Legacy of the 'big 3'

[Pete Cash]

1 premiership is shit considering that spine but the winning percentage is close to or above 70% over that period which no other team comes close to.

Its hard to win premierships these days. Even when the storm were a million dollars over the cap they only won 2. Even that extremely good Manly side of the 00s "only" won 2 premierships.

When your lot cheated the cap the best you could do out of it was one win a few years later.

The best run in the NRL era is the 3 premierships the Broncos won between 98 and 06.

 

[Pedge1971]

By far the club of the decade, this is beyond doubt. At least they actually were successful when they cheated unlike the eels and the pep heads.

Successfully cheated. Actually they did not even do that very well. Blight on the game.

 

[sensesmaybenumbed]

Do you feel the same about the Sharks premiership last year?

I meant, they're drug cheats - is the 2016 premiership officially tainted?

You can't hang on the salary cap cheating of 7-11 years ago as a reason to believe the premierships after the fact or illegitimate.

Whether you acknowledge this and like is irrelevant.

Is it? Or do you seriously believe it's provable beyond doubt that Smith would never have gone to the Titans instead of suddenly staying in Melbourne?

The stink remains. Pointing at the Sharks and trying to change the topic is pathetic. The storm will always have a stink about them and any achievements they have as long as players involved in Salary cap infringements remain there.

The only solution for clubs caught cheating the cap at that level is a complete cleanout of all players there by the NRL and being forced to build a team from scratch under the cap again. Deciding how, who and when the infringing team sheds players to comply with the cap is not a luxury of choice the guilty organisation deserves.

 

[Cherry_poppins]

Is it? Or do you seriously believe it's provable beyond doubt that Smith would never have gone to the Titans instead of suddenly staying in Melbourne?

The stink remains. Pointing at the Sharks and trying to change the topic is pathetic. The storm will always have a stink about them and any achievements they have as long as players involved in Salary cap infringements remain there.

The only solution for clubs caught cheating the cap at that level is a complete cleanout of all players there by the NRL and being forced to build a team from scratch under the cap again. Deciding how, who and when the infringing team sheds players to comply with the cap is not a luxury of choice the guilty organisation deserves.

Sounds fair to me

 

[Pete Cash]

No team has been forced to do that and plenty have systematically cheated the cap before.

We lost my favourite ever player to a club cheating the cap in wiki. The raiders were seriously over the cap in 91 and not expected to do anything but get under the cap.

The tv broadcasters would chuck the shits if some team was completely destroyed to that level. Secondly the contracts have been signed so to speak. Say if player a signed for 200k with the storm for 2 years he is entitled to that contract is he not. The nrl cannot (to my knowledge) just say no contract for you.

Thirdly if all contracts could be voided so Melbourne had to start from scratch how could the nrl stop them from just re-signing all their players. Can the nrl stop a now out of contract Cameron Smith from going to melbourne legally ? Outside of the moral issues of forbidding a professional from offering his services legally to whoever he wants.

The ideal punishment if one wants to hurt salary cap cheats is to force them to play for x amount of years on a reduced cap. Its up to them to clear out players but they cant win points until they get under that value.

I dont really give a shit if the gold coast would have signed Smith and neither does the nrl. Only a fool thinks the nrl has a salary cap in place to even out the comp. Its a by product but not the purpose. If this was the case they would crack down on tpa abuse. Its simply to stop clubs going broke.

 

[Cherry_poppins]

No team has been forced to do that and plenty have systematically cheated the cap before.

We lost my favourite ever player to a club cheating the cap in wiki. The raiders were seriously over the cap in 91 and not expected to do anything but get under the cap.

The tv broadcasters would chuck the shits if some team was completely destroyed to that level. Secondly the contracts have been signed so to speak. Say if player a signed for 200k with the storm for 2 years he is entitled to that contract is he not. The nrl cannot (to my knowledge) just say no contract for you.

Thirdly if all contracts could be voided so Melbourne had to start from scratch how could the nrl stop them from just re-signing all their players. Can the nrl stop a now out of contract Cameron Smith from going to melbourne legally ? Outside of the moral issues of forbidding a professional from offering his services legally to whoever he wants.

The ideal punishment if one wants to hurt salary cap cheats is to force them to play for x amount of years on a reduced cap. Its up to them to clear out players but they cant win points until they get under that value.

I dont really give a shit if the gold coast would have signed Smith and neither does the nrl. Only a fool thinks the nrl has a salary cap in place to even out the comp. Its a by product but not the purpose. If this was the case they would crack down on tpa abuse. Its simply to stop clubs going broke.

