The rule changes necessary to bring fan enthusiasm back to Rugby League

[ANTiLAG]

If you sent people off or sin binned them for strips. There would be les far less strips.

I don't like strips in rugby league unless one or one.

 

[adamkungl]

So rugby league should appeal to the lowest common denominator?

Punching is the stupidest reason to watch a game of football.

The lowest common denominator claim is a myth.

People of all sorts, bogans, educated, rich, poor, young, old, men, women have always liked a sprinkling of violence with their football.

No one is suggesting a return to all out thuggery, but a bit of a scuffle in a footy game never hurt. Some of the game's great moments are built off the back of a good honest stink.

The current situation where a bloke can niggle and play dirty with no retaliation other than a jersey grab is a worse look for the game than a couple of rubbish punches being thrown. It's catty, unfair, and it's not Rugby League.

Anyway, the issue isn't sin binning blokes for fighting. It's a valid response from the referee in a lot of cases. The problem is MANDATORY sin bins. It forces players and referees into a corner and results in a worse game.

People don't watch RL specifically for punches or shoulder charges, but they added that little bit of extra excitement that is now missing. The game has been, and is continuing to be sanitised.

 

[Billythekid]

Only use the video referee on a Captain?s Challenge
Captain may be call a challenge at any break in play or try, to a limit of 1 failed challenge per half. The video ref is not used at any other time, including instances of players staying down after a contentious tackle. Successful challenges are not counted. The video referee may rule on any incident in the preceding play, including forward passes.

Don't really agree with this one and i'm not sure such a drastic change is necessary. I do think we need to limit the amount of looks a video ref can have. The video ref takes way too long and is used way too often and it's a huge detriment to the game. I'm not sure your suggestion is the answer though, we don't need to go that far. Admittedly though watching rugby league without the video ref does tend to flow much, much better.

Ruck Penalties
Have consistent, well-communicated timing allowed on holding down in the ruck.
Penalise rakes only where it is obvious and visible.

This is the biggest change i agree with that needs to be addressed. This is hugely detrimental to people viewing the game, no one really knows or understands why and how penalties are given out. It often feels random and arbitrary and this makes fans angry. You'll see the exact same tackle 100 times a game and it will be randomly penalised 4-5 times during the match, usually near the start to supposedly 'set the standard' for the match.

Penalties for strips are probably my biggest pet peeve in the game right now. It's so f*cking obvious that penalties are being blown without the refs actually having seen a strip. There should be no penalties blown unless the refs can see 100% that the ball was actually stripped, this would cut down on all the awful calls on strips. That plus the onus should be on the ball carrier to hold the ball, i'm sick of seeing penalties because blown because a ball was dropped by a player not holding it properly.

Games are won and lost by penalties nowadays so having such unreliable and unpredictable penalties blown is very frustrating.

Only allow penalty kick options for dangerous foul play, professional fouls or repeat infringements
Dangerous foul play includes high tackles, dangerous throws, and other dangerous contact rules.
Ruck penalties, offsides, and similar penalties will only result in a tap restart, unless after a repeat infringement warning. Further infringements result in a sin bin.
50/50 calls are treated less harshly. Repeat incidents more harshly. Attacking teams less likely to get an easy march downfield.
The vast majority of fan and coach frustration over penalty counts is based on 50/50 ruck penalties.

Don't know if i agree with this exactly and i don't think it could ever happen but i do agree that a change to the penalty reward system could work wonders. Not every penalty deserves to be a kick for touch, it's simply to big of a reward and it has got to the point where it decides matches. I'm not really a fan of penalty goals for the most part either but i don't know the solution.

Repeal the shoulder charge ban
It is not in the spirit of the game and results in farcical soft penalties on an almost weekly basis.
If a shoulder charge results in head contact or late contact the tackle is penalised and placed on report.

Agreed. If someone does a dangerous shoulder charge they should be penalised accordingly (i.e VERY harshly). This is never going to happen though. What should happen is the rule should be enforced properly, a lot of the penalties given are not actually shoulder charges.

Repeal the mandatory sin bin on fighting
Sin bins or send offs are applied according to the referees discretion.
The current situation of niggling and jersey grabbing is not in the spirit of the game. Nor should all out brawling ever be tolerated.

Can't happen, won't happen. I think it's a really dumb rule but it's barely worth discussing because it can never change. I agree though that slowly softening up the game is actually having an impact on fan interest.

Encourage referees to use the sin bin and send off
Sin bin is for professional fouls, repeat infringements or contrary conduct.
Send off is for foul play resulting in the victim being seriously injured or severe contrary conduct.
Actually use them as they are intended.

I agree they should be used more but i can see this back firing. Sin bins and send offs can ruin matches so i don't want them being over used.

Simplify the rules around try scoring - obstructions and put downs
Was the defending team prevented from making a fair tackle?
Did the try scorer place the ball down?
Keep it simple.

For the most part i think it's more a case of just enforcing the rules properly. We continue to get the most baffling decisions which make you wonder if video refs have ever seen a rule book let alone watched RL before.

Repeal the 7 tackle set rule after a dead in-goal kick
It?s ridiculous and unnecessary. A 20m tap is already a valid reward. No more needs to be said.

