Jack DeBelin

[SBD82]

Well that depends whether you are you or whether you are you and someone else as well.

A simple yes or no would have been fine.

 

[Morotti]

The question now is, what happens if the trial is delayed until August and then he is acquitted? Because we all know what happens if he is guilty.

But if he is found not guilty, does he stay with the dragons and what type of contract is he realistically worth after 2 years out.

I am on record against the no fault stand down policy.

Now people are saying he shouldn't be allowed to be around the team even at training. Sure it had an effect on the team last year, but these blokes are big boys and personally that comes down to a lack of leadership at the club both in the playing ranks and the management ranks. They should have found ways to deal with it.

Can you imagine the psychological damage iur would do to him to have no contact at all with your employer or employed for two years. And let's remember, people are advocating this based off what are allegations at the moment yet to bee proven in court.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

 

[Old Timer]

A simple yes or no would have been fine.

I politely suggest that f you had of read all the posts in context you wouldn’t have felt the need to ask.

 

[SBD82]

The question now is, what happens if the trial is delayed until August and then he is acquitted? Because we all know what happens if he is guilty.

But if he is found not guilty, does he stay with the dragons and what type of contract is he realistically worth after 2 years out.

I am on record against the no fault stand down policy.

Now people are saying he shouldn't be allowed to be around the team even at training. Sure it had an effect on the team last year, but these blokes are big boys and personally that comes down to a lack of leadership at the club both in the playing ranks and the management ranks. They should have found ways to deal with it.

Can you imagine the psychological damage iur would do to him to have no contact at all with your employer or employed for two years. And let's remember, people are advocating this based off what are allegations at the moment yet to bee proven in court.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

I think that what happened to “innocent until proven guilty” is that it’s a lofty moral principle that is undermined by real world effects and application.

Many people serve extended time on remand prior to being sentenced. Although this goes against the principle, there are a variety of reasons that can mean that this occurs, especially when the needs of the community are balanced against the needs of the accused, and is not generally seen as an injustice.

Jack’s needs are currently being weighed against the needs of the club. I don’t see that as being so different.

 

[SBD82]

I politely suggest that f you had of read all the posts in context you wouldn’t have felt the need to ask.

I’d politely suggest that sometimes when you post, the things that you write aren’t as clear as you seem to think they are. I’m just seeking clarity.

What’s wrong with giving a straight answer?

 

[Old Kogarah Boy 1]

Last year, the JDB situation assisted in derailing the club in every way possible.

McGregor and the club acknowledged as such.

We are now in 2020.

JDB trial was supposed to have reached its outcome BEFORE the season started.

It won’t.

Now with the club supposedly allowing JDB to train with the team, how can such poor management choice allow the club to resort back to last seasons excuses of this whole situation ruining yet another season for the club?

Where the hell is our talkative ceo?
Why hasn’t BJ come forth and tell us fans what is happening?
Why such decisions have been made and how our they justified?

Why do l get the feeling of history repeating itself?

Am l being pessimistic and negative OR am l being realistic and a long suffering Saints fan who is sick of seeing our once great club, screwing another season?

 

[possm]

If that is true, it is just astounding to me.
What is the rationale?
Support the player psychologically while he goes through a tough challenge in court?
JDB is a leader who is irreplaceable - the Team cannot function without him involved in the every day management of the Team?
The club and McGregor want to be seen to be loyal to this one player?
The club us soooo confident that JDB will be acquitted and he will make a late appearance in 2020 after the trial?
Any way you look at this it is catastrophic for the rest of the Team and our prospects for 2020.
There is a squad of players that need direction and mentoring without the added distraction of the JDB circus.

It all begins with the NRL. When they stood JDB down they should have rules that suspend his contract with SGI and transfer responsibility to the NRL. Trainng and support should then be supplied by the NRL.

If De Belin is found not guilty, then he should be allowed to return to SGI if he wants to or sign with another club if he chooses to do that.

 

[Dragsters]

You are quite correct that training with the team is different.

It is extremely different than cutting someone adrift before a court result.

Which is something we shouldn’t do.

Where the club has stuffed up is allowing him to train with the team. Being stood down with full pay is a fair outcome for all.

Jack keeps his pay, the team are not distracted.

I can vaguely remember reading somewhere last year, a player say that they felt confident running drills with JDB at training but then on gameday they really missed him out there.

Perhaps have him train with the team for all but the attack and defensive play drills so as not to impact on the team structure?

They may be doing just this, who knows, I don't get down to watch training...

 

[TheOnlyTeam]

Maybe the club is now saying that it didn't have an enormous effect on 2019, maybe it was just another convenient excuse.