So you don't like the idea of a cheating pack off cheats being utterly gutted because your team is also a pack of cheats

Manly has been f**ked by cheats twice, the steroid cheats should've been banned for life but were slapped on the wrist

The cap cheats were also slapped on the wrist, the grubs even have the audacity to celebrate they won whilst cheating, not only that they had to deliberately knock out the star player of their opposition, the merkins tried it again in 08 too

 

[myrrh ken]

What about the calves blood injecting cheats? They got found out after winning a gf. Hmmm.

But the sport scientist was pretty above board

 

[The Beaver]

What about the calves blood injecting cheats? They got found out after winning a gf. Hmmm.

But the sport scientist was pretty above board

Nice try champ. Players are only allowed to have steak "well done" now?

 

[Pete Cash]

So you don't like the idea of a cheating pack off cheats being utterly gutted because your team is also a pack of cheats

Manly has been f**ked by cheats twice, the steroid cheats should've been banned for life but were slapped on the wrist

The cap cheats were also slapped on the wrist, the grubs even have the audacity to celebrate they won whilst cheating, not only that they had to deliberately knock out the star player of their opposition, the merkins tried it again in 08 too

I think the punishment should be more or less consistent.

But outside of that there are legal issues with sensemaybenumbered plan. All the Melbourne players are legally entitled to the contracts they signed. Making melbourne start again would be a huge pain in the arse for the nrl. They (or melbourne) would have to supplement a ton of players making the salary cap moot anyway.

No way could the nrl have found clubs to pick up every melbourne player at cost. Clubs already fly close to the salary cap as is. Sure the at the time big 4 would be no problem. They would probably end up making more money funnily enough but the entire melbourne side nah bro.

 

[ANTiLAG]

I think the punishment should be more or less consistent.

But outside of that there are legal issues with sensemaybenumbered plan. All the Melbourne players are legally entitled to the contracts they signed. Making melbourne start again would be a huge pain in the arse for the nrl. They (or melbourne) would have to supplement a ton of players making the salary cap moot anyway.

No way could the nrl have found clubs to pick up every melbourne player at cost. Clubs already fly close to the salary cap as is. Sure the at the time big 4 would be no problem. They would probably end up making more money funnily enough but the entire melbourne side nah bro.

Nice thinking Pete, but its actually worse than you envision. News Limited and the Storm would have been left to payout the full contracts (overs and all) as its obligations to the players. NRL players are non assignable without the player's consent, that is why clubs are unable to freely trade players like you see in MLB where a players turns up to find that this week they're playing for a club in another city miles away.

The obligation on contractors to mitigate losses does not extend to moving cities and states. Soooooo,
the big 4 (or the big 3) could have agreed to all play for Brisbane or the Titans - all on minimum pay salary contracts, while the Storm had to pay their full contract minus the minimum. This then leaves the new club in an even better squad and legal cap position than the Storm who were cheating over the cap,

This is a scenario the NRL could not reasonably let happen for the sake of its fans.

In terms of fans' resentment of the rort, the NRL did well to get the big 4 down to 3 in the face of restraint of trade restrictions.

 

[typicalfan]

You cannot prove Smith doesn't sign for the Titans but you cannot prove he used the Titans for anything other than the same reason as DCE used them.

I think the NRL handled the Storm situation better than the Dogs. If I remember rightly the dogs lost no one and actually gained Andrew Ryan.

 

[thorson1987]

You cannot prove Smith doesn't sign for the Titans but you cannot prove he used the Titans for anything other than the same reason as DCE used them.

I think the NRL handled the Storm situation better than the Dogs. If I remember rightly the dogs lost no one and actually gained Andrew Ryan.

NRL allowed dogs players to take pay cuts.

IIRC our guys value against the salary cap was adjusted up to include all the extras they were getting.

 

[Stormwarrior82]

What I find amusing is the ones complaining the most are manly and parra supporters. Manly were injecting there players with goat semen or something in 08 and then had Hubert spiking drinks in 2011. Parra well, we all know there issues. Every club has had problems in the past and so it's funny that everyone is throwing shade about this subject. I think greenbergs words should extend to most on here. "It's time for the game to grow up". Harping on incidents that happened 10+ yrs ago are immature at best. Players signing contract upgrades isn't anything new but the storm brass keeping and submitting different contracts is the issue. Hardly a player issue. But I am more than happy to disagree with people's opinion. What is good though, is the fact that most people/fans can see these 3 players for what they are. Genuine superstars. From a stats point of view they have smashed most records out of the park and continue to do so. In there positions they have each changed or added a skill set, that up and coming players are now expect to have. Off the field they are genuine nice blokes and a credit to the nrl.

