The grand plan

[Gobsmacked]

Realistically that's going to cost the NRL 70million pounds a year. TV deal is 20million pounds ish. So that's a $100mill a year investment by NRL. Can you honestly see that ever happening?

I don't know what the dollars and cents of it are. I'm just throwing random figures out.
It really only needs to be 20 to 30 percent more than the current expenditure.
Assuming that over the next decade those changes take any traction, the revenue and value of the comp would easily equal to that in growth.

 

[Pippen94]

And I do get the money thing.
These expansion options we all suggest won't work as things stand.
It going to need significant investment from the NRL.
I think the investment needs to be big enough to buy 51% of the league at least, then they can dictate a clear strategy for the comp over the next 30 years.
Or it starts a rebel organisation:
Offers a yearly grant guarantee to clubs for 30 years to sign upon invitation:
5 million pounds per club and own and run the expansion clubs. Offers for clubs to buy in ect.
Wigan
Saints
Warrington
Leeds
Hull kr
Catalans
Hull fc
* 2 buy in spots ( bids) York? Bradford?
3 NRL owned and operated expansion franchisees :
London
Toulouse
Dublin

There's already a Toulouse team. It's strongest club outside of superleague

 

[Pippen94]

Let's see what happens with NRL and international streamers. NRL could add existing league fanbase from England and France by buying superleague or starting their own comp. Means product has greater reach.

 

[Wb1234]

TV wants as many subscribers as it can get to justify the cost. Only an idiot would cut any club that was in top 6 for fanbases. They are the ones buying subscriptions!

Context is everything.

Yeh two clubs in hull and none in London

And you wonder why the tv rights got cut in half

They should get you to do the next deal

Maybe have 3 hull clubs

 

[Wb1234]

Dont disagree but thats the harsh reality over there. Soccer sucks up the money and sponsors and other sports get fed the left overs. Union is going through the same financial strife and reduction in media revenue as league is. We can wish it was different but wishing doesn't make it happen.

Like I said London are a very good example of why the notion that adding a team into a city with no interest is fraught with sustainability issues. Despite being in the biggest city in the country, despite 27 years of SL exposure and funding and despite tens of millions of owner investment they still are no where near a sustainable top tier club. Not sure I can give a more clear example of what the reality is over there than the London Broncos.

And its all well and good to say 'yes it costs money' but the simple fact is SL does not have the money to be able to spend tens of millions of pounds a year on expansion clubs for the next 25 years.

NRL is now, finally, growing off the back of getting the heartlands sorted out and sustainable (taken 25 years), and even then its only happened on the back of some massive govt handouts.
But again its a totally different context and just because NRl has done it in NSW and Qlnd does not mean the same can happen in Northern England. NRL is not competing with a sports behemoth like the EPL in NSW and Qlnd!

Translation nrl should put a club in Perth against the dominant code and spend millions on it but super league should just ignore new markets and focus on places with tiny pop

 

[Wb1234]

I think there's significant value in having 2 Hull teams. There’s something special about Hull as it relates to RL . I've been to Hull and watched Hull fc vs Saints. I was freezing my nuts off and it started snowing at half time. Saints absolutely dominated by that time, so I made my way to the local to warm up.
I remember a tribute to a former player or something and the absolute silence the entire crowd gave it- I've never witnessed 10k + in such silence, very moving.
That city is possibly the most rugby league mad city on earth- heaven for me.

I think it's actually a very bright spot for RL, unique and should be celebrated and protected forever. A little like Souths. It's kinda sacred.

Hull tigers average 21k in the championship

Wigan Leeds st Helen’s and Bradford re popularity of league

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Dont disagree but thats the harsh reality over there. Soccer sucks up the money and sponsors and other sports get fed the left overs. Union is going through the same financial strife and reduction in media revenue as league is. We can wish it was different but wishing doesn't make it happen.

Like I said London are a very good example of why the notion that adding a team into a city with no interest is fraught with sustainability issues. Despite being in the biggest city in the country, despite 27 years of SL exposure and funding and despite tens of millions of owner investment they still are no where near a sustainable top tier club. Not sure I can give a more clear example of what the reality is over there than the London Broncos.

And its all well and good to say 'yes it costs money' but the simple fact is SL does not have the money to be able to spend tens of millions of pounds a year on expansion clubs for the next 25 years.

NRL is now, finally, growing off the back of getting the heartlands sorted out and sustainable (taken 25 years), and even then its only happened on the back of some massive govt handouts.
But again its a totally different context and just because NRl has done it in NSW and Qlnd does not mean the same can happen in Northern England. NRL is not competing with a sports behemoth like the EPL in NSW and Qlnd!

You are so overly critical of the successful NRL... the biggest rugby comp in the world. But so full of excuses for the failures of SL to administer itself properly and expand.

 

[Wb1234]

Talks a lot of sense

120k sky subs purely for rugby league

 

[Pippen94]

Talks a lot of sense

120k sky subs purely for rugby league

People that can't run football clubs are going to run a successful streaming service.

