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Player Managers

hindmarsh4pm

Juniors
Messages
1,913
Vultures. You only have to see or hear the way they treat many good juniors to see what kind of scum 90% of them are. The worst thing is there are more and more of them, especially targetting the 15 or 16 year old kids, every year. And what's worse is the new crop are possibly even dodgier than the old ones.

Most managers sign up kids at about 16, or even younger, and only show any interest in them when the money starts coming in. Basically they sign them up and ignore them until they get to the age/ability where NRL clubs are lining up. Then they show up with their hands out. I've seen several cases where a kid has been signed at 15 or 16 because he's shown promise, then the kid has been injured or gone off the boil a bit and the manager is nowhere to be found. Sometimes those same kids find their feet again and the NRL clubs start circling. Suddenly the manager is back. And there are even worse examples of the dodginess of managers than that believe me.
At such a young age, the kids' parents must get involved to and see what is best for their kid at the time. Most managers promise alot, some deliver and some don't, they promise the kid at 14 or 15 a career in 1st grade, and their parents put their trust in the manager.

An example is Wayne Beavis-Jarryd Hayne, beavis signed him up when he was i think 14 or 15, and has taken him to the top, getting him the best deals possible, this is promising and living up to what was said.

Urban eel, you make a great point, it is short and sweet and what is also a major problem these days with managers, it is the ethics and morals. Some managers just take players for a ride, and only take the money, some though do genuinely help out their players when they are after certain things.
 
Messages
14,139
At such a young age, the kids' parents must get involved to and see what is best for their kid at the time. Most managers promise alot, some deliver and some don't, they promise the kid at 14 or 15 a career in 1st grade, and their parents put their trust in the manager.
The problem is the parents aren't in a much better position to deal with managers as the kids are. Most are so deperate for their kids to make it they sign with the first bloke who comes along and makes outrageous promises. Managers are very good at manipulating people and there aren't many parents out there who have enough nouse to look beyond the bullsh*t and do the best thing for their kids.
 

davi

Juniors
Messages
1,933
Gorden Tallis slams players mangers as having too much power in the NRL.


Gorden Tallis’ Set of Six: Player managers running the NRL

Gorden Tallis, The Sunday Mail (Qld)
April 8, 2017 7:23pm

"THE problem of player managers in the NRL, Cooper Cronk’s future, a changing of the guard for Queensland and more.

1 PLAYER managers are running the NRL. It has never been more evident than with what has gone on with the Tigers.

After reportedly re-signing Luke Brooks, Wests have now lost fellow half Mitchell Moses after he signed elsewhere for a lot less money than what the Tigers were offering. It proves they were never staying.

It just makes the club look bad. A million dollars is also about 40 per cent too much for those players. They’re not competition winners.

Some have played Origin but haven’t dominated. It’s not their fault, it’s their managers.

This is a lesson for every club on how a player manager has put too much pressure on players who aren’t performing. As a game we’ve all been part of it to the point where they were named the ‘’big four’’. It’s a bit too much.


2 WHEN it comes to player movement, it’s important to remember that every player negotiates, but it’s about how they handle those negotiations and let their managers handle them that matters.

As a player, you’re the one paying your manager, you’re his boss. The “big four” at the Tigers, they are good fellas.

But the way they’ve been painted and the way their manager has tarnished their brand is ridiculous. Sadly, they’ve let it happen by not speaking out against it all."

http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport...l/news-story/1a49aa90370a347479db40d29c02e147
 
Messages
13,973
Like to think the nrl can put conditions in the next Rlpa eba that limits the player agents role in the clubs.

You only wind up with player managers having any "role" in a club when that club's management let it happen (e.g. Wests Tigers). The Tigers put themselves in that position by allowing 4 of their highest profile players, all of whom have the same manager, coming off contract at the same time. I can't say I've heard of any other player manager having a "role" in a club. AS such that is for the clubs and its respective directors to deal with.

As to "player managers" and certain conditions being in the CBA (i.e. collective bargaining agreement) if the player's don't agree to it, it won't matter what the NRL want.
 

davi

Juniors
Messages
1,933
Ivan Cleary was asked was it difficult dealing with four players coming off contract with the same manager on Triple M. He said 'Yes' but didn't elaborate any more on it then that.
 

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,955
You only wind up with player managers having any "role" in a club when that club's management let it happen (e.g. Wests Tigers). The Tigers put themselves in that position by allowing 4 of their highest profile players, all of whom have the same manager, coming off contract at the same time. I can't say I've heard of any other player manager having a "role" in a club. AS such that is for the clubs and its respective directors to deal with.

As to "player managers" and certain conditions being in the CBA (i.e. collective bargaining agreement) if the player's don't agree to it, it won't matter what the NRL want.

Yep.. they got themselves into this mess.
By now everyone's heard that Politis won't have a bar of Moses
 

super_coach

First Grade
Messages
5,061
These guys are happy to tell the world that their client is no1, but in fact they are the ones who control their client. You can not tell me these so called agents are not getting kick backs from clubs to convince their clients to sign on the dotted line. They are leeches by trade and as someone said, well below car salesmen and realestate agent when it comes to scruples
 

davi

Juniors
Messages
1,933
Interesting article on some of the concerns from the NRL of players managers. It is two weeks old, but its a good article just in case anyone missed it.

"The NRL will inevitably move to ban agents from simultaneously representing both players and coaches.