The hate on these blokes from things that happened 10yrs ago, out of there control and instigated from the top of the club is unfair and smacks of jealousy.

 

[footy75]

More tears...so much salt.

 

[Stormwarrior82]

I'm extremely butt hurt Smith doesn't play for the Titans.
From all accounts he was all but wrapped up until an extra contract was thrown in front of his 'manager'.
The Titans could have used a smarmy merkin to get the refs onside over the past 10 years.

Ok and that's fine you feel like that. Your statement shows that you are holding onto a contract issue for over 10yrs that he may or may not of even taken. It might be good for you to grow up. You are completely disregarding his impact and football ability due to this inherent bias.

 

[Incorrect]

As a Parra fan, it's just a bit galling that the timing of the systemic cap rorting by the Storm came to light when it did... What I mean is, look at the Dragons in 2010, they got to win their premiership but didn't play against what was essentially the same cheating team that Parra and Manly did in 09 and 07 respectively because the cheating was uncovered in early season 2010, the Storm were stripped of points and banned from playing for points so the Dragons, rightfully and good luck to them, did not have to compete against them in the finals...

I'll be one of the first to admit that Parra making the GF in 2009 was on the back of one of the most unprecedented spurts of brilliance from 1 player ever seen over a 10 week period, and they were not "one of the best teams all season" which is something the Dragons probably were in 2010 - but if the rorting had come to light in late July or early August 2009 and the Storm were stripped of points then, everything changes I know and maybe Parra wouldn't have been there anyway, but whoever made the GF that year if the Storm weren't there would be classified as premiership winners instead of just an asterisk on the trophy saying No Winner....

 

[sensesmaybenumbed]

I think the punishment should be more or less consistent.

But outside of that there are legal issues with sensemaybenumbered plan. All the Melbourne players are legally entitled to the contracts they signed. Making melbourne start again would be a huge pain in the arse for the nrl. They (or melbourne) would have to supplement a ton of players making the salary cap moot anyway.

No way could the nrl have found clubs to pick up every melbourne player at cost. Clubs already fly close to the salary cap as is. Sure the at the time big 4 would be no problem. They would probably end up making more money funnily enough but the entire melbourne side nah bro.

It sends a message to brutal to ignore. If it wrecks a club, that's the warning to all the rest.

Don't cheat.

 

[TheVelourFog]

Melbourne cheated, got caught and got punished, fair enough

the only thing I have a problem with is the stripping of Premierships

everyone knows they won on the day and the dickheads who go on about 'Melbourne only won 2' whenever it comes up are tiresome

 

[Cherry_poppins]

What I find amusing is the ones complaining the most are manly and parra supporters. Manly were injecting there players with goat semen or something in 08 and then had Hubert spiking drinks in 2011. Parra well, we all know there issues. Every club has had problems in the past and so it's funny that everyone is throwing shade about this subject. I think greenbergs words should extend to most on here. "It's time for the game to grow up". Harping on incidents that happened 10+ yrs ago are immature at best. Players signing contract upgrades isn't anything new but the storm brass keeping and submitting different contracts is the issue. Hardly a player issue. But I am more than happy to disagree with people's opinion. What is good though, is the fact that most people/fans can see these 3 players for what they are. Genuine superstars. From a stats point of view they have smashed most records out of the park and continue to do so. In there positions they have each changed or added a skill set, that up and coming players are now expect to have. Off the field they are genuine nice blokes and a credit to the nrl.

The hate on these blokes from things that happened 10yrs ago, out of there control and instigated from the top of the club is unfair and smacks of jealousy.

Calves blood was entirely legal as any effect it had was merely placebo, it was injected into muscle

It's not like having 2 star players more than the rest of the competition

As for Parramatta well they gave it a good old Melbourne crack but have zero eye for talent

It's not like manly are the Chris Benoit's of the NRL (a fitting body for cam Smith i might add)

 

[thorson1987]

Melbourne cheated, got caught and got punished, fair enough

the only thing I have a problem with is the stripping of Premierships

everyone knows they won on the day and the dickheads who go on about 'Melbourne only won 2' whenever it comes up are tiresome

I have no issue with the stripping of the premierships.

Yeah we won the games on the day, but they mean nothing now. I refuse to watch when the games are replayed on Fox, and haven't taken the dvds out of the case since 2010.

As far as I'm concerned those games never happened, except for the trolling that can be done by pointing out that we have won 4 grand finals instead of 2.