Holden Cup team 2014

[isaiah]

Good start to the season with a win over the storm. Which players are the ones to watch as future NRL players? Liam Knight, Charlie Taylor?

 

[mave]

Tom Troboyovich(fullback) has been earmarked for ages.
Zach Nicholls played a few games last year at 17 years old.

Stigg is the one to watch for mine.

 

[Footy Mad]

Good start to the season with a win over the storm. Which players are the ones to watch as future NRL players? Liam Knight, Charlie Taylor?

Taylor is the main one heading for NRL. He has clubs chasing him as well as the Waratahs. He is an Australian Schoolboy Winger, NSW Schoolboy Rugby Winger but is so versatile he can play anywhere in the Backline and can play left and right side of the field, has blistering speed who is a great finisher with the ball, he is tough and strong. Would love to watch him in a better coached team.

Stigg is a good player, originally from Penrith, Manly have too many hookers at the moment, whether he stays.

Knight, not sure, has ability but don't know if he is football focussed.

 

[half_back]

Having played against manly in a trial and regular game I'd say your standout is the fullback Trbojevic. Especially given he is still eligible for Ball. I'd Expect to see him promoted to NSW Cup next year as that seems to be the pathway Manly use for their elite young talent as the did with Gutherson and Jake Trbojevic. Obviously Nichols has already been exposed to this level so I assume he is considered a strong possibility. Outside those there were no real standouts I saw, obviously Knight and Armstrong have been earmarked in the origin pathways program and Knight does look likely with a great physique although still plenty to work on. Other than that I think you gave us a certainty in Goodall who has been carving up with 9 tries in 6 games and plenty of wraps to make the step up. No doubt the team could use Jake Trbojevic and Clinton Gutherson as both are special talents. We gave away using early promotion to NSW Cup to develop a winning culture first. Guess we will see if it works.

 

[Footy Mad]

Having played against manly in a trial and regular game I'd say your standout is the fullback Trbojevic. Especially given he is still eligible for Ball. I'd Expect to see him promoted to NSW Cup next year as that seems to be the pathway Manly use for their elite young talent as the did with Gutherson and Jake Trbojevic. Obviously Nichols has already been exposed to this level so I assume he is considered a strong possibility. Outside those there were no real standouts I saw, obviously Knight and Armstrong have been earmarked in the origin pathways program and Knight does look likely with a great physique although still plenty to work on. Other than that I think you gave us a certainty in Goodall who has been carving up with 9 tries in 6 games and plenty of wraps to make the step up. No doubt the team could use Jake Trbojevic and Clinton Gutherson as both are special talents. We gave away using early promotion to NSW Cup to develop a winning culture first. Guess we will see if it works.

Taylor had a Blinder against the Cowboys, made 200 meters plus with some long runs was named Man of the Match, played left center, he will definitely be playing 1st grade but maybe not for Manly. The players in the 20s that will go on to 1st grade are Tom Trbojevic ( but only young still ), Liam Knight, Charlie Taylor and Leonati Feiloakitua. I wouldn't be raving about being promoted to the NSW Cup Team as they are going shocking. Your good players should be promoted automatically into 1st grade under the top head coach. Origin pathways means nothing as its a Development Programme only. Selectors will pick the Origin team properly 2 weeks before the game, by watching teams play.

 

[half_back]

Taylor had a Blinder against the Cowboys, made 200 meters plus with some long runs was named Man of the Match, played left center, he will definitely be playing 1st grade but maybe not for Manly. The players in the 20s that will go on to 1st grade are Tom Trbojevic ( but only young still ), Liam Knight, Charlie Taylor and Leonati Feiloakitua. I wouldn't be raving about being promoted to the NSW Cup Team as they are going shocking. Your good players should be promoted automatically into 1st grade under the top head coach. Origin pathways means nothing as its a Development Programme only. Selectors will pick the Origin team properly 2 weeks before the game, by watching teams play.

Again I qualify by saying my observations are obviously limited to the 2 parra games so can't comment on the others. Although I think you have missed the point with promotion to NSW cup. It obviously has nothing to do with the collective strength of the Manly team rather the chance to test those they see as possible NRL players in open age competition. Where it is more physical and all NRL teams funnel their top 25 not playing NRL. Hence why Gutherson and Jake Trbojevic are playing there in a poor team rather than play them in an age base competition like NYC.

Regarding origin pathways it reflects those who have played or are projected to play origin at age or open level, so while it is a development program it reflects the best young talent in the state. Obviously the likes of Gutherson, Trbojevic x 2 and knight have already played SOO at age level hence are in the squad while others considered of potential like Armstrong there also. For parra the likes of Kelepi Tanganoa, Tepai Moeroa etc. again have played origin football at age level and are in these squads. So it does serve as a guide to the elite boys and therefore those more likely to progress to grade.

