The RFL makes another profit

[RL The greatest game]

The fourteenth year in a row. They must be doing something right.
http://www.loverugbyleague.com/news_22768-rfl-posts-profit.html

 

[langpark]

Great news!!

 

[Foreign Legion]

Retiring broadcaster Mike Stephenson says rugby league is a niche sport that is struggling.

Stephenson, better known as 'Stevo', is retiring as a commentator after tomorrow's grand final.

The 1972 World Cup winner believes that rugby league would have been "oblierated" without the support of Sky.

“I think it’s struggling," he told The Daily Telegraph.

"I have no qualms about saying that without Rupert Murdoch’s money, it would have been obliterated. Completely.

"We’re a niche sport. And we’re a northern sport, whether we like it or not.”

http://www.loverugbyleague.com/news_23756-stevo-rugby-league-is-struggling.html


maybe if they employed people on how to run the game maybe they would be in a better position

 

[roughyedspud]

Better position than what? Or who?

Its also worth noting that stevo has always been one of the one eyed old farts that never has a good word to say about the game..

See ya bye stevo...he won't be missed

 

[Foreign Legion]

http://www.loverugbyleague.com/news_24636-heads-in-the-sand.html

Let’s be honest, 2016 in British rugby league was not a great year.

Too many games of poor quality, few star names in the Super League, problems at the disciplinary committee, injury after injury after injury, dropping attendances, clubs close to going bust – you name it, it had it.

In the off-season things seem to have gotten worse, with the sport lurching from crisis to crisis.

Players walking out on contracts, redundancies at head office, failure in the Four Nations, the Dubai camp drama, funding cuts and then to top it off the Bradford circus rolling into town once more.

It’s been one entire balls up.

Not all of these issues have directly been the RFL’s fault, some have, but they are the governing body. They are the custodians of the game and in many of these situations they have dropped the ball.

And mostly they have tried to spin their way out with a “everything is fine” message.

That was the case at the end of last year when Nigel Wood told the assembled media that there was no club vs country conflict when it came to the controversial England pre-season camp in Dubai. Not long after the camp was cancelled. So much for a ‘no club vs country argument’. And don’t get me started on the sense of a holding a camp in a country where a man was jailed for trying to develop rugby league.

Then there’s the farcical issue of the 2017 season draw where there is two weekends of doubleheaders, where teams play two games in four days, made especially to fit in the Dubai camp. Player welfare anyone?

Then there’s the issue of each Super League club needing to have a reserves team, one thorny situation the RFL has palmed off for the clubs to decide themselves.

The result? Only a few clubs will operate a second-side, so many young players will go months with no matches to play in. That will surely help their development.

Then there’s the issue of bullying in the RFL’s match officials department, which has already seen a number of referees quit. Young referee Joe Cobb is the latest to depart. Newspaper League Weekly has impressively uncovered this.

Then there’s the issue of financial support for Scotland Rugby League, which is run on the smell of an oily rag, where the RFL cut their funding back in 2013. At the Four Nations they made history with their shock draw with New Zealand. In December last year Wood said: “International rugby league owes them a debt of gratitude for turning up and playing strongly and achieiving what they did. So we’ll be doing our best we can to help them."

What that ‘help’ actually entails, nobody knows. But we do know Scotland can’t exist on good intentions. Steve McCormack is a great coach, but he’s not that good.

Then there’s the issue of financial support for Wales Rugby League, who have already made two staff redundant in anticipation of their funding cut at the end of 2017. The RFL is supposed to be the governing body for the sport across all of the UK, not just England.

Then there’s the issue of the bloated Super 8s structure, which packs in game after game in a mad dash for revenue. Problem is, fans are mostly voting with their feet and not turning up. It is a race to see which club can keep their players fit and on the field, not a race to Old Trafford.

And the Super 8s are hitting the clubs in the hip pocket as well, with Castleford losing money in 2015 and Wakefield losing money in 2016 to name just two.

There are some positives to the Super 8s structure, with the Million Pound game involving Salford and Hull KR delivering riveting entertainment and genuine tension, but it also has many problems. The thrilling Million Pound game, enjoyable grand final, tense Challenge Cup final and some entertaining late season contests were too few and far between.

I can go on.

The poor state of rugby league in Cumbria, the lack of Championship footy on TV screens, dwindling amateur participation, dubious Four Nations venue scheduling, sparce mainstream media coverage of rugby league, supporter trouble in venues, no players’ union, culling of the World Club Series, dilapidated stadiums etc etc etc. After a while you just become a broken record.

