'Tier 1' - How does a country make the step up?

Discussion in 'World Cup 2017' started by jim_57, Nov 18, 2017.

  1. jim_57

    jim_57 Juniors

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2008
    Messages:
    1,952
    Likes Received:
    270
    With recent and potential upcoming results, is there any indication on how any country and can be officially switched from tier 2 to 1 with Aus, NZ & England?

    All potential candidates have strengths and weaknesses but how will it be decided if a country is ever to make the step up? Results are one thing but would be hard to include countries with very few born & bred players and the inability to host regular home profitable internationals.

    So the candidates:

    Fiji
    Competitive Results
    - Yes
    Host profitable Internationals - Unsure, I'm sure they could if they ever had regular home games..
    Produce Players - Yes, reasonable at the moment with an increase with NSW Cup team.

    PNG
    Competitive Results
    - Unsure, England game will be a big indicator, no reason why they won't improve year on year.
    Host profitable Internationals - Yes, big crowds & excellent atmosphere. I don't imagine they would make a huge profit but surely profitable
    Produce Players - Yes, slowly getting there, the potential is definitely mostly untapped still.

    Tonga
    Competitive Results
    - Yes.
    Host profitable Internationals - Probably not, nation of 100k, unless they play "home" internationals in Auckland.
    Produce Players - No, again population of 100k makes it hard to produce a lot of players.

    France
    Competitive Results
    - No, getting a better soread of domestic players, look decent on paper at full strength but never seem to get lucky with injuries.
    Host profitable Internationals - Yes, have had good crowds in recent years.
    Produce Players - Yes, have their own semi-pro comp and providing more and more players despite Catalans insistence on "quick fix" heritage players.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2017
  2. Dakink

    Dakink Juniors

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2004
    Messages:
    2,487
    Likes Received:
    84
    Obviously PNG and France top the list... Fiji, maybe Wales?

    Dark horses into the future lebanon, us & Canada.
     
    Irish-bulldog likes this.
  3. Rory

    Rory Juniors

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2017
    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    44
    I think its too early right now. I'd wait until the next world cup or 2025
     
  4. Dakink

    Dakink Juniors

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2004
    Messages:
    2,487
    Likes Received:
    84
    Looking waaaaay into the future here though.
     
  5. Rory

    Rory Juniors

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2017
    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    44
    Any idea on the Canadian domestic scene? Obviously Toronto Wolfpack is there. But do you know what there average crowd is in Canada?
     
  6. myrrh ken

    myrrh ken Bench

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2016
    Messages:
    3,011
    Likes Received:
    1,091
    I say nz and the poms move from tier 1 to tier 2
     
    Dave_ and southwalesrabbitoh like this.
  7. KeepingTheFaith

    KeepingTheFaith Referee

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2006
    Messages:
    20,869
    Likes Received:
    1,320
    Just under 7k per game.
     
    Irish-bulldog likes this.
  8. grouch

    grouch First Grade

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2003
    Messages:
    6,483
    Likes Received:
    2,614
    Fiji have made 3 semi finals in a rrow now. Gotta count for something
     
  9. Hello, I'm The Doctor

    Hello, I'm The Doctor First Grade

    Joined:
    May 14, 2013
    Messages:
    6,949
    Likes Received:
    943
    With these new eligibility rules, we should probably be going slow on the promotion to the top tier. We might se a team move up, lose all their good players and suddenly be the worse than the tier 2/3s.

    For me, a nation should only be Tier one when their match payments are at a level that they can get players committing to them as a first choice. Until then, nations should stay in 2nd Tier.
     
  10. Perth Red

    Perth Red Referee

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2006
    Messages:
    29,053
    Likes Received:
    1,595
    Get rated in the top three world standings I’d suggest
     
  11. Rory

    Rory Juniors

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2017
    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    44
    Not bad. Bout as much as a game in Townsville lol
     
  12. Perth Red

    Perth Red Referee

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2006
    Messages:
    29,053
    Likes Received:
    1,595
    For the equivalent competition as the Ron Massey cup!
     
  13. geordie_saint

    geordie_saint Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2012
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    9
    The tier system is a crock of rubbish and a way for England, Australia and New Zealand to control the sport and ensure they remain top the pecking order. Sadly this WC won’t change it even though many of us want to see the likes of England, Australia and New Zealand playing against the likes of Fiji, Tonga and PNG far more often.
     
  14. Hello, I'm The Doctor

    Hello, I'm The Doctor First Grade

    Joined:
    May 14, 2013
    Messages:
    6,949
    Likes Received:
    943
    Whats specifically so bad about the system?
     
    southwalesrabbitoh likes this.
  15. deluded pom?

    deluded pom? First Grade

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2003
    Messages:
    8,733
    Likes Received:
    315
    Being a tier 1 nation allows you to pay more. It allows you to play the other tier 1 teams more often, especially outside of WCs. It allows you to be more attractive to players with dual (or more) eligibility. It allows you to keep the rest in their place.
     
    geordie_saint likes this.
  16. siv

    siv Bench

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2009
    Messages:
    2,575
    Likes Received:
    192
    I dont think it allows you to pay more

    Thats a decision by the local RL administration

    Australian RL payments are driven by a few factors
    - TV deal
    - SOO payments of $30k
    - RU threat of the Wallabies contracts and French/Japan RU

    It was a way for our elite players to earn more without impacting local club Salarys

    In reality there are only 2 Tier 1 nations based upon high grosing professional comps with high paying TV deals

    Australia and England

    NZ France PNG and US have next best league domestic operations but are stuck in a semi-professional state

    But the reality is for a player to receive $30k match fee the match needs to earn $1.02 mil for 34 players plus there are match running and advertising costs

    There are 28 RLWC games or about $28 mil in player payments
     
  17. southwalesrabbitoh

    southwalesrabbitoh Juniors

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2010
    Messages:
    2,010
    Likes Received:
    25
    Bohlls; it allows players who have played for T1 countries to go back and play for T2 countries, Tonga wouldn't be as competitive if it wasn't for the this system. No Taumalolo, Fifita or Jennings for Tonga this yr. Morgan Knowles wouldn't have played for Wales etc.
     
  18. Sydney Knight

    Sydney Knight Bench

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2010
    Messages:
    2,850
    Likes Received:
    131
    I think a big part of tier 1 status should be the ability to put home grown players on the park without losing 150 nil and resulting in a safety issue.

    Currently outside of tier 1 only PNG and France can do this.
     
  19. adamkungl

    adamkungl Immortal

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    39,321
    Likes Received:
    2,853
    Tier 1 nations can put a professional squad on the park developed from their own country, and ideally afford to pay them (*cough* NZ)

    Quite simply if Tonga were made tier 1 tomorrow they wouldn't be able to sustain it because most of their eligible players were born in Aus and NZ. Even all things being equal (money, number of tests) I would think a good portion would aim to play for Aus and NZ.

    France and PNG can put a home grown team on the field but not a fully professional one with any consistency, but they might not be far off.
     
    titoelcolombiano likes this.
  20. titoelcolombiano

    titoelcolombiano Juniors

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2010
    Messages:
    685
    Likes Received:
    325
    For me, a teir one nation has a pool (at the very minimum one full squad) of professional players (SL or NRL) that are only eligible for that nation (i.e. home grown) and that those players are consistently competitive with Australia, New Zealand and England. A teir one nation should also host home tests and be able to pay players decent match payment fees rather than relying on hand-outs.

    On the last point, New Zealand are borderline but the Kiwis draw in the crowds and ratings that are larely responsible for the profits made from tests that they play against Australia and England.
     

Share This Page