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Rumoured and Confirmed signings - Part 4

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Pomoz

Pomoz

Bench
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2,862
The situation with Blake and DWZ was made a bit clearer for me after listening to Gus's Six Tackles podcast the other day. I also think it sheds light on the movement of players at our club over the last five years.

In the podcast they talk about Ponga and the fact he is currently paid below market and what the club should do. Gus said again he always tried to make sure players were paid what they were worth and I know there are plenty on here who think Gus overpays players. Newcastle could hold him to the contract for the next two years and then he would almost certainly leave. Gus said he would negotiate to increase the term of his contract and then pay him more.

This is where it gets interesting. He was asked what happens if he can't agree and says he will leave in two years. Gus replied, well then in the remaining two years you recruit four or five replacements at junior level, acknowledging finding a new Ponga is almost impossible, but you prime the pump, so to speak.

This reflects what he has been doing at our club for the last few years. Identify gaps and then search everywhere for juniors (not just Penrith locals) to put through the system. By all accounts this approach is about to yield two high quality fullbacks at the Panthers in the next few years. He also said "that if you can see some depth coming through, or want to retain youngsters, then you move on one of your highly paid players to create room and save money". He said that was the whole point of having a development system like the Panthers, Broncos and the Sharks.

Gus was then went on to say if you put them on big money and then they don't deliver on their potential, making the point that coaching is still crucial even to marquee players, then "you trade them out". He said he thinks a good player can still be sold even if they not worth the money you are paying them.

I think Blake and DWZ are not worth the money they are allegedly on. I love Blake (never really rated DWZ to be honest), but I couldn't say that he has delivered on his potential. He is 25 and you reach a point where you have to consider whether they have reached their ceiling. If the rumours are true and he is being shopped around, I think you need look no further than Gus's comments to understand why. The club thinks he isn't worth the money and there are better alternatives coming through.
 
Whino

Whino

Bench
Messages
3,202
herbert henry1908 said:
Good call.

I’ll counter with another one that turned out to be true. There were rumours of shifting Merrin halfway through last year.
Click to expand...

That was true.

I did think of another that thankfully turned out false.
About this time last year ch 7 wrongly claimed Trent Barrett would be our next coach months before Griffin was actually sacked.
 
Aliceinwonderland

Aliceinwonderland

First Grade
Messages
7,602
Pomoz said:
The situation with Blake and DWZ was made a bit clearer for me after listening to Gus's Six Tackles podcast the other day. I also think it sheds light on the movement of players at our club over the last five years.

In the podcast they talk about Ponga and the fact he is currently paid below market and what the club should do. Gus said again he always tried to make sure players were paid what they were worth and I know there are plenty on here who think Gus overpays players. Newcastle could hold him to the contract for the next two years and then he would almost certainly leave. Gus said he would negotiate to increase the term of his contract and then pay him more.

This is where it gets interesting. He was asked what happens if he can't agree and says he will leave in two years. Gus replied, well then in the remaining two years you recruit four or five replacements at junior level, acknowledging finding a new Ponga is almost impossible, but you prime the pump, so to speak.

This reflects what he has been doing at our club for the last few years. Identify gaps and then search everywhere for juniors (not just Penrith locals) to put through the system. By all accounts this approach is about to yield two high quality fullbacks at the Panthers in the next few years. He also said "that if you can see some depth coming through, or want to retain youngsters, then you move on one of your highly paid players to create room and save money". He said that was the whole point of having a development system like the Panthers, Broncos and the Sharks.

Gus was then went on to say if you put them on big money and then they don't deliver on their potential, making the point that coaching is still crucial even to marquee players, then "you trade them out". He said he thinks a good player can still be sold even if they not worth the money you are paying them.

I think Blake and DWZ are not worth the money they are allegedly on. I love Blake (never really rated DWZ to be honest), but I couldn't say that he has delivered on his potential. He is 25 and you reach a point where you have to consider whether they have reached their ceiling. If the rumours are true and he is being shopped around, I think you need look no further than Gus's comments to understand why. The club thinks he isn't worth the money and there are better alternatives coming through.
Click to expand...





Post of the year. You make some very valid points.
 
herbert henry1908

herbert henry1908

Referee
Messages
21,867
Pomoz said:
The situation with Blake and DWZ was made a bit clearer for me after listening to Gus's Six Tackles podcast the other day. I also think it sheds light on the movement of players at our club over the last five years.

In the podcast they talk about Ponga and the fact he is currently paid below market and what the club should do. Gus said again he always tried to make sure players were paid what they were worth and I know there are plenty on here who think Gus overpays players. Newcastle could hold him to the contract for the next two years and then he would almost certainly leave. Gus said he would negotiate to increase the term of his contract and then pay him more.

This is where it gets interesting. He was asked what happens if he can't agree and says he will leave in two years. Gus replied, well then in the remaining two years you recruit four or five replacements at junior level, acknowledging finding a new Ponga is almost impossible, but you prime the pump, so to speak.

