Robbie Farah

[doyen]

The whole hooking debate has been going on for the best part of 18 months to 2 years and we keep going over the same ground. However, I guess there is cause for re-examination given the Dragons recent 'success'. Those who are signing the praises of McInnes after the Dragons' recent performances are parochial in their outlook and after often those South Sydney fans who blame Michael Maguire for everything wrong at the club. I've watched most of the Dragons games this season and I can tell you that very little of their success can be attributed to the performances of McInnes. If you watch the Dragons most of their wins have come on the back of a) good defence and resilience, b) high completion rates and c) the last tackle options and overall form of Gareth Widdop. The Dragons are more of a grafting sort of team who play a simple brand of attacking of attacking football that is aimed at wearing down the opposition rather than ripping them apart; they lack an Anthony Milford or a Cody Walker type of player who can create something out of nothing. This has brought them a lot of success because such a style enables them to get to their kick and ultimately complete their sets. I know it sounds cynical by I feel that a lot of teams beat themselves when playing against the Dragons by trying to do too much against them; teams are better off keeping things simple and going with the Dragons set for set. Eventually they will capitulate simply because they don't have the talent that a lot of other teams have. McInnes' role in proceedings has been satisfactory. Credit where it is due - the guy has been solid but there is no I'd say that he is the reason why the Dragons are winning nor would I even contemplate picking him for Origin. McInnes' distribution and creativity is no better or worse than when he was at Souths nor would I say that the way he controls the speed of the ruck has improved either; if you look at the way the Dragons play you'd hardly call them a fast moving team. Instead, McInnes has kept things simple by keeping the ball close the ruck (that is why he has 4 try assists) and letting Widdop control things.

Many people on here will be thinking "Well why couldn't he do that at Souths?" The simple answer is that the way we play is completely different to the way the Dragons play. For starters, we need to be a fast moving team in order to maximise the size of the Burgess brothers - neither one of them has good acceleration so we need to prevent defences from moving up quickly on them in order to take advantage of their enormous size and power. Damien Cook fits the bill perfectly for this because one of his strengths is speeding up the ruck and catching out markers from dummy half. Secondly, we lack a commanding half who can control a game through creativity and guile; Adam Reynolds is a good player but he's best suited to winning repeat sets and field position. Similarly, Cody Walker is a flair player who can create scoring opportunities but I wouldn't say that he can control a game and manage it in the same way that a Thurston can. Hence, we need a hooker with those attributes to help out our halves. McInnes wasn't and still isn't that type of player but Robbie Farah does offer that and that was why he was brought in.

In summary, McInnes is a technically limited footballer who is making the most of his ability. More importantly, he is right man in the right job at the right club - that is why the illusion is being created that he is an outstanding hooker. At Souths he simply didn't fit in with the way we were trying to play and that is why he struggled - it was unfortunate because the guy tried his guts out but it just wasn't working out. Rugby League is a lot like a puzzle and McInnes was a square peg in a round hole and him changing clubs was best for all concerned. Lastly, I think it is important to realise that it is only Round 6; we've got a long way to go in the season and at present, everyone is going to be dropping games here and there. The reason for this is that every team has something to play for and has aspirations of making the top 8; it during the middle and business end of the season that you start getting a few "gimme" games as teams start falling out of finals contention.

My tired old eyes start to do it hard when I'm reading novels!!!

 

[doyen]

I'm honestly starting to feel as if you guys are just looking for excuses to blame cook/Farah for our losses.

McInnes is playing great yes no one can take that from him. But let's look at the teams the dragons have played.

Round 1: Penrith 2 Wins 4 losses
Round 2: Lost to eels who are 2 wins to 4 losses
Round 3: Beat a depleted Sharks squad who are 4 wins to 2 losses
Round 4: beat the warriors who are 3 for 3 and a pretty unconvincing 3.
Round 5: they beat the tigers who are at the bottom of the ladder
Round 6: they beat a manly side who did not turn up. It was the exact same side that we demolished.

If you are going to say that McInnes is a NSW origin player because the dragons are doing well it's nuts. The dragons performances are on the back of their halves. I haven't seen Gareth Widdop play as well as he has in a long time. I urge you to watch Widdop's last tackle options compared to Reynolds this year. You will see that Widdop is playing extremely better than Reynolds. They also have a future NSW player in aitken and tim lafai is in top form. If the dragons end up in the top 4 by the end of the season I'll be extremely surprised. They play a depleted cowboys pack next week too.

Saints are saying that Widdop's spike in form is due to Benji & Rein leaving & McInnes's influence!!