 

[qld redvee]

The question now is, what happens if the trial is delayed until August and then he is acquitted? Because we all know what happens if he is guilty.

But if he is found not guilty, does he stay with the dragons and what type of contract is he realistically worth after 2 years out.

I am on record against the no fault stand down policy.

Now people are saying he shouldn't be allowed to be around the team even at training. Sure it had an effect on the team last year, but these blokes are big boys and personally that comes down to a lack of leadership at the club both in the playing ranks and the management ranks. They should have found ways to deal with it.

Can you imagine the psychological damage iur would do to him to have no contact at all with your employer or employed for two years. And let's remember, people are advocating this based off what are allegations at the moment yet to bee proven in court.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

Moretti
as it stands JDB's trial may not be heard until august which effectively rules him out of 2020.
The club admitted it was destabilising having JDB training and the sitting on the sidelines match day. If he is doing circuit training with the group to maintain fitness fair enough BUT he should not be part of team plays etc as it looks like he wont be part of the team . (this year) How could players not be rattled if jack is part of defenseive drills or attack plays and then on game day nowhere to be seen ??
The club needs to apply for dispensation from the nrl right now and "treat " JDB as a player in rehab so he is still part of the overall squad ( my opinion ) we cant have JDB as an excuse for the season

 

[Dennis Papaioannou]

Obviously you have no problems with intent, comprehension or remembering previous posts.

I'm not sure what you are referring to but seems to me that (as an example) players like Fonua Blake were not given the same latitude and support as JDB.
I just want the Team to be put above all else.
That is not happening considering the JDB circus.

 

[blacksafake]

Last year, the JDB situation assisted in derailing the club in every way possible.

McGregor and the club acknowledged as such.

We are now in 2020.

JDB trial was supposed to have reached its outcome BEFORE the season started.

It won’t.

Now with the club supposedly allowing JDB to train with the team, how can such poor management choice allow the club to resort back to last seasons excuses of this whole situation ruining yet another season for the club?

Where the hell is our talkative ceo?
Why hasn’t BJ come forth and tell us fans what is happening?
Why such decisions have been made and how our they justified?

Why do l get the feeling of history repeating itself?

Am l being pessimistic and negative OR am l being realistic and a long suffering Saints fan who is sick of seeing our once great club, screwing another season?

OKB, You’d like to think they learned a lesson last year. They’re a bit slow or dumb. A bit like L plates coaching, doing the same thing over & over again.

 

[Gareth67]

OKB, You’d like to think they learned a lesson last year. They’re a bit slow or dumb. A bit like L plates coaching, doing the same thing over & over again.

Exactly , as you have suggested the fools have not learnt anything from last year episode . This is just like a re-run of ‘ I Love Lucy ‘ .

The point is that the stupid beggars are going down the same path once again. They just will not learn from their past mistakes - the man should not be training with the team , as unfortunate as it is it would be better for JDB to train elsewhere until this sorry mess has been cleaned up .

 

[BLM01]

Exactly , as you have suggested the fools have not learnt anything from last year episode . This is just like a re-run of ‘ I Love Lucy ‘ .

The point is that the stupid beggars are going down the same path once again. They just will not learn from their past mistakes - the man should not be training with the team , as unfortunate as it is it would be better for JDB to train elsewhere until this sorry mess has been cleaned up .

I think they have a good reason to bring him in and the timing of it all. It Is becoming clearer to me why they have. I did not Last year but this time I’m trusting their judgement and their reasoning As they know more than any of us on here

 

[Wittenberg]

OKB, You’d like to think they learned a lesson last year. They’re a bit slow or dumb. A bit like L plates coaching, doing the same thing over & over again.

Unfortunately the club has little option. The NRL were happy to come up with their policy but our Club has been left open to the possibility of being sued along with the NRL if JDB is found innocent if it treats Jack as being guilty before the finding is brought down.The irony is that the NRL has created a situation where he is being treated that way. Partly that is why we will not get any significant relief in our salary cap because to do so would be tantamount to the NRL treating him as being outside the Club’s responsibility. I don’t want him near training, innocent or guilty but Jack’s solicitor acknowledged last year that the Club could be taken to court along with the NRL if he is found innocent. A no win situation that will again take its toll.

 

[Gareth67]

I think they have a good reason to bring him in and the timing of it all. It Is becoming clearer to me why they have. I did not Last year but this time I’m trusting their judgement and their reasoning As they know more than any of us on here

I can only assume that this would have something to do with some form of compensation from the N.R.L. for what is looming as yet another season without JDB’s services.