Regarding the number you have selected for grade I think that may be unrealistic. On average there are 4 players from any NYC age group who make the next step. Given the current strength of the Manly side I think there would be lucky to be 1 or 2. Obviously Gutherson and Trbojevic are givens I didn't see Feiloakitua play although from our games as already mentioned knight has qualities there but is still a long way off he defended reasonably well and was moved from left edge to right edge to try and fix their leaking defence But he turned over the ball in tackles several times. Taylor played on the right at centre and 6 tries (4 to Matterson and 2 to Davis his opposite) when through that side so I'd say Taylor is a very outside chance at best from what I have seen. While young Trbojevic was your best on both occasions.

Anyway good luck to your team. Hope the boys can turn things around and have a good season. Always really enjoy watching the young blokes play and make their way to grade looking forward to seeing the likes of Trbojevic and Gutherson at some stage this year.

 

[Harold Bishop]

Taylor had a Blinder against the Cowboys, made 200 meters plus with some long runs was named Man of the Match, played left center, he will definitely be playing 1st grade but maybe not for Manly. The players in the 20s that will go on to 1st grade are Tom Trbojevic ( but only young still ), Liam Knight, Charlie Taylor and Leonati Feiloakitua. I wouldn't be raving about being promoted to the NSW Cup Team as they are going shocking. Your good players should be promoted automatically into 1st grade under the top head coach. Origin pathways means nothing as its a Development Programme only. Selectors will pick the Origin team properly 2 weeks before the game, by watching teams play.

Spot on about the standouts. No wraps on the hooker Stigg? Was a smart player from what I've seen.
You seem to know a bit about Charlie T, is he not rated by Manly? Or just close to signing with another club?

 

[Footy Mad]

Again I qualify by saying my observations are obviously limited to the 2 parra games so can't comment on the others. Although I think you have missed the point with promotion to NSW cup. It obviously has nothing to do with the collective strength of the Manly team rather the chance to test those they see as possible NRL players in open age competition. Where it is more physical and all NRL teams funnel their top 25 not playing NRL. Hence why Gutherson and Jake Trbojevic are playing there in a poor team rather than play them in an age base competition like NYC.

Regarding origin pathways it reflects those who have played or are projected to play origin at age or open level, so while it is a development program it reflects the best young talent in the state. Obviously the likes of Gutherson, Trbojevic x 2 and knight have already played SOO at age level hence are in the squad while others considered of potential like Armstrong there also. For parra the likes of Kelepi Tanganoa, Tepai Moeroa etc. again have played origin football at age level and are in these squads. So it does serve as a guide to the elite boys and therefore those more likely to progress to grade.

Regarding the number you have selected for grade I think that may be unrealistic. On average there are 4 players from any NYC age group who make the next step. Given the current strength of the Manly side I think there would be lucky to be 1 or 2. Obviously Gutherson and Trbojevic are givens I didn't see Feiloakitua play although from our games as already mentioned knight has qualities there but is still a long way off he defended reasonably well and was moved from left edge to right edge to try and fix their leaking defence But he turned over the ball in tackles several times. Taylor played on the right at centre and 6 tries (4 to Matterson and 2 to Davis his opposite) when through that side so I'd say Taylor is a very outside chance at best from what I have seen. While young Trbojevic was your best on both occasions.

Anyway good luck to your team. Hope the boys can turn things around and have a good season. Always really enjoy watching the young blokes play and make their way to grade looking forward to seeing the likes of Trbojevic and Gutherson at some stage this year.

Like you, I love watching the young kids go around but as I watched those games and I videoed them as well, a correction needs to be made with Taylor, Davis did not play on Taylors side as he was on the opposite as well as Matterson. Davis was playing fullback and got no tries past Taylor. Actually Taylor scored in the first trial but the Ref messed it up, if it was replayed you would have seen the mistake. Taylor also stopped Fabian from scoring as well in both games and he hasn't scored yet on Taylors side. The team is not well coached and there is very limited opportunities with the ball coming out during games to the backs, which must be frustrating. They seem to play only in the middle. Taylor played on the Wing with Davis in the Australian Schoolboys last year ( best of friends as well I hear ) and Taylor I was told had a blinder as he played in the right conditions, strong team, good key players and well coached and with plenty of fast ball getting out to him and scoring lots of tries. He is versatile which is a bonus and can play anywhere in the backline on either side of the field. Hearing he won't be staying at Manly for long which is a good move. I don't rate Armstrong at all, I have seen too many mistakes, drop balls and missed tackles especially against the Roosters where he was dropped because of it.