 

[SBD82]

Actually watch a dragons game. Mcinnes controls that team just as much as widdop. It all comes back to the fact that dragons targeted mcinnes as someone they saw they could build a team around. They wanted him in 2015, and even though he backflipped on a deal with them they still wanted him the next time he became available. How often do team chase a player that's backflipped on them in the past? The situation at south's was different. In 2015 he was Luke's understudy, in the 2016 pre-season he was told he wasn't worth paying buy Crowe. Dragons have obviously made him feel more appreciated.
Look at the way he leads that team. He is constantly instructing forwards when he wants them to run and where. He is moving that team into the position on the field where they can be dangerous. He is giving great crisp passes right to the chest of the forwards so that when they get the ball they are already over the advantage line. He is making the right choices from dummy half. If they are getting good roll on he'll give widdop the ball with room to move, if not he'll get another forward to punch it up, if mcrone is the better option he'll get it. As a hooker you'd be tempted to favour widdop over mcrone almost 99 times out if 100, but he is making sure that when mcrone can do good he'll get the ball. It's making mcrone look good and it's taking pressure of widdop. Widdop is only getting the ball when he can cause some damage, which is in huge contrast to last year when the gameplan seemed to be pass to widdop and hope he'll make something out of nothing. He's creativity close to the line is not only taking pressure of widdop he's actually creating tries or near tries just on his own. His neen given a bigger controlling role at yhe dragons and he is thriving. Unlike last year when he was copping the blame for the failure of the Burgess bros running game falling off a cliff. We were to afraid to talk about it last year, no blame could be put at the Burgii's feet unlike this year were the twins can now be dropped and sam criticized. Mcinnes running game is still strong, when he runs he runs with a purpose and his defence is one of the best of any hooker. He is starting to become a smith/hodgson/ennis type player for the dragons and our it's great to see commentators make notice of his talent and guys like ennis and buderus push his case.

Be careful Diego. You're going to be accused of being a redv supporter. You've obviously been watching us pretty closely.

Great summary of our season this far.

 

[SBD82]

Saints are saying that Widdop's spike in form is due to Benji & Rein leaving & McInnes's influence!!

He's making McCrone look like a halfback.

That is a huge effort from any hooker.

 

[doyen]

I'm honestly starting to feel as if you guys are just looking for excuses to blame cook/Farah for our losses.

McInnes is playing great yes no one can take that from him. But let's look at the teams the dragons have played.

Round 1: Penrith 2 Wins 4 losses
Round 2: Lost to eels who are 2 wins to 4 losses
Round 3: Beat a depleted Sharks squad who are 4 wins to 2 losses
Round 4: beat the warriors who are 3 for 3 and a pretty unconvincing 3.
Round 5: they beat the tigers who are at the bottom of the ladder
Round 6: they beat a manly side who did not turn up. It was the exact same side that we demolished.

If you are going to say that McInnes is a NSW origin player because the dragons are doing well it's nuts. The dragons performances are on the back of their halves. I haven't seen Gareth Widdop play as well as he has in a long time. I urge you to watch Widdop's last tackle options compared to Reynolds this year. You will see that Widdop is playing extremely better than Reynolds. They also have a future NSW player in aitken and tim lafai is in top form. If the dragons end up in the top 4 by the end of the season I'll be extremely surprised. They play a depleted cowboys pack next week too.

Sths have had just as easy a run against depleted teams[Manly,Panthers] don't forget & lost comprehensively to the Tigers!!! They scraped over the line against the Knights too!!

The significant point to me,which is an indicator of the influence of key players[our No.9s eg]; is the monstrous differential of 100 pts between us & Saints!! And Sths have had a fairly lucky draw so far with weakened opposition--of course,we are getting used to life after GI;which is huge,I suppose!

 

[souths_reborn]