 

[Old Kogarah Boy 1]

Unfortunately the club has little option. The NRL were happy to come up with their policy but our Club has been left open to the possibility of being sued along with the NRL if JDB is found innocent if it treats Jack as being guilty before the finding is brought down.The irony is that the NRL has created a situation where he is being treated that way. Partly that is why we will not get any significant relief in our salary cap because to do so would be tantamount to the NRL treating him as being outside the Club’s responsibility. I don’t want him near training, innocent or guilty but Jack’s solicitor acknowledged last year that the Club could be taken to court along with the NRL if he is found innocent. A no win situation that will again take its toll.

Precisely.
As l mentioned before, Beattie came out with this great 'No Fault Policy' but failed to implement it right across the system. He looked after only the nrl office, not its clubs or its players.

The Dragons are left holding the parcel and we don't know if its goling to explode or not.
Throw in a coach who can't see past his blinkers and we are already mirroring last season strategies.

Can someone please ring the S.E.S to send an alert out our CEO.
I hold grave concerns for Brian Johnston ............ cause where the hell is he?
He should be f@%king front & centre on these matters.
Never have l witnessed a more pathetic attempt to carry out ones job.
Thank fudge he is leaving.
A total waste of space, not to mention the squillion of dollars, he's cost the club.

 

[BLM01]

I can only assume that this would have something to do with some form of compensation from the N.R.L. for what is looming as yet another season without JDB’s services.

That is normal and already in place. The Dragons just have to apply.. but no Gazza that theory was not what I was thinking but good point.

 

[SnowDragon]

Can’t we just hire JDB’s twin brother until the court case is done? I’ve heard he is training with the team

 

[TruSaint]

Jack de Belin sues Telegraph for defamation over 'rapist' allegations
Michaela Whitbourn
February 20, 2020 — 5.51pm

Suspended NRL player Jack de Belin has launched defamation proceedings against The Daily Telegraph over a front page story, cartoon and tweet he says imply he is a rapist and a "despicable person".

In documents filed in the Federal Court in Sydney on Thursday, lawyers for de Belin seek damages, including aggravated damages, and legal costs for a story published on February 21 and headlined "Rub Out the Grubs: League Immortal draws line in sand on NRL shame."

Jack de Belin outside Wollongong District Court earlier this month.CREDIT:KATE GERAGHTY

The front page story featured an interview with Kangaroos coach Mal Meninga and reported the former footballer "wants the NRL to bench stars charged by police during the code's summer of shame until their cases are heard by courts".

"Meninga told The Daily Telegraph yesterday accused rapist Jack de Belin should be suspended immediately while he contests a rape charge and the NRL had to act on violence against women," the report said.


De Belin is also suing over a related tweet which linked to the story and said: "Kangaroos coach says NRL bad boys should be stood down from playing."

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Lawyers for de Belin say the story and tweet defamed the suspended NRL player by suggesting he is "a rapist" and a "despicable person in that he raped a woman".

They say the same allegations were conveyed by the front page in combination with a cartoon on page 23 of the newspaper, which featured Mal Meninga grabbing the throat of a man who is wearing a football jersey with the word "creep" printed across the chest. The man in the jersey is in turn grabbing the throat of a woman.

De Belin's lawyers say the front page, in combination with the full reports on pages four and five, also defamed him by suggesting that de Belin "so conducted himself by raping a woman that he deserved to miss out on being picked for the Australian rugby league team".


In May last year de Belin lost a Federal Court challenge to the Australian Rugby League Commission's no-fault stand-down rule, which sidelines players facing serious criminal charges until their cases are heard.

The Telegraph report, which referred to de Belin as an "accused rapist", was published before the suspension was announced.

De Belin and Shellharbour Sharks player Callan Sinclair were charged in December 2018 with the aggravated sexual assault of a 19-year-old woman in a Wollongong apartment on December 9.

The men have pleaded not guilty to the charges and were initially expected to face a two-week jury trial starting on February 3.

On February 13 Wollongong District Court Judge Andrew Haesler adjourned pre-trial proceedings until April 8 to allow a witness, whose identity has been suppressed, to recover from an illness before giving evidence.


Judge Haesler has now foreshadowed that District Court scheduling issues may mean the trial will not begin before August.

De Belin's lawyers are also seeking an order that the story and tweet be "permanently removed" from the internet.

They seek aggravated damages on a range of bases, including that the Telegraph did not seek a response from de Belin prior to publication and allegedly presented the material in an "over-sensationalised manner noting the language, tone and production style", which indicated an "intent to injure" him.

The case has been assigned to Justice Anna Katzmann and the parties are due to appear in court for the first of a series of preliminary hearings on March 30.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/jac...-over-rapist-allegations-20200220-p542tc.html