Third Party Payments ~ a crock or what!?

Discussion in 'St George Illawarra Dragons' started by Seoul Dragon, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Maybe I don't understand TPPs and I am happy to be educated, but it seems like TPPs are an unrestricted black hole undermining the Cap.

    Sure, clubs aren't supposed to be involved, but "introductions" to benefactors would be simple for clubs to organize and when you have a well connected board it all becomes too easy and the cap as a tool for leveling the talent playing field just fades away.....

    Go to a Roosters game at Allianz and they parade the players and their sponsors on the big screen.

    Surely we need to control TTPs and support the true intention of the cap ~~
     
  2. JDHD

    JDHD Juniors

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Likes Received:
    1,433
    They're a crock of shit but the only reason any Dragons fans are blowing up about them is because we don't have any lol
     
  3. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Yeah, maybe jealously.

    But why aren't they managed and limited.

    Hypothetically the cap could become secondary and the NRL loses control of a key lever in talent distribution .....seems like they have their eyes shut.
     
  4. JDHD

    JDHD Juniors

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Likes Received:
    1,433
    Your initial post was on the money with how they work. They're supposed to be at arms length but anyone with a brain stem can tell that a CEO with connections could hook some players up with TPPs that he couldn't otherwise afford. The only reason the Storm got caught was because an assistant gave Ian Schubert the secret files without realising what they were after a whistleblower clued him in. The Eels only got caught because they were discussing it in the board meetings that they then signed off on the minutes of and, of course, multiple whistblowers. Gross incompetency basically. The NRL have never caught a team without an informant.
     
  5. muzby

    muzby Village Idiot Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2006
    Messages:
    31,421
    Likes Received:
    5,078
    Is that you, Dousty?
     
    getsmarty, emu62 and merahputih like this.
  6. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Chuckle
     
  7. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Yep, the process easily circumvented as you say, but what about the quantum?

    No quantum controls?

    If not whats to stop some bored billionaire tapping his petty cash and getting his PA to contact and offer the games 5 elite players $2m a season on top to come to his favourite club?

    Ridiculous but possible (???).

    Why not make TPPs transparent and cap them.
     
    Frank Facer likes this.
  8. JDHD

    JDHD Juniors

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Likes Received:
    1,433
    That is almost word for word exactly what every news article regarding TPPs has proposed since they were brought in.
     
  9. JohnnoMcJohnno

    JohnnoMcJohnno Juniors

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2015
    Messages:
    943
    Likes Received:
    1,010
    Not much you can do about it. I believe it was tested in court and found that any clampdown by the NRL on TPP's is an illegal restraint on a players rights to earn money. No diffrrent to Joe Bloggs having his day job and then delivering pizzas after work to earn more squids. Clubs are not supposed to get involved but obviously they do.
     
  10. dragonssamy61

    dragonssamy61 Bench

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    4,612
    We do but no
    were near as well as other clubs do. The roosters, broncos and storm are kings of it.
    Hunt and Graham and frizz all have tpp.
    There is a few others as well.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
  11. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Thx for the education re TPPs. I have come a full circle.....

    If they have been tested in court and found to be a restraint of trade it would seem as though it is open slather and to hell with the level playing field.

    The question now, probably rhetorical, is why aren't the dragons up to speed in maximizing our TPP opportunities .......

    Pretty clear we need a CEO, Board and Exec team who both bring and foster the business connections that will allow us to compete for the games best players~~
     
  12. AyiosYiorgos

    AyiosYiorgos First Grade

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 1970
    Messages:
    9,797
    Likes Received:
    1,303
    Unlimited 3rd party deals were brought in to appease Politis, Bronco's, Dogs, they bitch and moaned until they got there own way, if the NRL had any balls they would introduce a point system for every player and clubs would have a for eg a 150 points for their 30 man squad...
     
    goggles, Gareth67 and Seoul Dragon like this.
  13. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2013
    Messages:
    12,322
    Likes Received:
    5,124
    The TPP is not meant to come from any party associated with the club, it's management or its sponsors. So while said billionaire couldnt just have his assistant give them, he could donate large amounts on money to a random charity, an offset of whom may sponsor a player. Or, if you believe certain rumours, an associate of the clubs management could play a weekly game of golf against a player with a friendly $20,000 wager attached (and of course, said associated is a poor golfer).

    There are minor ways to restrict that (or to mask the corruption, depending on your cynicism). Things like Market Value of players being one of them. There's also blatant perception - if you're looking for a bank robber, you immediately go to the house of the guy who's living room is filled with bank-note-filled briefcases. But ultimately, the smart clubs do it right - take enough to get a large advantage and make it seem like they are cheating, but not too much that they cant reasonably justify it.

    As to the reason our club cant organise this? An ancient and inward looking management structure who's best business connection is the chip shop down the road. And I dont think we'll sign any top shelf players on the promise of extra chicken salt.
     
  14. SBD82

    SBD82 Bench

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2015
    Messages:
    3,488
    Likes Received:
    2,566
    What seems to be forgotten is that the introduction of the salary cap wasn't about evening the comp, it was about ensuring that the poorer clubs didn't go broke trying to chase big signatures.

    TPAs, when used within the guidelines, are consistent with this idea, as the money doesnt come from the club.
     
    JDHD likes this.
  15. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Thx SBD ~~ didnt know that.

    Given that intention isnt it ironic that the so called rich clubs seem to be the ones playing the TPP game better and benefiting more than "poor clubs"
     
    Highland Saint likes this.
  16. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    A chip shop is a good analogy for our mgt BennyV.

    The TTPs is murkier than I thought!

    Isnt it ironic the juxtaposition of a relatively tightly controlled cap alongside an open slather TPP ~~
     
  17. possm

    possm First Grade

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2011
    Messages:
    6,507
    Likes Received:
    3,170
    I've always believed that TPP/TPA should be managed by the NRL and player managers. They should have nothing to do with Clubs and all to do with keeping players in the NRL. TPP/TPA should be portable and move with players; they should be a fixed term contract and not part of or coincidental to a contract offered by a Club.

    Player managers should bring TPA to the NRL and the NRL should consider approval based on set criteria. TPA should not coincide with the movement of a player to a new club and it's term should not coinced with the term of a new contract offered by a Club. Hopefully a TPA is just another way of competing against offers from rival codes .
     
    Seoul Dragon likes this.
  18. Seoul Dragon

    Seoul Dragon Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    119
    Agree, TPPs need a clear purpose, criteria and transparency.

    At the moment they are like an unrestrained garden hose on full ~~
     
  19. hazzbeen

    hazzbeen Juniors

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2012
    Messages:
    2,034
    Likes Received:
    2,267
    Said before they are all getting away with it , right or wrong its happening . Our lot have been left behind .
     
    Life's Good likes this.
  20. Life's Good

    Life's Good First Grade

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2016
    Messages:
    6,518
    Likes Received:
    8,158
    Its self fulfilling in a way. The strategic mindset of a good business person is to exploit all opportunities to prosper. This has the effect of attracting the talent. With that talent comes winning. Winning brings the riches and the cycle continues.
    I see it as a business mindset vs. a footy club mindset. Not hard to figure out where we sit.
     

Share This Page