The RFL is right when it says it is not its duty to run individual clubs, and much of the financial problems at the likes of Bradford and York are the owners and management’s fault.

But it is the RFL’s duty to create an environment that helps clubs thrive and grow, create a competition where a club going to the wall is a rarity, not commonplace. It is its duty to properly vet and approve who takes over at a club. Going into administration three times in five years should set some pretty big alarm bells off.

There is some good news out there – the arrival of Toronto, the resurgence of Rochdale, rebuilding at Wakefield, Hull FC becoming a top contender – but at the moment it’s hard to find.

A lot of people I talk to rugby league, and I mean players, coaches, fellow journalists, supporters, officials and agents, are concerned about where the sport is headed. Some fans are turning off, including those who have followed the game their whole lives. Rugby league can’t afford to lose these people. Apathy is growing at an alarming rate.

There is a lack of transparency and accountability at the top. There is a desperate need for strong leadership going forward.

Nothing will change with a ‘everything is fine’ view. A lot of people in rugby league have their heads in the sand.

But the Bulls administration and then liquidation may be a turning point. Many are now speaking out and asking questions. It seems as though no lessons were learnt from the Crusaders debacle in 2011. Many involved in that episode must have strong feelings of déjà vu now when it comes to Bradford.

Wood and Ralph Rimmer yesterday tried to repair their bruised reputations at a Bradford-themed media conference yesterday for the select few. But there's no spinning away from the general malaise that is engulfing rugby league. They will surely face even pricklier questions if things continue on and off the field in 2017.

 

[adamkungl]

Pretty damning and hard to argue with a lot of that.

Start with fixing the absurd number of matches in a season and the bloated Super 8s structure and work your way from there.

 

[roughyedspud]

i agree with all of it except this..

Then there’s the issue of financial support for Scotland Rugby League, which is run on the smell of an oily rag, where the RFL cut their funding back in 2013. At the Four Nations they made history with their shock draw with New Zealand. In December last year Wood said: “International rugby league owes them a debt of gratitude for turning up and playing strongly and achieiving what they did. So we’ll be doing our best we can to help them."

What that ‘help’ actually entails, nobody knows. But we do know Scotland can’t exist on good intentions. Steve McCormack is a great coach, but he’s not that good.

Then there’s the issue of financial support for Wales Rugby League, who have already made two staff redundant in anticipation of their funding cut at the end of 2017. The RFL is supposed to be the governing body for the sport across all of the UK, not just England.

first of all that last bit...the RFL was the governing body for the whole of the UK,that was before wales,scotland & ireland had their own governing bodies! its not 50 years ago, comparing it to football, the FA (of england) is'nt not responsible for wales,scotland,northern ireland!

as for funding,as ive said many,many times,not getting funding from the RFL frees them up to getting funding and developing partnerships with the relevant sporting councils/bodies in their particular countries ie the welsh & scottish governments,sportWales & sportScotland..as well as the RLEF & RLIF.....its actually their job to support these nations..so lets use them properly

wales will be alright cos they have worked with the bodies ive mentioned above...but yeah i'll admit i feel we should have held scotlands hand alittle bit longer...

if the RFL wasn't run by dickheads then maybe we would have..

 

[Perth Red]

Any evidence for falling crowds and falling participation rates?

RL is a niche sport, always has been, always will be. It will never be rich, never be massive and never be national,at the top tier. It has a long history of hand to mouth existence, nothing much I can see has changed, people have been predicting its death since it began, and yet we kick off another new season in a few weeks.

Clubs have always mismanaged themselves, again nothing new there.

 

[Perth Red]

Annual report

http://media.therfl.co.uk/docs/RFL 2015 Annual Report.pdf

 

[adamkungl]

Any evidence for falling crowds and falling participation rates?

RL is a niche sport, always has been, always will be. It will never be rich, never be massive and never be national,at the top tier. It has a long history of hand to mouth existence, nothing much I can see has changed, people have been predicting its death since it began, and yet we kick off another new season in a few weeks.

Clubs have always mismanaged themselves, again nothing new there.

Why do you have this attitude for England but are insistent on Australian RL going national despite no indication of ever doing so (excepting a brief two years or so in the 90s)?

 

[Perth Red]

Because there isn't the money or demand in uk cities for rl like there is in Australia.

