It's NOT a mess

Discussion in 'St George Illawarra Dragons' started by Crush, May 17, 2017.

  1. Crush

    Crush Juniors

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    So unlike what some posters believe, I think the dragons roster going forward is anything but a mess.
    Next year we are looking at a team with not only the best forward pack in the comp but guided around by a proper halves pairing in widdop and hunt.
    Losing Packer and Dugan is a loss but hardly a mess. As another poster pointed out every club loses players. Its the nature of the game.
    This year we look good. Next year with the addition of Hunt and the omission of Mccrone we look great.
    It's far from a mess.....
     
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  2. j0nesy

    j0nesy Juniors

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    Agree, although we do need either Dufty or Field to step up. More importantly we need McGregor to man up and give them a decent go.
     
  3. muzby

    muzby Village Idiot Staff Member

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    It's a mess.
     
  4. Objective View

    Objective View Juniors

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    Sorry but you're an apologetic idiot. We're losing two of our best and signing the likes of Hunt is an absolute rarity for the Dragons. Overwhelmingly, we never replace like for like - Bmoz/Nabuli is the standard type of transaction for us. And losing players like Bird is all too common.

    Year after year, we seem to operate at a net loss in talent.

    Straight Shooter
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2017
  5. Ace-STi

    Ace-STi Juniors

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    I'm ok losing Bmoz in hindsight, he has suffered a lot last 2 years with injury and based on What Merrin is dishing up, would you pay him 800k now?
     
  6. Crush

    Crush Juniors

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    Apologetic Idiot!
    Love it! One of your best insults OV.
    Keep em coming!
     
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  7. hewi

    hewi Juniors

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    Dugan for $1 million no way. Hunt for $1 million I think will prove a great buy you will never win the comp without a great half. Packer , a shame however we still have Vaughan, maybe we can find another Vaughan , if not let's see if Kerr steps up. I think he will. So, I agree above it's not a mess.
     
  8. Crush

    Crush Juniors

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    Are you a banker by chance OV?
    "Standard type of transaction"
    "Operate at a net loss"
    We are talking about footy aren't we?
    Wanker....
     
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  9. Ace-STi

    Ace-STi Juniors

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    Correct we will have one of the most lethal halves pairings and packs next year! Exciting times
     
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  10. Dorothy the Winowhore

    Dorothy the Winowhore Juniors

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    OV.....always BMOZ for Nabuli Transactions? Tell me, who did we down grade from when we signed Vaughan?
     
  11. Saint_JimmyG

    Saint_JimmyG Juniors

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    Was Hornby a "great" halfback?
     
  12. Saint_JimmyG

    Saint_JimmyG Juniors

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    No, it's not a "mess" but rather a complete fcuk up from rank amateurs in charge of so-called 'retention',
     
  13. Dragonslayer

    Dragonslayer Juniors

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    Firstly, it isn't a mess.
    Disappionting yes but hardly a mess.
    By whats been reported tonight the cap looks like being set at 9 1m and for 26 players (not 30) and a further 900k for players signed over the 26.
    I think there will be plenty of blood letting amongst several clubs who had budgeted for more.
    Priorities now must be Lafai and Mann (i have feeling Penrith will be chasing Mann now that it looks like TMM is going to the Warriors).
    NAS is worth having a big play for, however, IMO, we wont chase a fullback.
    Our roster looks pretty settled unlike a few other clubs so in that regard Milkward gas done well. The acquisions of Vaughan and McInnes this year and Hunt next year puts us in a good place.
    Based on what we have layed out for Hunt and Widdop, extensions to JDB, Leilua and Friz and what we invested into Sims and Vaughan plus securing our juniors, all the way down to a few 17 year olds, the offers made to Rusty and Dugan were fair given our cap space and the players we want to retain. And we still need to upgrade Lafai, Mann, Milne plus Mcinnes needs an extension upgrade ASAP as well ( only signed until 2018).
    The only criticism i can lay at Millward is his mouth. He needs to shut up about who he thinks should play where and just simply update on the progress of recruiting.
    A mess no, however, the perception of more urgency would be more appreciated IMO.
     
