Grand finalists in the NRL vs AFL for the last 21 Years....

[Perth Red]

I hate the storm , with a passion , but respect their success , they got it right from day one.
Just because Melbournians haven't embraced them the same way the Swans & Lions have been by sports fans in their home cities means nothing. It says more about them then the Storm.

A massive migration of Victorians to SE Qld certainly & Sydney to a lesser extent took place in the early 80's & still plays a huge factor in game day attendances for both sides.
Nothing like that in Melb for the Storm.

Like most businesses its also a question of investment. The AFL invests close to $150million a year in Qlnd and NSw combined. The NRL invests around $15million in Victoria.

 

[SBD82]

Y’all should f**k off back to the expansion thread.

 

[no name]

One of the reasons I chose them in '99 was because they took over a load of Reds players, Jnrs and staff, and I want the game to grow beyond its historical confines.
Storm weren't responsible for the demise of the Reds. That was on ARL and News Ltd heads.

The ARL brought the Reds in and then the Reds turn around 18 months later and sign with Super League.
Make your own bed and all that.

 

[Perth Red]

The ARL brought the Reds in and then the Reds turn around 18 months later and sign with Super League.
Make your own bed and all that.

Lets not go there, again. lol

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Salty insular Bogans who can't stand to see the game expanded and can't give credit to where its due.

It's 'expand'!

Did you even finish school?

I do see the irony in some one as uneducated as you calling other people 'bogans'.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

I hate the storm , with a passion , but respect their success , they got it right from day one.
Just because Melbournians haven't embraced them the same way the Swans & Lions have been by sports fans in their home cities means nothing. It says more about them then the Storm.

A massive migration of Victorians to SE Qld certainly & Sydney to a lesser extent took place in the early 80's & still plays a huge factor in game day attendances for both sides.
Nothing like that in Melb for the Storm.

Queensland and NSW had an established grassroots system for AwFuL to build their teams around.

The ARL never built a base for the game in the southern states. If they had have built a foundation at the junior level then the Storm might have made some serious inroads by now. The problem for the ARLC is the Victorian Gov and local councils will never embrace our game at the grassroots level. They'll take an Origin or Test for bragging rights, but they don't want to fund junior football. This is a serious issue that needs to be taken into consideration when expanding the game. A house without steady foundations will topple over during bad weather. The Storm have never been through a lean period, so we cannot say their sustainability isn't in doubt.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Never heard of new market acquisition? You think McDondalds said, 'lets just stay in America as shtty hamburgers are popular here'?
Reality is the game isnt really growing where it is popular. Its been static in pretty much every key indicator for twenty years in its heartlands. If you want to grow the game you need to make it popular in new markets.

McDonald's didn't close down their American stores to fund new ones in areas that are hostile to their type of food. You won't see Macca's stores in suburbs that are full of hippies and vegans. There are plenty of them in suburbs that have people who will eat anything meaty and cheesy and, don't have to cook it themselves.

The Adelaide, Melbourne and Perth expansion model relies on the world's second largest RL city, Brisbane, being limited to having no more than 2 teams or a reduction of teams in the largest RL city, which would be horrible for the game and a massive leg up for AwFuL.

I think you just want to weaken the game in Brisbane and Sydney so England can have a chance in Tests.

 

[baselinepanther]

Like most businesses its also a question of investment. The AFL invests close to $150million a year in Qlnd and NSw combined. The NRL invests around $15million in Victoria.

They did , they haven't in 2020 & probably can't in 2021 with scores of development officers in NSW & QLD layed off this year. Who knows when they will able to invest like this again. The NRL on the other hand won't be as affected.
Also one could argue about the results the 10 times investment has delivered. I have grave fears for the Giants & Suns ... & even the Swans , all are going to be seriously knocked around by this horrendous year & lack of $$ coming in & the reduced ability of the AFL to meet the shortfall.

Again, not as big an issue with the NRL & its only expansion team & a much smaller spend.

