing too many more games of FG, but with our first team available to play with him, I’m expecting he’ll do much better.

It’s unkind but Nicholls will (along with Kieran Kerr) be a trivia question in the years to come.
 

Saint_JimmyG

First Grade
Messages
5,067
Fair enough and agree he needs to improve on this area.

But don’t use the other night as an example when 4 out of our 6 forward starters were on Origin duty and the best reserve we have goes down after 5 mins.

Most coaches would struggle in that scenario when no options are available.

Bennett used Thaiday at hooker against us FFS.

One thing needs to be put into perspective regarding the ‘other night’.

While Saints had four players out, Melbourne were far more greatly affected.

And, the Storm played with the Dragons in the way a cat taunts an injured mouse,

Confronting but at the same time reality based.
 

The Damo

Juniors
Messages
1,991
A coach worth their salary gets his troops ready and cracking at the business end of the season.

Top 4 may still elude us.

And we must not bow out in straight sets in the finals, if we do, the club should Sack him.
Indeed they do. I’m still very confident we’ll stay in the top 4, though only time will tell.

And what people on this forum think the club should do seems to have less effect on what they actually do than a letter to Santa asking for a jet pack and an elephant.
 

The Damo

Juniors
Messages
1,991
One thing needs to be put into perspective regarding the ‘other night’.

While Saints had four players out, Melbourne were far more greatly affected.

And, the Storm played with the Dragons in the way a cat taunts an injured mouse,

Confronting but at the same time reality based.
I disagree with your feline rodent analogy. If you think Cam Smith and. Bellamy coached team are ok with having 5 tries scored on them, by a team that had 8% less possession -and ran 600m less than them, then I suspect you’d be mistaken.
 

giboz71

First Grade
Messages
8,895
One thing needs to be put into perspective regarding the ‘other night’.

While Saints had four players out, Melbourne were far more greatly affected.

And, the Storm played with the Dragons in the way a cat taunts an injured mouse,

Confronting but at the same time reality based.

Absolutely.

And shows the gulf between Mary and someone like Bellamy. This is hardly groundbreaking news. Melbourne are the benchmark in bringing talent through. Hughes, Croft, Jacks and Brandon Smith, along with Curtis Scott will form the nucleus of the Storm for years to come, long after the big 3 are gone.

That’s why Bellamy is the greatest coach in the game.

Comparing our reserves to theirs, or Mary to Bellamy is a pointless exercise. Their is no comparison.

But I hardly think the other night means our season is over, I’m sure the 5 Origin Guys coming back will disagree.
 

The Damo

Juniors
Messages
1,991
Absolutely.

And shows the gulf between Mary and someone like Bellamy. This is hardly groundbreaking news. Melbourne are the benchmark in bringing talent through. Hughes, Croft, Jacks and Brandon Smith, along with Curtis Scott will form the nucleus of the Storm for years to come, long after the big 3 are gone.

That’s why Bellamy is the greatest coach in the game.

Comparing our reserves to theirs, or Mary to Bellamy is a pointless exercise. Their is no comparison.

But I hardly think the other night means our season is over, I’m sure the 5 Origin Guys coming back will disagree.
Yep. Difference in coaches ability didn’t stop stop us beating then by 20 in round 9. Full strength teams then more or less (they were missing Scott, we had Nighty on the wing)
 

Saint_JimmyG

First Grade
Messages
5,067
Absolutely.

And shows the gulf between Mary and someone like Bellamy. This is hardly groundbreaking news. Melbourne are the benchmark in bringing talent through. Hughes, Croft, Jacks and Brandon Smith, along with Curtis Scott will form the nucleus of the Storm for years to come, long after the big 3 are gone.

That’s why Bellamy is the greatest coach in the game.

Comparing our reserves to theirs, or Mary to Bellamy is a pointless exercise. Their is no comparison.

But I hardly think the other night means our season is over, I’m sure the 5 Origin Guys coming back will disagree.

The only negative of your penultimate sentence is that Saints have been on a downward curve since the end of May.
 

Saint_JimmyG

First Grade
Messages
5,067
I disagree with your feline rodent analogy. If you think Cam Smith and. Bellamy coached team are ok with having 5 tries scored on them, by a team that had 8% less possession -and ran 600m less than them, then I suspect you’d be mistaken.

The point of my post is that Melbourne toyed with the Dragons.

That’s reality.
 

ouryears

Bench
Messages
3,195
Yep. Difference in coaches ability didn’t stop stop us beating then by 20 in round 9. Full strength teams then more or less (they were missing Scott, we had Nighty on the wing)
That was back then Damo.
This is now.

Early season performances mean nothing.
 

BennyV

Referee
Messages
22,441
I disagree with your feline rodent analogy. If you think Cam Smith and. Bellamy coached team are ok with having 5 tries scored on them, by a team that had 8% less possession -and ran 600m less than them, then I suspect you’d be mistaken.
This. Melbourne would not be 100% happy overall. If you look at the game subjectively, they played shit for 65 minutes. Their completion rate was down, they invited us into the game repeatedly after scoring points (2 of our tries came off the back of them dropping balls within 2 plays of a kick off after they scored) and their kicking game wasnt the best.

By comparison, we were nigh on perfect. We made the most of the opportunities when they were presented, we had 26/27 completed sets (with the only incomplete coming from Dufty missing that bomb) and we were holding in defense.

And despite all that, we managed to claw a 2 point lead 60 minutes into the game and hold it for all of 5 minutes before Melbourne turned the screws on our blatantly obvious weakness. All this against a team missing half their spine, half their backline and most of their forward pack, certainly moreso than us.

Anyone taking 'positives' out of that game needs to take off the rose coloured glasses.
 
Messages
2,910
This. Melbourne would not be 100% happy overall. If you look at the game subjectively, they played shit for 65 minutes. Their completion rate was down, they invited us into the game repeatedly after scoring points (2 of our tries came off the back of them dropping balls within 2 plays of a kick off after they scored) and their kicking game wasnt the best.

By comparison, we were nigh on perfect. We made the most of the opportunities when they were presented, we had 26/27 completed sets (with the only incomplete coming from Dufty missing that bomb) and we were holding in defense.

And despite all that, we managed to claw a 2 point lead 60 minutes into the game and hold it for all of 5 minutes before Melbourne turned the screws on our blatantly obvious weakness. All this against a team missing half their spine, half their backline and most of their forward pack, certainly moreso than us.

Anyone taking 'positives' out of that game needs to take off the rose coloured glasses.

I’m “positive” Nightingale shouldn’t have defended in the middle of the field for 70 minitues.
Does that count?
 

BennyV

Referee
Messages
22,441
He didn't. He defended on the edge.
Which is sort of worse. Edge backrower is one of the toughest positions to defend - you constantly need to make critical decisions including last minute choices to mark up on other backrowers (who are at full pace), cover quick little halves or slide to cover a backline sweep, you need to be quick laterally and also strong enough to cover the (likely) smaller, weaker defenders outside you. The workrate isnt quite as high as those in the middle but still pretty solid, but you need to have more stamina and intellegence due to the consistent targeting on the edge.

Makes it all the more ridiculous to play NIghty there. If he had defended in the middle, he would have at least had strong defenders in McInnes and the props/lock to assist. On the edge, he is/was completely exposed and it showed.
 

BennyV

Referee
Messages
22,441
Who actually was out for Melbourne?
Slater and Munster - half their spine.
Ado-Carr and Chambers - half their outside backs.
Bromwich, Glasby and Kasiano - 3/4 of their prop rotation.
Kafusi and Finucane - 2/3 of their starting back row.
 

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