Actually watch a dragons game. Mcinnes controls that team just as much as widdop. It all comes back to the fact that dragons targeted mcinnes as someone they saw they could build a team around. They wanted him in 2015, and even though he backflipped on a deal with them they still wanted him the next time he became available. How often do team chase a player that's backflipped on them in the past? The situation at south's was different. In 2015 he was Luke's understudy, in the 2016 pre-season he was told he wasn't worth paying buy Crowe. Dragons have obviously made him feel more appreciated.
Look at the way he leads that team. He is constantly instructing forwards when he wants them to run and where. He is moving that team into the position on the field where they can be dangerous. He is giving great crisp passes right to the chest of the forwards so that when they get the ball they are already over the advantage line. He is making the right choices from dummy half. If they are getting good roll on he'll give widdop the ball with room to move, if not he'll get another forward to punch it up, if mcrone is the better option he'll get it. As a hooker you'd be tempted to favour widdop over mcrone almost 99 times out if 100, but he is making sure that when mcrone can do good he'll get the ball. It's making mcrone look good and it's taking pressure of widdop. Widdop is only getting the ball when he can cause some damage, which is in huge contrast to last year when the gameplan seemed to be pass to widdop and hope he'll make something out of nothing. He's creativity close to the line is not only taking pressure of widdop he's actually creating tries or near tries just on his own. His neen given a bigger controlling role at yhe dragons and he is thriving. Unlike last year when he was copping the blame for the failure of the Burgess bros running game falling off a cliff. We were to afraid to talk about it last year, no blame could be put at the Burgii's feet unlike this year were the twins can now be dropped and sam criticized. Mcinnes running game is still strong, when he runs he runs with a purpose and his defence is one of the best of any hooker. He is starting to become a smith/hodgson/ennis type player for the dragons and our it's great to see commentators make notice of his talent and guys like ennis and buderus push his case.

That's nonsense that McInnes controls a game as much as Widdop. I respect your right to an opinion but I similar can't go along with the logic that the Dragons are building their team around McInnes. They went after the guy simply because their was a lack of viable options on the open market. You can bet your life if a better hooker was available then they would have pursued him instead of McInnes. Moreover, the abilities that you are highlighting in his game are all attributes that any hooker worth a grain of salt embody. Basically, a good way of summing up the way he is playing is to state that he is doing no more or less than any decent first grade hooker should be doing. Like I said in my previous post, he is keeping things simple, which to be fair to the lad, is actually quite smart given his limitations and the players (or there lack of) the Dragons have. For instance, the tries he is creating are more down to the work of his forwards than his guile.

The Burgess brothers, in particular the twins, are just as much to blame for our poor performances last season as much as McInnes is; I'm not going to argue with you there. Cameron McInnes didn't cause the twins to drop so much ball. The question did arise on here as to whether or not it was a good decision to resign Sam - I think that is the reason why a lot of people defended him. Back to McInnes and like I said previously, the way he played wasn't suited to the teams overall style. Its nothing personal against him; the guy tried his guts out and for that he deserves commendations. In saying that, the team needs to come first and for that reason I think we made the right decision in letting him go.

 

[souths_reborn]

Sths have had just as easy a run against depleted teams[Manly,Panthers] don't forget & lost comprehensively to the Tigers!!! They scraped over the line against the Knights too!!

The significant point to me,which is an indicator of the influence of key players[our No.9s eg]; is the monstrous differential of 100 pts between us & Saints!! And Sths have had a fairly lucky draw so far with weakened opposition--of course,we are getting used to life after GI;which is huge,I suppose!

I refuse to accept that there are easy games at this point in the season. The reason is that everyone is still in finals contention and has something to play for. Hence, there are no easy games. In saying that, how can you possibly say we have been playing weakened opposition. We played the Tigers at full strength, Manly had a forward or two out but their team was largely the same as the one that won 3 straight, we came up against a Roosters team at full strength and we were unfortunate enough to come up against a Cowboys line up that still had Thurston, Granville, Coote etc before they got injured. So if anything, we have had it harder than the Dragons!

 

[DiegoNT]

That's nonsense that McInnes controls a game as much as Widdop. I respect your right to an opinion but I similar can't go along with the logic that the Dragons are building their team around McInnes. They went after the guy simply because their was a lack of viable options on the open market. You can bet your life if a better hooker was available then they would have pursued him instead of McInnes. Moreover, the abilities that you are highlighting in his game are all attributes that any hooker worth a grain of salt embody. Basically, a good way of summing up the way he is playing is to state that he is doing no more or less than any decent first grade hooker should be doing. Like I said in my previous post, he is keeping things simple, which to be fair to the lad, is actually quite smart given his limitations and the players (or there lack of) the Dragons have. For instance, the tries he is creating are more down to the work of his forwards than his guile.

The Burgess brothers, in particular the twins, are just as much to blame for our poor performances last season as much as McInnes is; I'm not going to argue with you there. Cameron McInnes didn't cause the twins to drop so much ball. The question did arise on here as to whether or not it was a good decision to resign Sam - I think that is the reason why a lot of people defended him. Back to McInnes and like I said previously, the way he played wasn't suited to the teams overall style. Its nothing personal against him; the guy tried his guts out and for that he deserves commendations. In saying that, the team needs to come first and for that reason I think we made the right decision in letting him go.

So if i was to say cam smith is controlling the storm well, getting the forwards rolling where he wants to, giving cronk good ball when he wants it, taking the right options out of dummy half etc you'd say smith is just doing what any decent hooker is doing?