Not sure i agree here tbh, i like kickers being punished for putting the ball dead.

Remove golden point from regular matches
A tied game at full time of a regular match results in a draw.
A tied game at full time of a representative or finals match results in 5 minutes of extra time each way. If a game is drawn at the end of extra time, only then is golden point played.

In my experience most fans find golden point exciting and i'd be surprised if this wasn't reflected in the ratings. I can't see it getting taken out and i'm not sure i'd want it to be.

 

[adamkungl]

In my experience most fans find golden point exciting and i'd be surprised if this wasn't reflected in the ratings. I can't see it getting taken out and i'm not sure i'd want it to be.

Can the possibility of golden point game really have a significant effect on ratings, given that it's occurence is highly unlikely?

This idea is more in the interest of fairness than fan engagement. Most people agree that golden point is at least a little unfair, given there's no right of reply and no reward for tying a game at full time.

Rather than further complicate things with golden try or whatever, I prefer the simpler option.

 

[chrisD]

So rugby league should appeal to the lowest common denominator?

The lowest common denominator? You mean the Daily Telegraph? Rugby League did allow the lowest common denominator, Phil Buzz Rothfield, to dictate the shoulder charge rules.

 

[Billythekid]

Can the possibility of golden point game really have a significant effect on ratings, given that it's occurence is highly unlikely?

This idea is more in the interest of fairness than fan engagement. Most people agree that golden point is at least a little unfair, given there's no right of reply and no reward for tying a game at full time.

Rather than further complicate things with golden try or whatever, I prefer the simpler option.

Honestly i'm happy with or without it, i don't think it's a major problem with the game right now. Personally i kind of liked the idea of just letting teams go another 10 minutes or whatever and deciding the winner at the end. I also enjoyed the days of just having a draw. Compared to some of the other things in this thread i consider it a minor issue.

 

[Pete Cash]

I miss the shoulder charge but I understand that as soon as the nrl was given medical advice to ban it they really had no choice.

 

[grandorient]

Quite frankly, I'd like to see the 6 tackle rule, increased to 8 tackles.

GO

 

[adamkungl]

I miss the shoulder charge but I understand that as soon as the nrl was given medical advice to ban it they really had no choice.

They really did have a choice. Don't believe it was anything other than an image issue. The data used to justify it was completely farcical.

AFL NFL NHL all allow shoulder charges and worse.

 

[MarkC]

My thoughts:-


1. Only use the video ref on Captain's Challenge.

Agree - add in goal judges, the ref makes a call on the field at that stands unless challenged by the captain. This would speed the game up.

2. Clear up ruck penalties.

Agree. - But I mainly see this as reducing the wrestle, if you allow too much wrestle you are going to get inconsistencies.
Perhaps - enforce the simple rule - the tacklers must release the player after the ref calls held, the play must stand before playing the ball. If a tackler prevents the attacking player from standing via any means that is a penalty.
It is never going to be perfect, but it is something that needs more work.


3. Only allow penalty kicks for dangerous foul play, professional fouls or repeat infringements.

Good Idea. I am thinking that for other infringements there is no kick for the line, the tackle count is simply reset. But you also then need the Sin Bin for repeated infringements particularly defending at their end.
For 1st penalty in own 20 in a sequence of sets, is a warning, 2nd penalty is an immediate power play sin bin. The player is off for 5 minutes, but can come back on after a try is scored or their team gets possession.

4 & 5. Shoulder Charge Bin and Mandatory Sin Binning for fighting

Disagree - the game needs to move with the times, there is still plenty of room for physical contact.

6. Simplify the rules around try scoring and obstruction.

I don't think there is an issue, if we agree on point 1.
The ref can simply call it as they see it, now it only goes to the video ref if there is a captains challenge.
You are never going to get a perfectly consistent ruling, the new video bunker may help.

7. Repeal the 7 Tackle rule

Half-agree - the current rule punishes poor kicks or negative tactics, but perhaps it should be more limited. Only for kicks that go over the dead ball line or touch in goal and are kicked from outside the 20. That way attacking kicks are not penalized.

8. Remove Golden point from regular matches.

Disagree, but it needs changing as follows:-
1) Win in normal time - 3 points.
2) GP win with field goal - 2 points.
3) GP win with try - 3 points.
4) GP loss with field goal - 1 point.
5) GP loss conceding a try- 0 points.
6) Draw after GP - 1 point.
This would more accurately reward teams for their effort in the match, it would create an incentive to try for a try in GP.

 

[oldmancraigy]

Bring in the captains challenge for sure, but just make an unsuccessful challenge result in the loss of an interchange.
Reduce the number of interchanges (to, say, 10?). Keep the video referee, but leave him to the Captains challenge.

Dunno why people get upset about the video ref? Isn't it better to get it right?

 

[betcats]

Honestly the refs are so f**ked, its whinging fans/coaches/commentators that have gotten us to this point but right now they are shockingly inconsistent. Even in the same game you see a rule applied two different ways. Like milking and ruck penalties, who the f**k knows when they are going to call it?

