US League set for lift off

[RedVee]

I am a little concerned with playing under different rules, what happens 'when' RL becomes popular and then the US audience views a game under international laws? Confusion, I'd wager.
Though I am also concerned about the NRL introducing their own rules as well.

 

[adamkungl]

Here's hoping after a few seasons to settle in, they revert to the International Rulebook. Preferably before the next WC.

Mind you, I'm hoping that the international game and the NRL unify the rules as well.

 

[Kiki]

awesome news!

 

[SignGuyDino]

American football goalposts...where did I hear this before? :roll:

Why are we reading this on rugbyleague.com and not their own website? Or do I get flamed for daring to suggest a website should be updated more than once every 4 months?

Oh, in possibly related news, possibly not, Murdoch and Fox buy out Setanta USA: http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Rupert-Murdoch-and-Fox-snap-up-Setanta-Sports-81129037.html I only hope it's a way to get NRL in the States since Spike won't answer questions on carrying NRL like they did for last year's playoffs.

Consider me skeptical.

 

[Pablo-13]

There have been a load of comments on this and other boards about the rule variations but they are so minor I don't see any reason to be concerned.

RL might not be played in quarters usually but it is when there is hot weather.

The kick-off was that way in Super League in the UK for several years, and US / Canadian viewers will be used to it. I doubt it'll cause them much trouble adjusting for international games when they need to play the other way round.

American football goalposts...where did I hear this before? :roll:

The Laws of the Game allow goal posts to be that shape.

 

[SignGuyDino]

I don't believe they normally allow them on the back of the endzones, nor at the width of American football goal posts. In any event, if they are going with the American goalposts, they can modify the rules slightly on the minimum distance required to kick at goal on conversions to compensate for the wider goalposts. 99% of new American fans won't notice but it'll be fair. I have argued keep the changes in field markings compared to football as few as possible, even if it means 11-a-side.

I'm watching UFC Fight Night on Spike. Excellent broadcast. IF somehow a pro league got on that network they should work with Dana White on cross-promotion. Not make the league like the XFL, more like a serious pro comp. with an "edge." A lot of UFC fans would be natural rugby league fans if approached right. I even imagine a game intro package that incorporates "Georgeous Frankenstein" by the band of the same name (the instrumental Brock Lesnar used in a promo video to keep it clean), sounds like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCxb74f9gnc Just imagine an intro with rugby league players involved, that'd kick @@@.

 

[Western_Eel]

It looks like the nrl will change to quarters so anyways

 

[biggestbroncosfan]

what nrl/sl players do you think would be playing. Does anyone have a list of current off contract players im guessing they would be signing players like matt utai, sione faumuina and is the confirmed number of teams 8? and where are they located hopefully the nrlus give some more news at the end of the month and not leave everybody in the dark

 

[deluded pom?]

Isn't Utai going to the ESL?

 

[Big Picture]

what nrl/sl players do you think would be playing. Does anyone have a list of current off contract players im guessing they would be signing players like matt utai, sione faumuina and is the confirmed number of teams 8? and where are they located hopefully the nrlus give some more news at the end of the month and not leave everybody in the dark

If an 8-tean league is being run for between $10 million and $15 million, I can't see them being able to offer the kind of $ that would tempt NRL or SL players. More likely they'll get guys who are just below that calibre.

 

[Jankuloski]

I think the biggest pool of tallent will come from many good athletes who don't make it through the NFL raster. I don't think it'll start and be on par with ESL and NRL immidiately.

Utai was linked to Crusaders but failed to recover from injury...

 

[spinnerhowland]

I don't believe they normally allow them on the back of the endzones, nor at the width of American football goal posts. In any event, if they are going with the American goalposts, they can modify the rules slightly on the minimum distance required to kick at goal on conversions to compensate for the wider goalposts. 99% of new American fans won't notice but it'll be fair. I have argued keep the changes in field markings compared to football as few as possible, even if it means 11-a-side.


RL Goal posts are the same width at American Football ones.
Over the years of Rugby league in the USA the game has been played many, many times on fields that are for American football. Due to the lower number of players needed on the sideline it is almost always possible extend the width of the feild by at least 5 yards each side and still have a safe field. The length from try line to try line is sorter by 10 yards due to it being 100 yards and not 100 meters. (Not such a big deal) AND on the occasions that the goals posts have been set on the BACK line of the endzone any kick for penalty points has been allowed to move the ball forward 10 yards. This is all stuff that has been happening in the USA since I was involved at the end on 1996. Using American football fields and 13 players per side works just fine.
Playing on a 10 yard shorter field and allowing a 10 yard concession for penatly kicks is a far less change in the game than making it a 11 a side game. (What spots to you remove? Fullback? Lock? one of the centers?)