Player manager Isaac Moses' representation of four key Wests Tigers players – captain Aaron Woods, fullback James Tedesco and halves Luke Brooks and Mitchell Moses – has exposed the power of one agent over a club.


Moses also represents two coaches, Andrew Webster and Todd Payten, who were favoured by the four players to replace the sacked Jason Taylor.

One reason why Wests Tigers board is keen to move quickly to secure the out-of-work Ivan Cleary is to deny an agent further influence over a club that has sacked three coaches in five years.


Should the NRL insist coaches be represented separately from players, conflict of interest situations will still arise.

Agent George Mimis acts for both Bulldogs coach Des Hasler and Cleary.


Hasler's future is already being discussed by a Canterbury board reacting to the media's relentless need to sack a coach.

Timing probably won't allow it but should Hasler be sacked, Mimis is in a position to negotiate deals where the Bulldogs hire client Cleary and Wests Tigers sign Hasler, collecting a lucrative commission on both.


The NRL's action against player managers will be formalised when the current investigation into the role of agents in Parramatta's salary cap cheating is completed.

There is growing chatter some of the game's leading player managers will be banned for periods between six months and three years.


The NRL action will begin with it seeking greater influence on the Agent Accreditation Committee where it currently has only one of seven seats.

Sanctions may include penalties against agents filing the paperwork for banned colleagues belonging to the same management combine, a practice that undermined past suspensions .


Wests Tigers have only themselves to blame for all four players coming off contract at the same time.

However, the club has no control over who represents a player, unless they take the action Roosters' boss, Nick Politis, did against Moses recently.

Two weeks ago, the Roosters released centre Dale Copley to the Titans. Copley was the last client Moses had at the club. Politis has been a rare club chairman strong enough to refuse to deal with a player manager.

Moses also acts for more than half the Storm's pack of starting forwards, as well as Parramatta captain Tim Mannah.

Mimis acted for Anthony Watmough, whose third party deal with the Eels initiated the investigation into the salary cap breaches at Parramatta, leading to NRL de-registering five officials.

Moses and Mimis have been previously banished for six months by the NRL for their role in the Storm's 2010 salary cap breaches.

Of the 100 or so accredited agents, a handful have a disproportionate share of the elite players, leading to constant conflicts of interests.

Should the Agent Accreditation Committee banish most of the leading agents, players must exercise a role in maintaining the integrity of the new cadre of agents coming into the game.

NRL club officials believe that some senior players are incentivised to promote young players to the agent acting for the senior player. That is, if the senior player pushes two young signings to the agent, the commission of approximately 5 per cent to 7 per cent on the senior player's contract is waived for two years.

To overcome this, an empowered Agent Accreditation Committee may move to limit the number of players per agent per club.

There is widespread feeling agents are not delivering care and service for the $7 million a year they take out of the game, equivalent to a 17th team in terms of player costs.

Wests Tigers Tim Simona was recently sacked for breaching NRL gambling rules. His problem was too much spare time to gamble with insufficient cash. Surely the club, or his manager, Moses, could have solved both problems simultaneously by securing him a supervised part-time job.

But it's the escalation in the number of coaches represented by agents that has the NRL currently worried. It has supercharged the conflicts of interest, exposed by the sacking of Taylor.

An agent has an interest in his coach having a long and successful career because, 1. the agent receives a percentage of the coach's salary over a longer period than the average player, 2. The coach provides access to key areas, such as the dressing room and 3. The agent can advise a player to join the club coached by his client, further cementing their relationship.

Only one NRL accredited player manager acts only for coaches and no players – John Fordham who represents both Melbourne Storm coach Craig Bellamy and Canberra's Ricky Stuart.

Both are likely to finish their careers at their current clubs."

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...sent-players-and-coaches-20170329-gv92sk.html
 

T-Boon

Coach
Messages
15,310
It is beyond me that coaches need agents. We need a more intelligent calibre of coach.
 

muzby

Village Idiot
Staff member
Messages
45,712
I dislike them so much, I refuse to even comment on this thread.

Instead, here's a cupcake:


Vanilla.jpg
 

Nice Beaver

First Grade
Messages
5,920
Well if Gordon Tallis has pulled a crayon out of the pencil case, we should all now pay attention.

This shit is NOW serious.
 

RazorRam0n

Juniors
Messages
2,027
players deserve to get paid the most they can out of their short professional careers...

they're not going to get the best deal possible by negotiating themselves. corey parker already confirmed this by semi whinging that he got screwed over after he retired.

the reality is with a salary cap system, player movement is inevitable but still not accepted as a norm.

the rest of the world is already 10 years ahead with modern professionalism.
 

Stormwarrior82

Juniors
Messages
1,036
You only wind up with player managers having any "role" in a club when that club's management let it happen (e.g. Wests Tigers). The Tigers put themselves in that position by allowing 4 of their highest profile players, all of whom have the same manager, coming off contract at the same time. I can't say I've heard of any other player manager having a "role" in a club. AS such that is for the clubs and its respective directors to deal with.

As to "player managers" and certain conditions being in the CBA (i.e. collective bargaining agreement) if the player's don't agree to it, it won't matter what the NRL want.

I agree with some of what you say but don't be so nieve that this is the first time players managers have held clubs to ransom. Player managers every year use other clubs/leak info to push up player/s values and if the player/s is/are big enough could potentially have a "ROLE" in the clubs future. Yes the tigers management seem to have stuffed up but it could be a blessing in disguise and actually help them in the future.
 

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