 

[mepelthwack]

Gotta laugh at people saying we need less video ref or no video ref. It's 2015 people embrace the freakin technology, don't move backwards, move forwards. So a game stops for a minute while things are checked to get a decision right, it's a small price to pay to get the right decision I can't understand why anyone wouldn't want the right decision.

Generally agree with a lot of the TCs ideas.

If we are gonna keep it simple then I'll say if a pass is forward its forward none of this but it went backwards out of the hands rubbish. Let everyone allow for the floating forward by actually having to take care to not allow that, lest it be deemed forward.

I think 2 captains failed challenges per half is better than 1 and for anything they like to challenge, not just tries.

I'd prefer in try situations a ref doesn't say try or no try and give the vid ref the chance to rule without that initial influence. If the ref says I have an opinion that's fine it can end up refs call as it used to. If the ref says he isn't sure either way and the video ref is the same then no try.

Totally agree on scrapping golden point in regular season matches. Completely unnecessary. Draws are great.

I can see some merit in going back to the old 5 metre defence rule but not sure. Part of me thinks it would force the attack to pass more stopping the boring 5 hit ups but like I said I'm not sure.

I'd be up for halves having to throw the ball in front of the closest props foot in scrums. Obviously the feeding side still has a huge advantage but just that slight bigger chance of a scrum win against the head would be better for the game.

 

[adamkungl]

Bring in the captains challenge for sure, but just make an unsuccessful challenge result in the loss of an interchange.
Reduce the number of interchanges (to, say, 10?). Keep the video referee, but leave him to the Captains challenge.

Dunno why people get upset about the video ref? Isn't it better to get it right?

It's frustrating to see *every* try go upstairs. And compounding the problem is the video refs coming up with absolute howlers on a regular basis.

Fans can understand human error when it's on the fly. There's no excuse when the bloke's had a thousand looks at it and every man and his dog can see he's wrong.

 

[Billythekid]

Gotta laugh at people saying we need less video ref or no video ref. It's 2015 people embrace the freakin technology, don't move backwards, move forwards. So a game stops for a minute while things are checked to get a decision right, it's a small price to pay to get the right decision I can't understand why anyone wouldn't want the right decision.

The problem is they don't make the right call. Time and time again we see the video refs f*cking up even the most basic of calls. I also disagree that the time wasted is a small price to pay. There are games where it completely ruins the flow of the match. They simply don't need to take that long.

 

[betcats]

Bring in the captains challenge for sure, but just make an unsuccessful challenge result in the loss of an interchange.
Reduce the number of interchanges (to, say, 10?). Keep the video referee, but leave him to the Captains challenge.

Dunno why people get upset about the video ref? Isn't it better to get it right?

How much of the game do you sacrifice to get it right? There are refs who check everything to the detriment of the flow of the game, it becomes a stoppage fest which bores fans and just kills the atmosphere of the game.

Add to that there are still vid ref calls every week that leave fans scratching their heads. And finally when you are sure they have got something wrong Archer or whoever comes out with some new interpretation of the rule that means it was an ok call. We see loose groundings and obstructions denied in one game and very similar instances awarded in another game based off what the on field ref sent it up as, things like that are what really kills fans.

 

[adamkungl]

You're never going to get the right call 100% of the time.

So how can we respond to this problem?

We can get more and more complicated (referees bunker) and slow (check almost every single try no matter how obvious) with limited effect - the current strategy.

Or we can aim to maximise entertainment value. Do the best we can within reason while still preserving the flow of the game. The Captains challenge gives a team an avenue in response to an important call while keeping game slowdown to a minimum.

 

[redvscotty]

Absolutely must bring back the shoulder charge!
I have lost so much enthusiasm for the game since that went out to the point where i dont go to games as much or follow games on tv when souths dont play.

This is a joke post yeah?

7 tackle from restart is shit. Needs to go.

Quick taps should be taken from any penalty, by the person who was involved in the penalty. If Nightingale was held down too long, he can tap it. It it's George Rose who was tackled then he must tap it. No passing to another player to tap and run.

Penalty goals, 1 point. Any penalty within range is able to be kicked.

2 refs can stay, but get rid of this 'I've got a try, check grounding'. Too many guesses. The Union style is preferred. If you dont know, you don't know. Video refs can have a look for you and determine the outcome of the try.

Are the video refs still watching on 10cm monitors in black and white? If so, appalling.

 

[betcats]

You're never going to get the right call 100% of the time.

So how can we respond to this problem?

We can get more and more complicated (referees bunker) and slow (check almost every single try no matter how obvious) with limited effect - the current strategy.

Or we can aim to maximise entertainment value. Do the best we can within reason while still preserving the flow of the game. The Captains challenge gives a team an avenue in response to an important call while keeping game slowdown to a minimum.

Exactly we should not be sacrificing the entertainment value of the game just so we can chase an unachievable goal of getting every call right. Fans and media will whinge about incorrect calls no doubt but this is where it takes strong leadership to deal with that shit.

 

[adamkungl]

Similarly, we should not be sacrificing the entertainment value of the game to chase the unachievable goal of getting every soccer mum onboard with rugby league...