 

[souths_reborn]

So if i was to say cam smith is controlling the storm well, getting the forwards rolling where he wants to, giving cronk good ball when he wants it, taking the right options out of dummy half etc you'd say smith is just doing what any decent hooker is doing?

Cameron Smith is the premiere hooker of the game. The reason for this in a nutshell is that he is able to analyse what is going on in front of him, select an appropriate play and execute it; where your average first grade hooker thinks on the spot or 1-2 plays ahead, Cameron Smith thinks for an entire set of six but is able to change it also depending on what happens during that set. He is also one of the main reasons why players, who are mediocre at other clubs, succeed at the Storm - Cameron Smith's organisational abilities and structured play enable them to execute their roles perfect. On the contrary, an example of a decent first grade hooker would be Andrew McCulloch. I also refuted your point that Cameron McInnes controls games - I never made any comparison between him and Cameron Smith.

 

[DiegoNT]

Cameron Smith is the premiere hooker of the game. The reason for this in a nutshell is that he is able to analyse what is going on in front of him, select an appropriate play and execute it; where your average first grade hooker thinks on the spot or 1-2 plays ahead, Cameron Smith thinks for an entire set of six but is able to change it also depending on what happens during that set. He is also one of the main reasons why players, who are mediocre at other clubs, succeed at the Storm - Cameron Smith's organisational abilities and structured play enable them to execute their roles perfect. On the contrary, an example of a decent first grade hooker would be Andrew McCulloch. I also refuted your point that Cameron McInnes controls games - I never made any comparison between him and Cameron Smith.

And how you've described cam smith is exactly how mcinnes is going. Obviously the difference is that mcinnes has only done it for 6 game's while Smith has done it for 300 straight including tests, finals and origins. But everything else is how you've described smith. McInnes is laying the groundwork on tackle 1 for what he wants from the whole set, yet if things change he'll change with it. He's instructing his forwards where he wants them and working well with his half. People thought dragons getting Vaughan was crazy, off mcinnes passes he is the form prop of the comp, de belin is playing like superman and he's made mcrone look like a 1st grade halfback.
It will be interesting to see if he can keep it up all year

 

[Souths Till I Die]

You can't compare cam McInnes to cam smith. McInnes hasn't done anything any good hooker can't do. He's in good form but it's not like he's the best hooker in the competition. Mccollough, friend, peats, koroisau maybe even Wallace are all better than McInnes. Once the dragons start losing games which will happen, their draw has been easy as. I'm sure everyone will stop praising McInnes.

 

[foreverinourshadow]

turtle legs dud mcinnes is just that A DUD!!!!Shadow....just ask r20 he knows,,,

 

[alien]

Shut the hell up about McInnes, you idiots! He didn't improve enough last year when he had plenty of chances, so we took a different direction! Get over it!

 

[DiegoNT]

You can't compare cam McInnes to cam smith. McInnes hasn't done anything any good hooker can't do. He's in good form but it's not like he's the best hooker in the competition. Mccollough, friend, peats, koroisau maybe even Wallace are all better than McInnes. Once the dragons start losing games which will happen, their draw has been easy as. I'm sure everyone will stop praising McInnes.

Like i said it's only 6 games.
Can't compare him to smith as Smith has done it consistently for so long.
But even in their 1 loss this season mcinnes was one of dragons best.
But we are now a quater of the way through the year, if mcinnes keeps this form all the way through will people ever admit that he is a good player? Probably unlikely, i think he'll always be McTurtle to some people

 

[DiegoNT]

Shut the hell up about McInnes, you idiots! He didn't improve enough last year when he had plenty of chances, so we took a different direction! Get over it!

This thread is about Robbie Farah
The player we got rid of for Robbie farah was Mcinnes
a legitimate part off the conversation about signing farah is how mcinnes is going at his new club.
Crowe didn't think Mcinnes was worth paying
Crowe was also reportedly heavily involved in recruiting Farah.
It's all relevant

 

[Souths Till I Die]

And how you've described cam smith is exactly how mcinnes is going. Obviously the difference is that mcinnes has only done it for 6 game's while Smith has done it for 300 straight including tests, finals and origins. But everything else is how you've described smith. McInnes is laying the groundwork on tackle 1 for what he wants from the whole set, yet if things change he'll change with it. He's instructing his forwards where he wants them and working well with his half. People thought dragons getting Vaughan was crazy, off mcinnes passes he is the form prop of the comp, de belin is playing like superman and he's made mcrone look like a 1st grade halfback.
It will be interesting to see if he can keep it up all year

