US Presidential election 2016, pt 2. The quadrennial comedy show.

Discussion in 'Four Corners' started by sensesmaybenumbed, May 20, 2016.

  1. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! Coach

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    That demographic would be white then.....

    Fact Checker: Are black or white offenders more likely to kill police?

    'From 1980 to 2013, there were 2,269 officers killed in felonious incidents, and 2,896 offenders. The racial breakdown of offenders over the 33-year period was on par with the 10-year period: 52 percent were white, and 41 percent were black.'

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...t-checker-police-killings-20150110-story.html

    Interesting that you advocate shooting innocent black people.....

    Is this what the Right has come to....

    US police officer caught telling woman ‘we only kill black people’

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...e/news-story/3d6f1a07b0a6b4988987ee9f5dfe793f

    People were up in arms when ONE Aussie woman was shot.....
     
  2. Canard

    Canard Coach

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    So your totally out of the closet, Alien now?
     
  3. butchmcdick

    butchmcdick Guest

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  4. 2_Smoking_Guns

    2_Smoking_Guns First Grade

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    lol.... disrespect is dependant on whether or not you're being paid to stand there.... is there penalty rates provided if you put your hand on your heart..??
     
  5. Pete Cash

    Pete Cash Immortal

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    It's literally the exact same compound. There is an argument that it's uptake has a larger reinforcement effect but cocaine in itself has that issue.

    It was a moral panic
    Meth isnt similar to crack at all (well i guess they are both uppers). It would be more like if smoked meth attracted a different sentence to snorted meth which is the primary difference between crack and cocaine

    Oh and also poor blacks smoked meth and rich white people snorted it
     
  6. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! Coach

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    Was watching this the other day and wondering how times have changed....

    Blues Brothers would be decried today as antifa.....

     
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  7. SBD82

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    I would say that meth is very similar to crack. Not in a chemical compound sense, but for the reasons I listed above as well as the impact long term use can have on physical and mental health.
     
  8. Pete Cash

    Pete Cash Immortal

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    Are there many drugs that attract a different sentences based on how the person was going to use it.

    The federal code sentenced a person carrying 5grams of crack to the same punishment as a person carryiny 500grams of powdered cocaine. Lets look at how ridiculous this is from a logical point of view.

    As they are the same drug the yield will be pretty much in a 1.1 ratio. (Not quite 1.1 my quick calculations tell me that assuming the base is in excess it would take about 5.6 g of powdered cocaine to make 5 g of crack. Assuming 100 percent yield)

    Now as we know crack cocaine is made from powdered cocaine and a base (normally baking soda). So a man lets call him pablo could carry enough cocaine to sell to ~90 people to make 5 grams of cocaine and pablo would face the same sentence as one of the guys he was selling to.

    This is just nonsensical

    Powdered cocaine can also be injected which would be identical again to crack cocaine not just in compound but uptake.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017
  9. Pete Cash

    Pete Cash Immortal

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    And does snorted meth attract different sentences to smoked meth?
     
  10. SBD82

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    Not as far as I know. But I don't see the relevance.

    Crack is cocaine that is altered, which drastically changes the effect of the drug, including increasing addiction and propensity for violence.

    When meth is snorted it's cut with something. So it wouldn't be possible to decrease the sentence for snorting as the final product is produced from the more concentrated version, not the other way around.
     
  11. Pete Cash

    Pete Cash Immortal

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    Incorrect the difference comes from the route of administration. If i was to inject powdered cocaine it would have the same short lived fast acting high as smoked cocaine.

    This is applicable to every drug.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2017
  12. SBD82

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    My understanding of crack is that you take cocaine, and wash it in water and bicarb then reduce to rock.

    I'm not a chemist, but that sounds like changing a chemical compound to me.
     
  13. Pete Cash

    Pete Cash Immortal

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    Cocaine in nature is in the form of an ionic salt. The normal route of administration is via snorting but it can also be injected. Heating the hydrochloride salt form of cocaine to smoke it wouldnt be good as it would destroy most of the cocaine at that heat. (Its quite heat labile)

    The addition of base deprotonates the cocaine salt and puts it into its freebase form. This allows it to be easily smoked which gives it an identical effect to injected powdered cocaine. This is where the problems of abuse come in. Again though i will note that this is largely the same for all drugs. Smoking and injecting drugs gives a tremendous bang for your buck.