 

[Footy Mad]

Spot on about the standouts. No wraps on the hooker Stigg? Was a smart player from what I've seen.
You seem to know a bit about Charlie T, is he not rated by Manly? Or just close to signing with another club?

Known him from his school last year ( St Augustine College ) where he was a star NSW Rugby player as well as representing in Australian Schoolboys League plus was the top sportsman there. Manly don't look after their Juniors, its well known and in the first grade the only local Junior they have is Watmough. Hearing rumors he will be looking for a new club at the end of this season and wants out next year. He doesn't get looked after there and wants to play in a strong side.

 

[Patorick]

Known him from his school last year ( St Augustine College ) where he was a star NSW Rugby player as well as representing in Australian Schoolboys League plus was the top sportsman there. Manly don't look after their Juniors, its well known and in the first grade the only local Junior they have is Watmough. Hearing rumors he will be looking for a new club at the end of this season and wants out next year. He doesn't get looked after there and wants to play in a strong side.

Jason King?

 

[Footy Mad]

Jason King?

Yes true but he will gone shortly and then only Watmough. I wonder how many Local Juniors each NRL team have playing in 1st grade ? That would be interesting to know and which team has the most ?

 

[Footy Mad]

Hearing strong rumours Manly flyer and Australian Schoolboy Taylor from Manly 20s is looking for a new club next season. He wants out and will be seeking a release at the end of the season. Hearing he is Not being looked after at the club and wants to be playing in a stronger side. Don't blame him, he is being wasted there and the 20s will be getting their 2nd wooden spoon again this season.

 

[Footy Mad]

Hearing strong rumours Manly flyer and Australian Schoolboy Taylor from Manly 20s is looking for a new club next season. He wants out and will be seeking a release at the end of the season. Hearing he is Not being looked after at the club and wants to be playing in a stronger side. Don't blame him, he is being wasted there and the 20s will be getting their 2nd wooden spoon again this season.

Another local junior at Manly who could also be leaving is Clinton Gutherson wants to play fullback and will be waiting a while at Manly for that.

 

[junior fan]

Another local junior at Manly who could also be leaving is Clinton Gutherson wants to play fullback and will be waiting a while at Manly for that.

Gutherson and both Trbojevic's would be the only loses. the rest can go, there is a reason they are running second last. Stigg has some qualities as does Knight but major doubts on them both.

 

[Footy Mad]

The reason they are coming second last is poor coaching and a poor game plan and some players should be cut from the team as well. Have you watched their games ?? Compare it to Parramatta's, Souths, Roosters etc. I think every team that verse Manly 20s knows exactly what to do, the Canberra 20s Coach summed it up well on TV. We shut the middle up. Not much ball gets out wide doesn't help especially if your an outside back. If young Tom T was playing on the wing or centre he would not be in the spotlight like how he is. Lucky he is playing fullback. Gutherson is overrated and his defence is a bit iffy a fringe 1st grader at best. Tom T will be the next fullback and C Taylor the next winger. But saying that Manly have a habit of buying players from other clubs anyway rather than focus on their Juniors.

 

[junior fan]

The reason they are coming second last is poor coaching and a poor game plan and some players should be cut from the team as well. Have you watched their games ?? Compare it to Parramatta's, Souths, Roosters etc. I think every team that verse Manly 20s knows exactly what to do, the Canberra 20s Coach summed it up well on TV. We shut the middle up. Not much ball gets out wide doesn't help especially if your an outside back. If young Tom T was playing on the wing or centre he would not be in the spotlight like how he is. Lucky he is playing fullback. Gutherson is overrated and his defence is a bit iffy a fringe 1st grader at best. Tom T will be the next fullback and C Taylor the next winger. But saying that Manly have a habit of buying players from other clubs anyway rather than focus on their Juniors.

I wouldn't be blaming the coach, that's an easy cop out. All teams have players in NYC who aren't up to it. It's the nature of NYC and why the shorelines a so large. With a small salary cap you are going to have potential future first graders and those filling up the numbers. It is the same with Parra, roosters and Souths. As with the "we shut up the middle" that is the game plan with every NRL and NYC team not just those who play Manlys NYC. Stop the go forward, no quality ball out wide and win the match not rocket science. I've seen a few Manly NYC games.

Gutherson over rated? The kid played well in 20s origin the other week (as with Trbojevic) as he has when he has played grade. Take him over anyone in the current NYC team. Obviously why he isn't still playing there cause he gone past NYC level.

Not much on Taylor. Too small. Plays with heart no doubt but not enough there to suggest he moves past NYC. A few defensive issues also. Googled a bit found a bit on rugby forum that seems to agree defensive issues and struggles with hands, although in fairness haven't seen too much to suggest handling problems in league.