 

[Foreign Legion]

Gee better not mention the Dragons 12 straight wins...

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

They did , they haven't in 2020 & probably can't in 2021 with scores of development officers in NSW & QLD layed off this year. Who knows when they will able to invest like this again. The NRL on the other hand won't be as affected.
Also one could argue about the results the 10 times investment has delivered. I have grave fears for the Giants & Suns ... & even the Swans , all are going to be seriously knocked around by this horrendous year & lack of $$ coming in & the reduced ability of the AFL to meet the shortfall.

Again, not as big an issue with the NRL & its only expansion team & a much smaller spend.

Great post.

AwFuL has never been tested the way the ARL was during Super League. They've had a cosy run that's allowed them to build a massive house on shaky foundations. It could all come crashing down if COVID-19 continues like this for another couple of years.

 

[Travitoh]

I think that the AFL's player draft is a significant equaliser for their competition and warrants serious consideration from the NRL.
Also worth consideration is that the previous decade contained a notable anomaly in the standard AFL Premiership cycle with the introduction of the Suns and Giants. The nascent clubs sucked the majority of priority draft picks for a number of years which allowed Hawthorn, Geelong and the Swans to sit at the top for longer as the rest of the pack weren't getting the draft picks to close the gap.

In the past 16 years, only 12.5% of NRL teams (Gold Coast and Newcastle) haven't made a GF.

Over the last 18 years, 28% of AFL teams (Carlton, Essendon, Melbourne, Nth Melbourne and Gold Coast) have failed to make a GF.

The draft being a great equaliser is a myth.

 

[baselinepanther]

In the past 16 years, only 12.5% of NRL teams (Gold Coast and Newcastle) haven't made a GF.

Over the last 18 years, 28% of AFL teams (Carlton, Essendon, Melbourne, Nth Melbourne and Gold Coast) have failed to make a GF.

The draft being a great equaliser is a myth.

Its a myth because the AFL compromises its own rules to give its expansion sides more money to spend on the cap & priority draft picks out of order & have done for over 30 years. Heaven help you if you're a struggling heartland based club in that code.

 

[The_Frog]

Gee better not mention the Dragons 12 straight wins...

11 actually, but regardless a period of stagnation for the game at a time the rest of the economy was experiencing unprecedented growth.

 

[baselinepanther]

In the past 16 years, only 12.5% of NRL teams (Gold Coast and Newcastle) haven't made a GF.

Over the last 18 years, 28% of AFL teams (Carlton, Essendon, Melbourne, Nth Melbourne and Gold Coast) have failed to make a GF.

The draft being a great equaliser is a myth.

also , no NRL side has failed to make the prelim final in the NRL era with both Newcastle making it in 2013 & The Titans in 2010

while in the AFL , I think only Melbourne has in that list of clubs there in the last 18 years

so 100% of NRL sides have made the prelim & only 75% of AFL sides since 2003

 

[Valheru]

In the past 16 years, only 12.5% of NRL teams (Gold Coast and Newcastle) haven't made a GF.

Over the last 18 years, 28% of AFL teams (Carlton, Essendon, Melbourne, Nth Melbourne and Gold Coast) have failed to make a GF.

The draft being a great equaliser is a myth.

You are right but probably best to use the same time frame when making such a comparison.

From 2011-2020 (10 full seasons) The NRL has had 11 different teams make the GF as opposed to the AFL with 10 (from a pool of 18).

 

[Big Moose]

I hate the storm , with a passion , but respect their success , they got it right from day one.
Just because Melbournians haven't embraced them the same way the Swans & Lions have been by sports fans in their home cities means nothing. It says more about them then the Storm.

A massive migration of Victorians to SE Qld certainly & Sydney to a lesser extent took place in the early 80's & still plays a huge factor in game day attendances for both sides.
Nothing like that in Melb for the Storm.