This reflects what he has been doing at our club for the last few years. Identify gaps and then search everywhere for juniors (not just Penrith locals) to put through the system. By all accounts this approach is about to yield two high quality fullbacks at the Panthers in the next few years. He also said "that if you can see some depth coming through, or want to retain youngsters, then you move on one of your highly paid players to create room and save money". He said that was the whole point of having a development system like the Panthers, Broncos and the Sharks.

Gus was then went on to say if you put them on big money and then they don't deliver on their potential, making the point that coaching is still crucial even to marquee players, then "you trade them out". He said he thinks a good player can still be sold even if they not worth the money you are paying them.

I think Blake and DWZ are not worth the money they are allegedly on. I love Blake (never really rated DWZ to be honest), but I couldn't say that he has delivered on his potential. He is 25 and you reach a point where you have to consider whether they have reached their ceiling. If the rumours are true and he is being shopped around, I think you need look no further than Gus's comments to understand why. The club thinks he isn't worth the money and there are better alternatives coming through.
Click to expand...



You’ve made me even more glad he’s gone.

This process is not a recipe for success, it’s a recipe for middling results. Successful clubs are largely stable, sure their roster changes, but to not the degree ours has.

His idea basically always going back to youth to plug the gaps means we’re caught is this cycle of constantly being inexperienced. We’ve been inexperienced for 5 years now, we’ll be inexperienced next year too.


None of that is to say his investment in junior pathways hasn’t been excellent, but you can’t rely on those juniors to win you premierships. You need experience, and we seem to be constantly moving experience out the door.
 
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herbert henry1908

herbert henry1908

Referee
Messages
21,867
Whino said:
That was true.

I did think of another that thankfully turned out false.
About this time last year ch 7 wrongly claimed Trent Barrett would be our next coach months before Griffin was actually sacked.
Click to expand...


From what I’m seeing, the rumours of players/coaches leaving seem to be true. The rumours of players/coaches coming don’t always seem to be true.

I’d say that lends credence to the idea the club leaks.
 
Whino

Whino

Bench
Messages
3,202
herbert henry1908 said:
From what I’m seeing, the rumours of players/coaches leaving seem to be true. The rumours of players/coaches coming don’t always seem to be true.

I’d say that lends credence to the idea the club leaks.
Click to expand...

More than likely.

We know the pattern. If a rumour keeps coming up despite the denials it's more than likely comes true a month or 2 later. An occasional red herring happens.
Maybe the leaks start to drum up more interest for the player we wish to move on?
Blake was linked to Parra and now there is another club interested.
Either way I hate it. Too much cut and run.
 
Marky Mark

Marky Mark

Juniors
Messages
192
That's lame if they move Blake on. Why develop a talented player like him only to gift him to another club (Moyza style). His ball handling & defence is strong these days. It's not as though he's been serviced with early, clean ball this year.

The club keeps talking about building culture, how can that happen if there's no belief in, & loyalty to the players?

I know the other Mark is a fan of Blake.
 
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herbert henry1908

herbert henry1908

Referee
Messages
21,867
You know a funny stat?

The most games in a panthers jersey by anyone currently at the club is Sam McKendry with 147

He’s played 2 NRL games in the last 3 seasons!! Only 2 and he’s still played the most games as a panther amongst the current squad. He hasn’t played a full season since 2015.



I couldn’t think of a better way to illustrate the turnover of players.
 
OldPanther

OldPanther

Coach
Messages
13,404
herbert henry1908 said:
You know a funny stat?

The most games in a panthers jersey by anyone currently at the club is Sam McKendry with 147

He’s played 2 NRL games in the last 3 seasons!! Only 2 and he’s still played the most games as a panther amongst the current squad. He hasn’t played a full season since 2015.



I couldn’t think of a better way to illustrate the turnover of players.
Click to expand...

That's insanity.
 
cain3y

cain3y

Juniors
Messages
386
Marky Mark said:
That's lame if they move Blake on. Why develop a talented player like him only to gift him to another club (Moyza style). His ball handling & defence is strong these days. It's not as though he's been serviced with early, clean ball this year.

The club keeps talking about building culture, how can that happen if there's no belief in, & loyalty to the players?

I know the other Mark is a fan of Blake.
Click to expand...
Last year he was really good but every other year not so good. I thought he had turned the corner for the better but like when Michael Jennings was with us Blake just doesn't go looking for the ball. Sadly i think we will move him on and he will play his best football at another club and probably win a GF too like Coote, Jennings, Graham and Lewis.
 
Marky Mark

Marky Mark

Juniors
Messages
192
cain3y said:
Last year he was really good but every other year not so good. I thought he had turned the corner for the better but like when Michael Jennings was with us Blake just doesn't go looking for the ball. Sadly i think we will move him on and he will play his best football at another club and probably win a GF too like Coote, Jennings, Graham and Lewis.
Click to expand...
All of those great players you listed played their best football elsewhere because they had bad coaching at Penrith. Same with Blake - shit coach.
 
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