Let's take a look

Imagine if in uk you had the Perth sitauation:

Neutral club on the road games selling out a 21k modern stadium
A region growing Jnr base that has a school scholarship program, elite academy set up and a under 18's competing in the top level comp and developing first grade players
Rich corporate supporters
A supportive local government
A strong amateur league

Now imagine if say Birmingham, cardiff or London had these things then we would have hope that expansion in SL would be successful like we think expansion of nrl will one day

 

[Pommy]

Why do you have this attitude for England but are insistent on Australian RL going national despite no indication of ever doing so (excepting a brief two years or so in the 90s)?

I would say it's slightly different. Can we see a London side being viable? It seems Perth would be totally viable with the added bonus it would actually add value to the NRL with new time slots for TV.

I have no idea where your from but the Rugby codes in England are very very divided by geography and class which are hard to overcome.

 

[adamkungl]

I would say it's slightly different. Can we see a London side being viable? It seems Perth would be totally viable with the added bonus it would actually add value to the NRL with new time slots for TV.

I have no idea where your from but the Rugby codes in England are very very divided by geography and class which are hard to overcome.

We have a successful side in Melbourne which was about as anti-Rugby as anywhere could be.
We're all excited about a Toronto side, a city with overall no clue about any kind of Rugby.

I can't believe that in a city of 8 million odd people with a decent Rugby culture, a couple of hours down the road from the heartlands, that it is impossible to find 10,000 people willing to show up to a RL match every couple of weeks. It will take work, investment, and on-field SL success over years, yes, but the attitude seems to be 'it's impossible' while holding Australian (and bloody Canadian) cities to far higher standards and expectations.

Does no one else think it's crazy we're talking about Canadian and US expansion before London and Paris?

 

[Evil Homer]

We have a successful side in Melbourne which was about as anti-Rugby as anywhere could be.
We're all excited about a Toronto side, a city with overall no clue about any kind of Rugby.

I can't believe that in a city of 8 million odd people with a decent Rugby culture, a couple of hours down the road from the heartlands, that it is impossible to find 10,000 people willing to show up to a RL match every couple of weeks. It will take work, investment, and on-field SL success over years, yes, but the attitude seems to be 'it's impossible' while holding Australian (and bloody Canadian) cities to far higher standards and expectations.

Does no one else think it's crazy we're talking about Canadian and US expansion before London and Paris?

Melbourne was funded by News Corp. We don't have a News Corp in the UK who will do that.

TBH though I think it would probably be a lot easier to expand in somewhere that isn't familiar with rugby than the likes of London or Paris where there are so many barriers and preconceptions. I said before that the best way to gain credibility and expand in those type of places is probably for North Americans to become interested, because then people will start to see the sport as something worthwhile and relevant and not just a weird little regional pastime, which is pretty much how they see it now. I heard Eric Perez interviewed on BBC national radio the other day, it was only about 45 seconds, the interviewer clearly meant well but there were still one or two sarcastic statements and they still presented it as a kind of curiosity rather than something to be taken seriously. The fact that RL was even featured is a huge step forward but until that attitude changes then there's pretty much no hope in places like London and Paris.

 

[adamkungl]

So who were the 44,000 and 35,000 people who watched England play RL in London in 2015 and 2016? All northerners down for a day trip?
I'm not denying it's a fringe of a fringe sport, but in a city of that size you should be able to get a few thousand people to do basically anything.

Of course you don't have a News Corp (last thing we need is more involvement from them) but if we can attract an investor to launch a seemingly pie-in-the-sky club from Toronto then why not somewhere a bit closer to home?

 

[Evil Homer]

So who were the 44,000 and 35,000 people who watched England play RL in London in 2015 and 2016? All northerners down for a day trip?
I'm not denying it's a fringe of a fringe sport, but in a city of that size you should be able to get a few thousand people to do basically anything.

Of course you don't have a News Corp (last thing we need is more involvement from them) but if we can attract an investor to launch a seemingly pie-in-the-sky club from Toronto then why not somewhere a bit closer to home?