    It is still the same drug just in different forms.

    Going back to what i asked b dos how does it logically make sense to punish a person for 5g of crack cocaine in the same way as a guy who has 500g of powdered cocaine. When crack cocaine is "made" from powdered cocaine

    As an aside i think this is a classic example of prohibition pushing folks into more dangerous drug taking. During the prohibition of alcohol folks drank hard alcohol more because it was important to get as much booze for your dollar. Crack is an ideal way to do cocaine (not that i would generally use uppers now days) when cocaine is illegal.

    The problem with criminalisation of drugs especially when handled like it was in the 80s is that kind of f**ks the local community. I wouldn't in general recommend people use cocaine it is a tremendously addictive drug with reinforcement like a mother f**ker but i also believe that the crack problem in the 80s was largely a moral panic. The effect that crack sentencing had on the black community was pretty crazy
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2017
  14. SBD82

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    Everything I've found suggests that there are different effects on the body between crack and coke. I'd be grateful if you'd post links so that I can read more. I understand that there is a difference in the method of delivery, but I understood that there is a different effect between IV crack use and IV coke use.

    It doesn't. The only parallel I could draw would be our laws that make morphine legal and diamorphibe illegal. The reason being moral outrage and poor legislation.
    Agreed. I would decriminalize all drugs and allow addicts to seek treatment.
    Agreed. It's handled badly. As I said above I would prefer decriminalization.

    What I object to is people drawing the conclusion that this legislation is racist, when there is similar legislation targeted at meth, a drug that is mainly used in the white community. This legislation bears huge similarities in that it was a response to moral panic and sentencing is leaving kids without parents.
     
  15. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    You really are a f**king idiot if you can't tell the difference between an employer's ability to dictate the behaviour of its employees versus its customers
     
  16. 2_Smoking_Guns

    2_Smoking_Guns First Grade

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    you really are an idiot if you think disrespect is determined by whether you're on the job or not.... actually no... you're a f**king moron.... just admit you're upset that the uppity blacks don't know their place.....
     
  17. Danish

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    Still don't get it I see.

    The NFL and clubs can't do anything if fans in the stands choose to be disrespectful. They have plenty of avenues to ensure players are.

    Is that simple enough for you or should I throw some ellipses randomly between words to make it clearer?
     
  18. Bandwagon

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    I don't see how one can separate an act from another act as being disrespectful or not based upon whether or not another party is able to dictate that an act is permitted or not.

    That the players are employed by the NFL who could choose to disallow their protest ( whether that worked or not being immaterial ) in no way determines how disrespectful that act is.

    Nor does the fact that the NFL has no real control over the actions of their fans, determine whether the actions of those fans are disrespectful or not.

    I would suggest however that a peaceful protest that exercises ones 1st amendment rights is far less disrespectful to the ideals that created the USA, which after all is that which the flag and national anthem are representative of, than any attempt to curtail those rights. Or. indeed I would go as far to say as any displeasure expressed by an individual or organisation over those rights being exercised is equally disrespectful.

    Given in the SSM thread you are arguing that the only inalienable rights are those that are represented wholly by the first amendment, to the exclusion of all others, I would have thought you would agree?

    .
     
  19. Canard

    Canard Coach

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    Everything is related to money in your world. Human Rights, Respect, the right to protest.

    He who controls the money controls these issues it seems
     
  20. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    Good thing no one is claiming that then

    I agree. Not sure what your point is though?

    You don't get to protest during work hours if your employer doesn't want you to. You are giving up your rights by entering into a contract which sees your employer have domain over your actions during work hours for monetary compensation. I honestly can't believe I am having to explain this concept to you.

    Kneeling when an anthem is playing is clearly disrespecting that anthem. A protest that takes this action is trying to bring attention to its cause by taking advantage of this fact.

    If kneeling weren't disrespectful, how exactly do you think Kap would have expected his protest to garner attention?
     

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