 

[SignGuyDino]

The square footage, even with 11-a-side on an American football field, is still slightly tighter per player than 13-a-side on international fields, but it is quite comparable. If you are talking about the supposed best players not in NRL and SL on the pitch within American football bounderies, that's madness, it will be too low scoring and will risk way too many injuries.

The question was not what Americans do with goalposts (rugby union does the same thing league does), the question was what official international games do. Big difference. What NBA does and what FIBA does are different things and done for different reasons. Everything I've seen is neither NRL or SL uses 100% international rules anyway, they use rules that work for them. Smaller space=fewer players. rl1908.com was talking about going down to 11-a-side anyway to reduce costs and increase scoring, although I presume it would be on a field similar to what NRL uses now, so it's not just some message board rabble-rouser suggesting this, it's one of your own: http://www.rl1908.com/blog/11-aside-rugby.htm

Yes, my idea would be a 10-yard markoff minimum for kicks at goal for conversions.

As to who you pull off, I do believe I saw some rules comps for younger ages suggest 6 forwards and 5 backs if you went 11-a-side. The comparison I would use is hockey rinks. To be able to play any other sport in an arena, whether it be indoor/arena football, indoor lacrosse, or indoor soccer, the league has to modify the outdoor game to make it work on an inside rink.

Again, if you have alternate blue lines, it's going to look as silly as the AMNRL final. You're going to end up with second or third-class venues, prob. those that don't even sell alcohol, which again, means NOT professional. I'd suggest playing on current football lines, which means 11-a-side. Just like NRL and SL players go to international rules in international matches, so would this league.

I would also point out that the "gridiron" lines during MLS games is a primary reason soccer fans wanted their own venues. No reason to look like some other sport's "red-headed stepchild." Frankly, a pro union league would work in MLS venues except they don't play winter-spring to make it work.

As to the "carnival" tour, it dawned on me that Niu claimed this would be a way to see what market would work. Bad idea for several reasons:

1. You really expect people to sit through several games at once?
2. The number of teams there would still be under 8 most likely.
3. Suppose a market "fails" in this trial run. That makes it even harder to find another city in which you have no idea if they are a suitable market.

This sounds so "UFL-ish." Are we going to have "NRLUS Florida" and "NRLUS California" as team names, too? The UFL almost did that before a bunch of UFL fans on message boards raised hell about it. They did go with pastel uniforms with was laughable. They touted, "team in New York City" itself and announced a league WITHOUT SECURING A VENUE. Now that team is going to Hartford. What a joke. Yet that league at least updates their website and takes their hits.


You get the venues, then you announce the teams, then you get the logos and uniforms out, and you take a year to market. Of course, to do all that, those secretive investors have to be announced and they have to write the checks, if they exist.


No, you need a year to market the teams AFTER the venues are announced and rent paid for. In that year, you need either SL or NRL on a cable TV channel with ads promoting this American league, to educate Americans. You also need a year to train American players. The idea that we're going to take the scraps from the NFL and be on par with NRL and SL is insulting to them. There needs to be some official affiliation with NRL and/or SL but it must also be explicitly stated after 3-5 years no more affiliations, you 're on your own. (MLS champs Real Salt Lake STILL has an affiliation with Real Madrid. No wonder nobody takes MLS seriously as a top-league.) Otherwise, it will be considered "minor league" and I can promise you Americans will not support a minor league masquerading as major league.

 

[spinnerhowland]

The square footage, even with 11-a-side on an American football field, is still slightly tighter per player than 13-a-side on international fields, but it is quite comparable. If you are talking about the supposed best players not in NRL and SL on the pitch within American football bounderies, that's madness, it will be too low scoring and will risk way too many injuries.

The question was not what Americans do with goalposts (rugby union does the same thing league does), the question was what official international games do. Big difference. What NBA does and what FIBA does are different things and done for different reasons. Everything I've seen is neither NRL or SL uses 100% international rules anyway, they use rules that work for them. Smaller space=fewer players. rl1908.com was talking about going down to 11-a-side anyway to reduce costs and increase scoring, although I presume it would be on a field similar to what NRL uses now, so it's not just some message board rabble-rouser suggesting this, it's one of your own: http://www.rl1908.com/blog/11-aside-rugby.htm

Yes, my idea would be a 10-yard markoff minimum for kicks at goal for conversions.