  14. Old Timer

    Old Timer Bench

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    Love it how you try to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
    The loss of Dugan and Packer is monumental and will set us back 3 years.
    It clearly shows that recruitment had no foresight to get their signatures early i.e. well before their existing contracts ran out.
    Delaying their contracts until after the announcement of Hunt was always going to spell disaster and should never have happened.
    Winning 6 out of 7 at the start of the season was the icing on the cake for their managers to go hard and the subsequent loss of games without Dugan reinforced it.
    Good recruitment would have been to recognise their worth and get their contract extensions done straight after last years debacle.
    The big announcement re the signings of Dufty, Leilua and Field the joy amongst the fans has led to exactly what?
    Very little or no game time in 1sts for them despite obvious opportunities presenting themselves.
    Then to top that off the loss of Dugan and Packer, no word on Milne or Mann who continue to be dicked around.
    The NRL is completely f**ked and we are even more so.
     
  15. possm

    possm First Grade

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    Crush,
    You couldn't be more wrong. The mess is not the actual loss of Packer and Dugan, that loss is the result of the mess. Two of our key first graders, the ones we put most effort into over the past few years are gone. There is no doubt in anyone's mind that unless we replace these two players with a top line experienced first grade fullback and a hard nosed prop, we will be a shadow of the team we could have been next year.

    You know better than to compare this years team to next years team with the inclusion of Hunt. The comparison should always have been next years team - which includes Hunt - with Dugan and Packer compared with next years team - with Hunt but without Dugan and Packer.

    The only way Millward can correct the mistakes he has made, is to show he has learned a very important but costly lesson in recruitment management; target the key first graders first and then move down the list retaining and recruiting according to the needs of the squad. Millward now has to replace these two players with like for like or better players.

    If Millward can land Hayne, this would be an upgrade on Dugan and within the cap space found by the loss of Dugan and Packer. This would be a like for better scenario. Then he needs to recruit a hard nosed prop equal to the standing of Packer.


    It is a mess and the mess could have been avoided by doing nothing other than signing the key first graders first. If at the time he could not get Dugan than withdraw the offer and recruit another. I have no doubt Millward could have signed Packer last November.

    So why didn't Millward sign Dugan and Packer in the period November 2016 to January 2017. I think you will find the answer is, because he locked in his idea that Field would be fullback and one of his young forwards Kerr/Lawrie/Sele would be the replacement prop. Long term solution at a very economical price.

    The only problem with this is we would not have the same forward punch in 2018 and these young guns are not first grade tested and so may not be ready. It means we very well might have to return to the rebuilding phase for a couple more years.

    It is a mess, a Millward mess and it could have easily been avoided.
     
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  16. Divine

    Divine Bench

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    It's not a mess . Just my opinion
     
  17. possm

    possm First Grade

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    It's OK, I respect your opinion. Would be great to know your reasons for coming to this conclusion though however, it's not really necessary. We can just agree to disagree.
     
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  18. BringTheNoise

    BringTheNoise Juniors

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    I'll be interested to see if our master coach has the ability to re-structure our attack from the "power game" which largely revolved around Dugan's ability to start our sets of 6 and the one-two punch of Vaughan and Packer.

    Packer is averaging close to 50 minutes a game, Sims is around 30 mins so it's a big step up if he's the man to fill Packer's shoes.

    God I hope Ben Hunt turns out to be the Holy Grail that this forum seems to think he is.
     
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  19. Coffs dragon

    Coffs dragon Juniors

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    It's not a mess but more a very untidy situation caused by a player Agent that has screwed and played a club & it's recruitment management because they procrastinated. Timing is everything and because this stupid Dugan renegotiation is entering 6 months....time is money and up go prices & demand. Now comes the spin & excuses.
     
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  20. JohnnoMcJohnno

    JohnnoMcJohnno Juniors

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    Our side is not a mess. Next year we should end up with a better halves combo, we will still have a good forward pack, and maybe, just maybe we will have a fullback who can pass. For the first time in years we have had a good start to the season so Mary is doing something right.

    Any residual mess is entirely from the NRL, the player managers and because of uncertainty with what the new salary cap will be. I take issue with the idea that somehow we could have signed Packer or Duges at a bargain price. Lets say Packer was offered $400k a season. The first thing he does is consult his manager who tells him he can get him $500k from another club, or $600k if he makes the NZ side. It is a nonsense to think we can snap up big game players cheaply, because everyone knows the cap is going up, especially the managers, who are happy to prey on player greed. Players hang out hoping for a better deal -sometimes they're successful like Packer and Merrin, sometimes not like Rein and Benji.

    Any mess is entirely the fault of the NRL. I think our club has done a reasonably good job of negotiating around the mess.
     
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