Spot on. You cannot blame the Storm for the pretty average support in comparison to the expansion clubs like the Lions and Swans. The club itself has probably done all it can. There is a perpetual hate for RL in the Melbourne media, which is a 24/7 AFL propoganda machine who are even telling us that all the AFL games are outrating league in Brisbane head to head.
SE Qld is a huge lure for Victorian expats, I don’t know of many Qld’ers that have packed up to live in Melbourne definitely not in big numbers. Things like that impact growth but overall the NRL itself doesn’t lobby the government funds to build the grass roots like the AFL do. The AFL have long had a dubious relationship with government to obtain funding.

 

[mongoose]

Spot on. You cannot blame the Storm for the pretty average support in comparison to the expansion clubs like the Lions and Swans. The club itself has probably done all it can. There is a perpetual hate for RL in the Melbourne media, which is a 24/7 AFL propoganda machine who are even telling us that all the AFL games are outrating league in Brisbane head to head.
SE Qld is a huge lure for Victorian expats, I don’t know of many Qld’ers that have packed up to live in Melbourne definitely not in big numbers. Things like that impact growth but overall the NRL itself doesn’t lobby the government funds to build the grass roots like the AFL do. The AFL have long had a dubious relationship with government to obtain funding.

The Swans and Lions have taken advantage of specific circumstances in those 2 cities which the Storm haven't been able to in Melbourne. Firstly there was superleague but also Brisbane and especially Sydney have the class divide between League and Union. Melbourne is much more unified where everyone culturally supports AFL. There is also the ludicrous situation where Brisbane has been a 1 team city for the best part of 30 years... explain that

It's honestly amazing how everything works in favour of AFL and rarely ever in favour of NRL....kudos to them though, they have taken their opportunities.

 

[Big Moose]

The Swans and Lions have taken advantage of specific circumstances in those 2 cities which the Storm haven't been able to in Melbourne. Firstly there was superleague but also Brisbane and especially Sydney have the class divide between League and Union. Melbourne is much more unified where everyone culturally supports AFL. There is also the ludicrous situation where Brisbane has been a 1 team city for the best part of 30 years... explain that

It's honestly amazing how everything works in favour of AFL and rarely ever in favour of NRL....kudos to them though, they have taken their opportunities.

As an ex Vic that grew up watching both thanks to the old man, I agree with everything you’ve said. That’s the part a lot of people outside Melbourne don’t quite appreciate, AFL is the only game. Its an elite school game which is great for top end of town and the working man’s game at the same time.
The fact Brisbane has the equal number of AFL and NRL teams is an indictment on the NRL. Also that NRL team plays Thurs/Fri all year leaving every weekend NRL free in the city. Its nuts.
Its crazy how things fall their way. They would not have started the season until league announced they were. They had to move 90% of the comp to Queensland which has given them a massive boost in the area. Ironically, that scenario would have been gold to the NRL just looking at how the SC supported having games in town.

 

[Perth Red]

Its a myth because the AFL compromises its own rules to give its expansion sides more money to spend on the cap & priority draft picks out of order & have done for over 30 years. Heaven help you if you're a struggling heartland based club in that code.

Nonsense, they have a variable grant scheme that means that ANY club that needs money gets it. Last year, in a sign that AFL is just as oversaturated in Melbourne as NRL is in Sydney, Melbourne, nth Melbourne, St Kilda and Western Bulldogs all required substantially bigger grants than the other AFL heartland clubs.

 

[baselinepanther]

Nonsense, they have a variable grant scheme that means that ANY club that needs money gets it. Last year, in a sign that AFL is just as oversaturated in Melbourne as NRL is in Sydney, Melbourne, nth Melbourne, St Kilda and Western Bulldogs all required substantially bigger grants than the other AFL heartland clubs.

no heartland club gets as much financial assistance as either the suns or giants atm & the money the swans & lions got over the years ahead of clubs elsewhere was quite extraordinary

& no heartland clubs are given priority draft picks based on their post code either

my statement stands.