That's total bs. McInnes does not analyse and control games. He may make a few darts out of dummy half because he can see opportunities in the ruck but what good hooker doesn't do that? The reason you guys overhype McInnes on here is not because you think his on the same level as cameron smith it's to piss off R20, shadow and alien and it's funny but you can't honestly think McInnes is anywhere near cameron smiths level. I have yet to see cameron McInnes kick a 40/20 to turn a match around, let alone kick during a game more than twice. I have yet to see cameron McInnes force a repeat set. If he gets picked for NSW not only will NSW get absolutely hammered but he will be destroying his confidence as a player. I like cameron McInnes. He seems like a good guy that gives back to the community. But comparing him to cameron smith is like comparing Coen Hess to Andrew Fifita.

 

[rabbitohs95]

That's total bs. McInnes does not analyse and control games. He may make a few darts out of dummy half because he can see opportunities in the ruck but what good hooker doesn't do that? The reason you guys overhype McInnes on here is not because you think his on the same level as cameron smith it's to piss off R20, shadow and alien and it's funny but you can't honestly think McInnes is anywhere near cameron smiths level. I have yet to see cameron McInnes kick a 40/20 to turn a match around, let alone kick during a game more than twice. I have yet to see cameron McInnes force a repeat set. If he gets picked for NSW not only will NSW get absolutely hammered but he will be destroying his confidence as a player. I like cameron McInnes. He seems like a good guy that gives back to the community. But comparing him to cameron smith is like comparing Coen Hess to Andrew Fifita.

Set up a few tries and gotten a few repeat sets mate. He's opening up his arsenal.

 

[souths_reborn]

And how you've described cam smith is exactly how mcinnes is going. Obviously the difference is that mcinnes has only done it for 6 game's while Smith has done it for 300 straight including tests, finals and origins. But everything else is how you've described smith. McInnes is laying the groundwork on tackle 1 for what he wants from the whole set, yet if things change he'll change with it. He's instructing his forwards where he wants them and working well with his half. People thought dragons getting Vaughan was crazy, off mcinnes passes he is the form prop of the comp, de belin is playing like superman and he's made mcrone look like a 1st grade halfback.
It will be interesting to see if he can keep it up all year

McInnes is currently playing the same but a more simplified style of football that Cameron Smith does. It is absolutely ludicrous to compare the two so lets not go there. My initial point was that there are others in the team who deserve more credit for the Dragons good form of late and I stand by that comment. In fact, you've actually mentioned one in Paul Vaughan, who I think is one of the most underrated front rowers in the competition.

 

[DiegoNT]

That's total bs. McInnes does not analyse and control games. He may make a few darts out of dummy half because he can see opportunities in the ruck but what good hooker doesn't do that? The reason you guys overhype McInnes on here is not because you think his on the same level as cameron smith it's to piss off R20, shadow and alien and it's funny but you can't honestly think McInnes is anywhere near cameron smiths level. I have yet to see cameron McInnes kick a 40/20 to turn a match around, let alone kick during a game more than twice. I have yet to see cameron McInnes force a repeat set. If he gets picked for NSW not only will NSW get absolutely hammered but he will be destroying his confidence as a player. I like cameron McInnes. He seems like a good guy that gives back to the community. But comparing him to cameron smith is like comparing Coen Hess to Andrew Fifita.

And yet cam smith didn't do any of that in his early years either.
When he was first picked for origin cam Smith was seen as just a tackler. He was a tough kid who could tackle but he was nowhere near the class and creativity of nsw hooker off the time like buderus, wing and priddis.
But he is a smart young player that is starting to make his imprint on the dragons team. If you don't believe me just ask any dragons fan on here who have suffered for years with mediocrity for years and now find themselves 1st a quater of the way though the year.

 

[Souths Till I Die]

And yet cam smith didn't do any of that in his early years either.
When he was first picked for origin cam Smith was seen as just a tackler. He was a tough kid who could tackle but he was nowhere near the class and creativity of nsw hooker off the time like buderus, wing and priddis.
But he is a smart young player that is starting to make his imprint on the dragons team. If you don't believe me just ask any dragons fan on here who have suffered for years with mediocrity for years and now find themselves 1st a quater of the way though the year.

Cam smith was chosen to debut for origin because they were desperate. We are not. We have quality options in peats, koroisau and Wallace. The exact same thing happened to the dragons in 2015 I believe. It could of actually been 2014. I may be wrong on seasons. But they found themselves in the top 4 in the opening rounds and then went on a losing streak. The season isn't decided in 6 rounds. In fact it's probably worse to hit top form now rather than later in the season. A lot of teams can't maintain form for a whole season.