 

[Footy Mad]

Don't blame the coach ??? I am a manly fan and want to watch good footy with the other grades as well but You know shit all. You don't watch too many games obviously. The game plan is shit, hardly any ball gets out. Compared to all the others . The other teams watch the videos of manly and just focus on smashing the middle as they know manly don't pass and then Manly's forwards are so stuffed as they are doing all the work and they are shit in the second half. Thats why the opposition teams always come back and win. Mate Your joking aren't you... You know nothing and really can't be bothered dealing with idiots but shows you how much you know... Taylor played in NSW Cup the other week the youngest in the team, scored a great try and set up another try, I was told he had no prior training with the cup team beforehand but was told to play on the day. His defensive play was spot on playing with guys and against guys who have 1st grade experience and are much older and some huge Polynesian players as well to defend. Put Taylor up against Gutho anytime and see who comes out on top with any test. Small piss off ! He is over 6ft and weighs close to 93 kilos and is only still 18. He is solid, tough as and athletic / fast. Made Australian schoolboys last year, was the best player in NSWCIS team remarkable coming from a winger and just coming back from a broken jaw. NSW twice for rugby and was a National sprint champion. Australian u20s rugby I hear are after him including the Waratahs and other clubs. He is a absolute flyer in attack and as a specialised winger he can also play anywhere from outside backs, left and right side of field to back row if needed. Not too many players can match that. He needs to be playing in a strong team wasted here. My mail is he will be taking the Wolfmans spot on the wing in 1sts. I hope I get to see you out there playing mate, or maybe playing chess ?

 

[mal12]

Don't blame the coach ??? I am a manly fan and want to watch good footy with the other grades as well but You know shit all. You don't watch too many games obviously. The game plan is shit, hardly any ball gets out. Compared to all the others . The other teams watch the videos of manly and just focus on smashing the middle as they know manly don't pass and then Manly's forwards are so stuffed as they are doing all the work and they are shit in the second half. Thats why the opposition teams always come back and win. Mate Your joking aren't you... You know nothing and really can't be bothered dealing with idiots but shows you how much you know... Taylor played in NSW Cup the other week the youngest in the team, scored a great try and set up another try, I was told he had no prior training with the cup team beforehand but was told to play on the day. His defensive play was spot on playing with guys and against guys who have 1st grade experience and are much older and some huge Polynesian players as well to defend. Put Taylor up against Gutho anytime and see who comes out on top with any test. Small piss off ! He is over 6ft and weighs close to 93 kilos and is only still 18. He is solid, tough as and athletic / fast. Made Australian schoolboys last year, was the best player in NSWCIS team remarkable coming from a winger and just coming back from a broken jaw. NSW twice for rugby and was a National sprint champion. Australian u20s rugby I hear are after him including the Waratahs and other clubs. He is a absolute flyer in attack and as a specialised winger he can also play anywhere from outside backs, left and right side of field to back row if needed. Not too many players can match that. He needs to be playing in a strong team wasted here. My mail is he will be taking the Wolfmans spot on the wing in 1sts. I hope I get to see you out there playing mate, or maybe playing chess ?

I have also watched these players and I think your bias to c Taylor is a bit over the top. His play has definitely improved in the last year or so and he has good leg drive for a winger but defensively in the centres he needs to learn a lot more.Yes he came in as a replacement in the aus schoolboys but this doesn't mean you will have an nrl future.
All I read from your post is that manly 20s are shit blaming everything on the halves and forwards and coach but I guarantee if you put jake t and gutho back into this team they are much more competitive.
Last point to add compare Taylor to the other wingers and centres in 20s comp and he is way off but good luck to him and I hope he does keep improving and maybe he might get a wing spot after gutho

 

[Footy Mad]

Jake and Gutho played last year in the 20s and they still got the wooden spoon and another one is happening again this year. Gutho is not a winger he is a fullback only. He has no explosive speed like Taylor for a start and is not good in defence especially on the wing. Its a specialised position, you can't play anyone there. Ask Andrew Johns at manly about it..he always talks about players playing on the wing. Its the most difficult position on the field to play. Taylor has been told he will be the next winger there. Unfortunately I can't see him being with the club next season. He wants out. I here he has a few clubs chasing him at the moment. Its certainly doesn't help anyones footy being thrashed week after week. He is up there with the other wingers and has the experience and proven himself at the top level reads the game well and has the speed and a great finisher and will only improve more but unfortunately he is not in a strong side, compared to the other players in teams in the comp whose clubs are in the top 8. and are coached well. Anyone looks good and plays well If your in a strong side. Maybe he and Gutho might both end up in Canberra as I am hearing Ricky has been having meetings with both boys and good luck to them.

 

[mal12]

Good luck will be needed if they listen to ricky