As to who you pull off, I do believe I saw some rules comps for younger ages suggest 6 forwards and 5 backs if you went 11-a-side. The comparison I would use is hockey rinks. To be able to play any other sport in an arena, whether it be indoor/arena football, indoor lacrosse, or indoor soccer, the league has to modify the outdoor game to make it work on an inside rink.

Again, if you have alternate blue lines, it's going to look as silly as the AMNRL final. You're going to end up with second or third-class venues, prob. those that don't even sell alcohol, which again, means NOT professional. I'd suggest playing on current football lines, which means 11-a-side. Just like NRL and SL players go to international rules in international matches, so would this league.

I would also point out that the "gridiron" lines during MLS games is a primary reason soccer fans wanted their own venues. No reason to look like some other sport's "red-headed stepchild." Frankly, a pro union league would work in MLS venues except they don't play winter-spring to make it work.

As to the "carnival" tour, it dawned on me that Niu claimed this would be a way to see what market would work. Bad idea for several reasons:

1. You really expect people to sit through several games at once?
2. The number of teams there would still be under 8 most likely.
3. Suppose a market "fails" in this trial run. That makes it even harder to find another city in which you have no idea if they are a suitable market.

This sounds so "UFL-ish." Are we going to have "NRLUS Florida" and "NRLUS California" as team names, too? The UFL almost did that before a bunch of UFL fans on message boards raised hell about it. They did go with pastel uniforms with was laughable. They touted, "team in New York City" itself and announced a league WITHOUT SECURING A VENUE. Now that team is going to Hartford. What a joke. Yet that league at least updates their website and takes their hits.


You get the venues, then you announce the teams, then you get the logos and uniforms out, and you take a year to market. Of course, to do all that, those secretive investors have to be announced and they have to write the checks, if they exist.


No, you need a year to market the teams AFTER the venues are announced and rent paid for. In that year, you need either SL or NRL on a cable TV channel with ads promoting this American league, to educate Americans. You also need a year to train American players. The idea that we're going to take the scraps from the NFL and be on par with NRL and SL is insulting to them. There needs to be some official affiliation with NRL and/or SL but it must also be explicitly stated after 3-5 years no more affiliations, you 're on your own. (MLS champs Real Salt Lake STILL has an affiliation with Real Madrid. No wonder nobody takes MLS seriously as a top-league.) Otherwise, it will be considered "minor league" and I can promise you Americans will not support a minor league masquerading as major league.

It is apparent that you are not prepared to be happy at all with the progress this could mean. It is your way 100% of the highway as far as you are concerned. You have NO idea about Rugby League in the USA and I can tell you that 99% of your ideas have (or are) being used in the USA at some stage.

I do have ONE question for you - Have you EVER actually seen a LIVE Rugby League game?

It would appear you are being a rebel just for the sake of being a rebel. Much like your issues with Basketball in your home area, the letter your wrote to the President about the BSC playoffs, the issue you have with the sporting complex. Do you really just pick something and create your own little cause about it.

So - please tell me a Rugby League game you have actually ever been too live?

 

[SignGuyDino]

And you are the type of person who cannot heed warnings even though they've been out there since March of last year. Though shalt not criticize the "NRL-US."

You're welcome to post that comment on your website, when you finally get around to updating it. While you're at it you can fix the things that have been outdated like the links to the SL playoff games off espn360.com.

But it is your league's effort that removed not just my posts but others who posted legitimate questions about why there are no website updates on your own message board. Silencing the messenger doesn't hide the message for long. It was your league that allowed Union fans to call you out saying you fudged numbers of American participation, not me. It was you advertising seeing "Invictus" on your team's website piggybacking off Union, not me. Niu to his credit did get references to amnrl.com on the Spiketv broadcasts, but there was no follow up on the website, perhaps he should have had nrlus.com instead promoted. How is that on me?

And yes, I have seen rugby league and union matches live. Do I need to have 10 years of NRL experience to be allowed to comment? This is a fan's site. Anyone can state whatever we want, we don't have to be "sheeple." I found out about rugby league years before I knew the US had their semipro comp. I've been physically threatened on message boards before for calling the local hockey team owner a liar and that he bounced checks, but I was proven right and he was out in 3 months. You're not going to shut me up, so instead of trying how about answering the points or block my posts?