Big difference between getting people to show up for an international in a big stadium and club matches on a regular basis. The issue is that there's nobody in London who is willing and has/had the clout to do it. The people involved in PSG and London Broncos could've done better but they had no f**king idea what they were doing, and there is nobody to replace them. Even if there was, it would be much harder than somewhere neutral like Toronto IMO because again, people in London don't just not know what RL is, they actively see it as irrelevant. And they're right TBH, a lot of Super League clubs are in places that I've never heard of outside of RL and I don't even live that far away from most of them. And when you're talking about London which considers relatively cosmopolitan RL places like Hull to be decrepit hell-holes then it's just a very hard sell. Again, it's just to do with the demographics and class divides in the UK, it's just a very difficult market for a sport like RL even though it's closer and seemingly more logical. Perez says as much here: http://www.skysports.com/rugby-leag...more-rl-clubs-will-spring-up-in-north-america

Edit: listen to this if it's not geoblocked (skip to 2 hours 56): http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b088hwcf

Listen to the snooty attitude from the female presenter even though she's trying her best to sound interested, the male presenter doesn't say anything at all apart from making some dismissive joke and then they have the token RL guy that they brought in to make some stupid as f**k negative comment about something that has nothing to do with the topic. Pretty much sums up what RL is up against in London and the UK in general.

 

[jim_57]

I think generally there is a bit of a defeatist attitude in the UK when it comes to expansion. Places like Paris & Wales, there seems to be an ingrained attitude in most fans (definitely not all) that we have "tried that and it failed", so there is no point in ever trying again or even being open to the idea that if done differently next time it COULD succeed.

Take Paris for example was 20 years ago, who's to say with the right people in place it couldn't be a roaring success in today's environment?

Then there are RL clubs with small fan bases from cities/areas that "will never take to the game" i.e. London, Sheffield etc. Cut and Paste that line to Scotland & Ireland as well.

IMO the Wolfpack, Perez and Co. Have the potential to entirely change the way RL and potential expansion is percieved in the Northern Hemisphere. Let's not forget the Wolfpack virtually came from nowhere, an idea in somebody's head, if they can be proven to be a success than having a successful club in Paris, London, Cardiff, Edinburgh, Dublin, Istanbul, Berlin or Moscow suddenly doesn't seem so far-fetched to fans, media and perhaps most importantly other men like Eric Perez.

 

[Evil Homer]

I think generally there is a bit of a defeatist attitude in the UK when it comes to expansion. Places like Paris & Wales, there seems to be an ingrained attitude in most fans (definitely not all) that we have "tried that and it failed", so there is no point in ever trying again or even being open to the idea that if done differently next time it COULD succeed.

Take Paris for example was 20 years ago, who's to say with the right people in place it couldn't be a roaring success in today's environment?

Then there are RL clubs with small fan bases from cities/areas that "will never take to the game" i.e. London, Sheffield etc. Cut and Paste that line to Scotland & Ireland as well.

IMO the Wolfpack, Perez and Co. Have the potential to entirely change the way RL and potential expansion is percieved in the Northern Hemisphere. Let's not forget the Wolfpack virtually came from nowhere, an idea in somebody's head, if they can be proven to be a success than having a successful club in Paris, London, Cardiff, Edinburgh, Dublin, Istanbul, Berlin or Moscow suddenly doesn't seem so far-fetched to fans, media and perhaps most importantly other men like Eric Perez.

Like I said, the issue is that RL is actively derided in a lot of these places due to class issues, historical oppression and RU influence. It's not that it can never succeed, but it needs to succeed in other, more relevant places before it can get there. "Come and play in the Mushy Peas league with Widnes and Featherstone and Leigh" isn't going to work. The sport's image literally could not be much worse than it currently is in the UK and it will take an outside injection to change that.

 

[adamkungl]

Yeah good points. Kinda relates to what i've angled at elsewhere - how the RFL can go about pushing SL towards a more city focused lineup without alienating its core fanbase.

I think they should actively chase and support these kind (Toronto-esque) of expansion opportunities. Look for people who want to bring professional RL to London, Paris, Dublin, Glasgow, New York. Wolfpack will hopefully be the first of many

 

[jim_57]

Like I said, the issue is that RL is actively derided in a lot of these places due to class issues, historical oppression and RU influence. It's not that it can never succeed, but it needs to succeed in other, more relevant places before it can get there. "Come and play in the Mushy Peas league with Widnes and Featherstone and Leigh" isn't going to work. The sport's image literally could not be much worse than it currently is in the UK and it will take an outside injection to change that.

Well like I said, the Wolfpack have the potential to change the entire perception of the sport if they are a success and especially if Montreal etc can follow.

But even in markets where there is predetermined negative mindset there can be success stories, look at Melbourne Storm and Sydney Swans for example. It takes money and wading through some shit years, but it is possible if the right people are involved, finding the right people is the challenge.