Would you like same-sex marriage legalised?

Discussion in 'Four Corners' started by DC_fan, Aug 8, 2017.

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Would you like same-sex marriage legalised?

Poll closed Sep 7, 2017.
  1. No

    17 vote(s)
    17.9%
  2. Yes

    74 vote(s)
    77.9%
  3. Not sure

    4 vote(s)
    4.2%
  1. 2_Smoking_Guns

    2_Smoking_Guns First Grade

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    yes they are..... they're not natural rights like the examples you give but by definition they are rights..... just because you don't think everyone should have them doesn't diminish their existence....
     
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  2. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    Tell me, how does my right to education for my kids help me if I happen to live 500km from the nearest government run school?

    How about my right to healthcare in the same situation?

    How about food, water, clothing? Do I have the right to those things also?
     
  3. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    Yeah you do.

    That's why we have distance ed and flying doctors.

    Not much point in having a right to life if you don't have access to food or water or even health care.

    Who shouldn't have education and health care or a fair trial?
     
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  4. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    What a complete load of toss.

    Like the only real rights are to own a big gun.

    Your right to education or health care is not for sale. Neither is your right to a fair trial.

    You can believe in 'the right to life' all you want but it means shit without health care.

    Yes we all have a right to them.

    In fact if you fail to provide that right, you will be punished.

    Your dickhead American arguments just sound stupid here.
     
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  5. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    BTW your right to freedom of religion is qualified by law.

    So no if your religion allows you to marry 5 year olds- stiff shit.

    In that case the rights of a child trumps the rights of your freedom of religion.
     
  6. sportive cupid

    sportive cupid Referee

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    Danish,you seem to be confusing educatuon as a moral concept (or a human rigjt) and education as a service in an economic sense.

    As a moral concept education is the gaining of knowledge and deveploment of critical thinking in order to participate in society and have your need for a minimally fulfilling life met. As this is what a civil society strives for ,then it follows that such a society sees this as a priority.

    Viewed in a spr ifically economic sense education is the provision of education as a service. How that service is provided and to whom is assesses on a strict cost/benefit anaysis .So if we cant afford to educate we dont. Combined with the moral view it leads civil societies to deveoped policies for education provision which may deviate frim what is strictly most economically beneficial.

    Education as a human right is a moral concept
    Teachers providing lessins is an economic concept .

    Thats the difference
     
  7. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    The fact remains that the "rights" you think you have only extend as far as the government coffers are able to pay for them.

    The rights I think I have do not depend on anyone else in order for me to express them.

    Whose do you think are actually guaranteed?
     
  8. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    I'll stop paying my water bill then. I have a right to water after all, so I'm sure this will not be a problem.

    Woolies can get nicked as well. The government will provide food for me. It is, after all, my right.

    If you find the above ridiculous, please explain why you think that I shouldn't be able to do these things despite having an apparent "right" to food and water
     
  9. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    You are confusing me for Spock and others.

    He is the one claiming that K-12 education is a right, not me
     
  10. sportive cupid

    sportive cupid Referee

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    Im saying you are confusing the discussion.When we are discussing education as a human right we arent talking about education as a product/service in an economic sense.
    Im not confusing you with anyone.

    The K-12 discussion i will agree,isnt relevant.
     
  11. sportive cupid

    sportive cupid Referee

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    Firstly you dont have a right on behalf of your children since their claim to any human rights comes from their humanity not yours (semantics maybe ..but not really)
    But Danish is arguing is that because something is difficult to acheive then it doesnt exist.That is just not an arguement at all.

    The whole point of the world ,or individual communities identifying what is a human right is about finding ways to acheive them .It's not a Willy Wonka style ticket to success.
    Its about how we measure societies civility really.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017 at 3:58 PM
  12. 2_Smoking_Guns

    2_Smoking_Guns First Grade

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    and this is the crux of your argument... you're upset that we live in a socialist society where the government is required to collect enough taxes to ensure the rights to education and medical care are available to all.... suck shit you greedy merkin... this is the society we vote for....
     
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  13. Danish

    Danish Referee

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    You must have got that idea from the dozen or so times in this thread I’ve said that I agree with and want society to strive to supply all its citizens with education, healthcare, housing, and other services
     
  14. 2_Smoking_Guns

    2_Smoking_Guns First Grade

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    you've lost me..... by definition when what you want and agree with occurs then that means everyone has those "rights"...... so far what you have argued is the only rights are what are termed natural rights.... that is not the limitation of what defines a right.....
     
  15. Jimbo

    Jimbo Immortal

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    You're confusing rights with the benefits attached to living in a first-world democracy
     
  16. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    Well no, Danish is arguing that if you spend money on something then it isn't a right.

    Hence why gun ownership is a right whereas healthcare and education isn't.

    It's the argument of US conservatives.
     
  17. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    And we make sure those rights are guaranteed hence why they are a priority.

    And yeah the rights you think you have eg freedom of religion are dependent on others. eg when your freedom of religion infringes on the rights of others.

    This is the same bs argument put forward by Americans who think gun ownership is a right whereas health care and education isn't.
     
  18. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    Yeah the government provides you with welfare....if you're too lazy to find a tap or walk to a shop then that's just you being a dick.

    Once again what happens when you don't feed your kids.......
     
  19. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    It's the society we enjoy.

    And yet people want us to become like the basketcase USA.
     
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  20. Mr Spock!

    Mr Spock! First Grade

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    From the Australian Human Rights Commission

    Civil and political rights

    Having regard to the principles of universaility and indivisibility, the Commission supports protection of the full range of human rights for all people in Australia.

     

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