It's not an issue of "my way or the highway." I have 10 years of experience in sports business and event planning myself, and I can see things as they are. I can smell nonprofessional outfits a mile away. Have years of experience writing about them on oursportscentral, a website about minor league sports business.

I happen to know how other minor leagues are more professional and how they are not. I know that the NBA D-League rushed a product with just 6 months of marketing and had replicant logos. Such a sound strategy they were gone from the south in 4 years and haven't looked back. And the NBA has far more money than you guys. I've seen enough to see that this league is not credible at this time. The UFL is TRYING but it doesn't mean they are above criticism. You ought to see what they are doing to prevent the same mistakes. You get ONE SHOT to make a first impression.

Your league promised tryouts on the website for September 2009. You went past it and failed to update the website for the longest time and ignored calls by many to update it. Yet there's a "big announcement coming soon" with big-time investors? Sure there is.

I'm not the only one with doubts, there are people in Australia on their boards just as skeptical of this league as I am, just as against the idea of calling the league "NRL-US" as I am. Sounds like this will be NRL's minor league instead of a major competition. You're going to have a $10-15 million budget, but yet a carnival tour the first year? Um, yeah. And oh by the way, you have to have venues signed and paid for to do that. Takes many months of planning.

If you cannot accept and listen to legitimate criticism and ideas, you are not going to last long as a league. People who have an interest in this have a right to be updated. Don't patronize me and say my comments aren't helpful. ONE MAN cannot bring down a legitimate league. If the comments are true, they are helpful only if you heed them. Be stubborn at your own peril.

If you don't like the comments, block me. But I'm not shutting up.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

I think that when you consider the scorelines we see in the AMNRL and in many other lower level and fledgling leagues having a slightly narrowe field might be a good thing. It might actually prevent it being a basketball style score-a-thon.

In any event, if the field is slightly shorter might this not counter the fact that it is slightly narrower?

In any case it's all of no consequence. It will work fine. The 2004 game in Philadelphia between the Tomahawks and the Roos was completely confined to an American football field size and it was a great game. There were 60 points scored, and 24 of those from the rank underdogs. If smaller fields produced that kind of game all the time it would be genius.

 

[***MH***]

I don't believe they normally allow them on the back of the endzones, nor at the width of American football goal posts. In any event, if they are going with the American goalposts, they can modify the rules slightly on the minimum distance required to kick at goal on conversions to compensate for the wider goalposts. 99% of new American fans won't notice but it'll be fair. I have argued keep the changes in field markings compared to football as few as possible, even if it means 11-a-side.


RL Goal posts are the same width at American Football ones.
Over the years of Rugby league in the USA the game has been played many, many times on fields that are for American football. Due to the lower number of players needed on the sideline it is almost always possible extend the width of the feild by at least 5 yards each side and still have a safe field. The length from try line to try line is sorter by 10 yards due to it being 100 yards and not 100 meters. (Not such a big deal) AND on the occasions that the goals posts have been set on the BACK line of the endzone any kick for penalty points has been allowed to move the ball forward 10 yards. This is all stuff that has been happening in the USA since I was involved at the end on 1996. Using American football fields and 13 players per side works just fine.
Playing on a 10 yard shorter field and allowing a 10 yard concession for penatly kicks is a far less change in the game than making it a 11 a side game. (What spots to you remove? Fullback? Lock? one of the centers?)

Does having the goalposts at the back of the endzone impact on field goal attempts?

 

[spinnerhowland]

And you are the type of person who cannot heed warnings even though they've been out there since March of last year. Though shalt not criticize the "NRL-US."

You're welcome to post that comment on your website, when you finally get around to updating it. While you're at it you can fix the things that have been outdated like the links to the SL playoff games off espn360.com.

But it is your league's effort that removed not just my posts but others who posted legitimate questions about why there are no website updates on your own message board. Silencing the messenger doesn't hide the message for long. It was your league that allowed Union fans to call you out saying you fudged numbers of American participation, not me. It was you advertising seeing "Invictus" on your team's website piggybacking off Union, not me. Niu to his credit did get references to amnrl.com on the Spiketv broadcasts, but there was no follow up on the website, perhaps he should have had nrlus.com instead promoted. How is that on me?

And yes, I have seen rugby league and union matches live. Do I need to have 10 years of NRL experience to be allowed to comment? This is a fan's site. Anyone can state whatever we want, we don't have to be "sheeple." I found out about rugby league years before I knew the US had their semipro comp. I've been physically threatened on message boards before for calling the local hockey team owner a liar and that he bounced checks, but I was proven right and he was out in 3 months. You're not going to shut me up, so instead of trying how about answering the points or block my posts?