 

[Perth Red]

Yeh two clubs in hull and none in London

And you wonder why the tv rights got cut in half

They should get you to do the next deal

Maybe have 3 hull clubs

coming from the bloke who insists ten clubs in one city is essential due to 'tribalism'.

 

[Perth Red]

You are so overly critical of the successful NRL... the biggest rugby comp in the world. But so full of excuses for the failures of SL to administer itself properly and expand.

I'm putting context to dumb comparative arguments. Its as stupid as saying that MLS should be much bigger as EPL is way ahead of it and America has 6 times the population. Why cant it be as big as EPL?

 

[BuffaloRules]

I'm putting context to dumb comparative arguments. Its as stupid as saying that MLS should be much bigger as EPL is way ahead of it and America has 6 times the population. Why cant it be as big as EPL?

The MLS don’t have all their teams in New Hampshire , whilst not expanding to New York City

 

[Perth Red]

I don't know what the dollars and cents of it are. I'm just throwing random figures out.
It really only needs to be 20 to 30 percent more than the current expenditure.
Assuming that over the next decade those changes take any traction, the revenue and value of the comp would easily equal to that in growth.

Realistically:
if the club grant went from the current 1.2mill pounds to around 3mil pounds it would give the clubs money to do things better and generate greater followings.
Then you'd need to bankroll the expansion clubs.
Then you'd want to spend more at SL HQ to have better leadership, more marketing etc etc

So conservatively you'd be looking at NRL pumping in annually around:
$42mill to 12 clubs grants
$36mill to 3 new expansion clubs
$10mill for SL HQ, improved marketing, etc

That is still an annual spend of $88mill for many many years if you wanted to get serious about growing SL. Thats a sht load of investment with no guarantees of return. Just cant see it from NRL.

 

[Perth Red]

The MLS don’t have all their teams in New Hampshire , whilst not expanding to New York City

30 big cities and still nowhere near the strength and importance of the EPL. Why?
Context.

 

[BuffaloRules]

30 big cities and still nowhere near the strength and importance of the EPL. Why?
Context.

They are trying to expand at least… so there’s thst

 

[Gobsmacked]

Realistically:
if the club grant went from the current 1.2mill pounds to around 3mil pounds it would give the clubs money to do things better and generate greater followings.
Then you'd need to bankroll the expansion clubs.
Then you'd want to spend more at SL HQ to have better leadership, more marketing etc etc

So conservatively you'd be looking at NRL pumping in annually around:
$42mill to 12 clubs grants
$36mill to 3 new expansion clubs
$10mill for SL HQ, improved marketing, etc

That is still an annual spend of $88mill for many many years if you wanted to get serious about growing SL. Thats a sht load of investment with no guarantees of return. Just cant see it from NRL.

But these are just made up figures and don't account for any incoming revenue...
Like a significantly increased broadcast deal that a comp with a decent geographical spread would entice, sponsorship opportunities ect..

I don't know why you want to make out like it's way more expensive than it would be and not account for the revenue..

Why are you so anti growth ?

 

[Gobsmacked]

30 big cities and still nowhere near the strength and importance of the EPL. Why?
Context.

What is with you and other sports? Why the comparisons?
Are you looking at other pee pees at the piss troth too ???

 

[Wb1234]

coming from the bloke who insists ten clubs in one city is essential due to 'tribalism'.

Need to understand the history of rugby league in Australia

Nswrl became arl became nrl

Pretend Sydney is London and league is soccer

 

[Perth Red]

But these are just made up figures and don't account for any incoming revenue...
Like a significantly increased broadcast deal that a comp with a decent geographical spread would entice, sponsorship opportunities ect..

I don't know why you want to make out like it's way more expensive than it would be and not account for the revenue..

Why are you so anti growth ?

I was basing It on the current comp expenditure and income. This is additional spending on top of current that would need to happen to move SL to be something else.

sure eventually you’d be hoping to see increased media and sponsorship revenue, but like I’ve said there’s no guarantees in that given what a hoover soccer is of those funding sources.

im not anti growth at all, quite the opposite. But I am a realist unlike others who throw ideas like Dublin and Glasgow out there as some panacea to English rugby leagues problems.

it’s as stupid as saying nrl needs teams in shanghai, Singapore and Beijing when they can’t even get the game popular in half of australia Where they have some competition.

 

[Gobsmacked]

I was basing It on the current comp expenditure and income. This is additional spending on top of current that would need to happen to move SL to be something else.

sure eventually you’d be hoping to see increased media and sponsorship revenue, but like I’ve said there’s no guarantees in that given what a hoover soccer is of those funding sources.

im not anti growth at all, quite the opposite. But I am a realist unlike others who throw ideas like Dublin and Glasgow out there as some panacea to English rugby leagues problems.

it’s as stupid as saying nrl needs teams in shanghai, Singapore and Beijing when they can’t even get the game popular in half of australia Where they have some competition.

Ireland and Scotland are Rugby areas, so there's talent there and a traditional rival to English that will spark a passion. A very cheap and short flight away.
You wouldn't know if it works until you try it..

I bet you didn't see Toronto pulling bigger crowds than half the comp did you?