It's not an issue of "my way or the highway." I have 10 years of experience in sports business and event planning myself, and I can see things as they are. I can smell nonprofessional outfits a mile away. Have years of experience writing about them on oursportscentral, a website about minor league sports business.

I happen to know how other minor leagues are more professional and how they are not. I know that the NBA D-League rushed a product with just 6 months of marketing and had replicant logos. Such a sound strategy they were gone from the south in 4 years and haven't looked back. And the NBA has far more money than you guys. I've seen enough to see that this league is not credible at this time. The UFL is TRYING but it doesn't mean they are above criticism. You ought to see what they are doing to prevent the same mistakes. You get ONE SHOT to make a first impression.

Your league promised tryouts on the website for September 2009. You went past it and failed to update the website for the longest time and ignored calls by many to update it. Yet there's a "big announcement coming soon" with big-time investors? Sure there is.

I'm not the only one with doubts, there are people in Australia on their boards just as skeptical of this league as I am, just as against the idea of calling the league "NRL-US" as I am. Sounds like this will be NRL's minor league instead of a major competition. You're going to have a $10-15 million budget, but yet a carnival tour the first year? Um, yeah. And oh by the way, you have to have venues signed and paid for to do that. Takes many months of planning.

If you cannot accept and listen to legitimate criticism and ideas, you are not going to last long as a league. People who have an interest in this have a right to be updated. Don't patronize me and say my comments aren't helpful. ONE MAN cannot bring down a legitimate league. If the comments are true, they are helpful only if you heed them. Be stubborn at your own peril.

If you don't like the comments, block me. But I'm not shutting up.

The big issue with you "Dino" is that unlike others who may post here, YOU have your own agenda. You knock the AMNRL and NRLUS (and some of the points you make are vaild) but you do it for self promotion. You continue to stuff YOUR ideas about YOUR league and YOUR gridiron game dowm our throats. You are using the opportunity to promote for your own gain. Most of the ideas you have are being done at some level OR at least have been tried before. You make points and then steer the conversation towards YOUR two websites.

Speaking of websites how about we look at all of them
How about http://www.wncsport.com/ where you take issue with a basketball league. They used the logo of a former team and you made an effort to make it known. Seems like you didn't like it and took in upon yourself to run a little one man cursade. Lots of other "interesting" stuff on this site too.
Or maybe http://www.dennisjustice.com/ where you seems to be pretty outspoken about some turf company. Yet another "cause" you seem to have an interest in. DO YOU ALSO HAVE an interest in this turf company
Maybe http://www.wncsport.com/BCSPROPOSAL.pdf where you have yet another outcry about the state of colege football and YOU GUEST IT, you have an idea how to fix it. Imagine that, yet another cause you seem to have an answer too.
I am starting to think you are some kind of Super Hero who goes about fixing all sorts of sports.
http://www.dennisjustice.com/news2.html maybe your interests lay in the political field and changing the landscape of teachers.
Or could it be http://www.dennisjustice.com/news5.html I am getting confused at this stage
I also found an open letter to President Obama (I type "Dennis Justice BCS" into google only to find the letter is no longer there. Did you get your public audience with him? You seemed to have the ultimate fix for the College Football playoffs as well. (I would have thought that they have experts that would have loved to hear your thoughts)
Seems to me that you have a history of creating little websites (that all kind of look the same by the way) anytime you think of a cause that you feel you have the answer too.
Maybe you are James Dean come back to life and you are the Rebel with out a clue??
If you have issues them voice them by all means but stop countering with the sole idea of being the self promoter that you are. Your ideas are not really that good to be honest. OUR sport has a funny way of spotting people like you that are in it only for themselves and they don't tend to last long.
Why don't you see if you can get a team together and see if you can actually run a single team before you think about a league. I would have thought that a guy with all your "sports marketing skills" would be able do that in your sleep?
Like I said, you can't say anything positive unless it revolves around an idea you had.
You know, maybe politics is the best career for you after all.

 

[brooksy19]

Well said Spinner.

Just from reading this guys posts it pretty obvious he is jealous that his start up comp won't reach the success you guys have the potential to achieve.

Wish you all the best.

 

[roopy]

I think 11 a side played on highschool gridiron fields in the gridiron off season is a brilliant concept.
I support all league in america, and hope personalities don't get in the way of what seems like a free way to use existing facilities and get young people into the game.