Question on Peter V'landys

[taipan]

I think the 3 years ch9 still have need to be included into that $1B?

No it clearly refers to the Foxtel deal after 2022.No Ch9 deal has been negotiated after 2022.

The comment goes exactly" Fox Sports have extended their deal to secure NRL for another 8 years, for an undisclosed amount, believed to be around $200m a year AFTER 2022."

Throwing in initially 8 years ,then specifying the 5 year deal, is a bit confusing.
The current Fox deal is ,or was $190m pa til 2022.

The 9 adjusted deal is old deal
less $64m this year
2021 less $27.5m
2022 less $27.5m

Soo IMO the all up figures are
Fox up to 2022 $190m pa less discount til 2022
Fox 2023 -2027 $1bn
Nein as indicated above.

 

[unforgiven]

No it clearly refers to the Foxtel deal after 2022.No Ch9 deal has been negotiated after 2022.

The comment goes exactly" Fox Sports have extended their deal to secure NRL for another 8 years, for an undisclosed amount, believed to be around $200m a year AFTER 2022."

Throwing in initially 8 years ,then specifying the 5 year deal, is a bit confusing.
The current Fox deal is ,or was $190m pa til 2022.

The 9 adjusted deal is old deal
less $64m this year
2021 less $27.5m
2022 less $27.5m

Soo IMO the all up figures are
Fox up to 2022 $190m pa less discount til 2022
Fox 2023 -2027 $1bn
Nein as indicated above.

Ok, thanks mate, that extension looks ok.

 

[Perth Red]

Mate, even though I may not agree entirely on your feelings on V'landys, I appreciate your concerns. All your knockers many times are way too over zealous. It's not like you are just knocking the bloke for no good reason, you present a decent argument at times. There are to many unknowns at the moment about the TV deal that still need clarity. We need a dissenting voice otherwise we are all just sheep.

So from me thank you for that constant cautionary voice. Time will clear this matter up and he will be hailed as the new king or crock pot soon enough.

As for all his other decisions(less expansion) and innovations, surely you must be pleased?

Thanks for the vote of support

I think he s done a great job getting NRL back, he rolled the dice and the game won.
Its good that he is still talking about bringing Brisbane2 in (though with him I do get a suspicion he is appealing to the masses more than reality but time will tell. He knows how to play the crowd ( look at his press relases since he started; suburban grounds, tribalism, dissing AFL, poo pooing expansion into AFL states, Brisbane2 etc)) so its hard to know if he is just playing the crowd for popularity or if that is what he genuinely thinks should happen. Again its the way it was done. NRL was in the middle of a expansion review project, talking to potential expansion areas and backers and he comes out and puts out a comment that Brisbane2 should be next and Perth is a waste of time. Burning all sorts of bridges and progress being made in WA in the process.
Why not wait for the review to be completed and to do it properly? Its not what he does, its how he does it that is my issue. Hie is autocratic and that can be very costly for a company, especially one as complex as the NRL.

The one ref I've been calling for for years, good to see it finally happen though the way it happened was very poorly managed. Six again too early to tell, first round signs are good.

The TV deal, hmmm devil will be in the detail. The way I am reading it at the moment is the NRL is potentially down $75mill a year but I might be wrong, we shall see.

 

[Perth Red]

The Australian's Shanahan last week after the opening game stated "$1bn plus believed to be around $200m pa after 2022."
They currently pay or did till 2022 $190m pa.

Thus $1bn plus whatever the discount is from 2020-2022.

It's certainly not $1BN over 8years = $ 125M PA.

You've been saying for last two years that the next tv deal is going to be lower, then we have to accept COVID has massively reduced the value of NRL, now you are saying Fox has actually agreed to pay MORE from 2023?

The only way I can see the deal is more is if;
Saturday is included
Streaming is exclusive
and the simucast rights are guaranteed by the NRL
but this will likely reduce the next FTA deal significantly from the $175mill a year last Ch9 deal. At moment Fox pay $55mill for those two things to the FTA partner so I guess if they are paying that direct to NRL instead it might bump up the annual Fox deal, but in all likelihood at the expense of the next FTA deal.

No it clearly refers to the Foxtel deal after 2022.No Ch9 deal has been negotiated after 2022.

The comment goes exactly" Fox Sports have extended their deal to secure NRL for another 8 years, for an undisclosed amount, believed to be around $200m a year AFTER 2022."

.

That's guess work on his part. Could just be as likely the $1bill is for all 8 years. If it is $200mill a year from 2023 and we havent had to make some massive compromises (like Monday night or digital arm or something equally ridiculous) then it is a cracking deal!

 

[franklin2323]

You've been saying for last two years that the next tv deal is going to be lower, then we have to accept COVID has massively reduced the value of NRL, now you are saying Fox has actually agreed to pay MORE from 2023?

The only way I can see the deal is more is if;
Saturday is included
Streaming is exclusive
and the simucast rights are guaranteed by the NRL
but this will likely reduce the next FTA deal significantly from the $175mill a year last Ch9 deal. At moment Fox pay $55mill for those two things to the FTA partner so I guess if they are paying that direct to NRL instead it might bump up the annual Fox deal, but in all likelihood at the expense of the next FTA deal.



That's guess work on his part. Could just be as likely the $1bill is for all 8 years. If it is $200mill a year from 2023 and we havent had to make some massive compromises (like Monday night or digital arm or something equally ridiculous) then it is a cracking deal!

FTA is where the money will drop. Fox customers will foot the bill for that side of it.

Overall across the length of the deal it will drop as a result

 

[taipan]

You've been saying for last two years that the next tv deal is going to be lower, then we have to accept COVID has massively reduced the value of NRL, now you are saying Fox has actually agreed to pay MORE from 2023?

The only way I can see the deal is more is if;
Saturday is included
Streaming is exclusive
and the simucast rights are guaranteed by the NRL
but this will likely reduce the next FTA deal significantly from the $175mill a year last Ch9 deal. At moment Fox pay $55mill for those two things to the FTA partner so I guess if they are paying that direct to NRL instead it might bump up the annual Fox deal, but in all likelihood at the expense of the next FTA deal.



That's guess work on his part. Could just be as likely the $1bill is for all 8 years. If it is $200mill a year from 2023 and we havent had to make some massive compromises (like Monday night or digital arm or something equally ridiculous) then it is a cracking deal!

I've been stating the current deal 2020-2022 which has been hit by discounts from ch9 and Fox ,was to be expected ,and also stated V'Landys was not in a strong position to push for more, because of the current economic issues, which I likened to the worst case since WW2(which you laughed at).

Yep ,I stated the next Tv deal I would expect to be lower.And guess what V'Landys the guy you said has been screwed, got a better deal from Foxsports for 2023-2027.So was he thus was screwed as you claimed?

Just FYI in today's Australian under the heading Economy faces a 7 year glitch."Treasury has warned employers and unions that the economy could take 5-7 years to recover from COVID-19 pandemic, as the government kicked off attempts to reach a consensus on workplace relations changes to help create jobs in hard hit industries."

if it's 1bn for 8 years, that means $125m per year, completely unsustainable on that figure, as grants to clubs total $208m pa (16x$13).So I call BS on that.

Love it how every journo from the SMH or Fox when they refer to Tv deals, and they would get some info ,not available to us, is all guesswork according to you.Yet Masters writes an article taking a shot at V'Landys, then it's spot on.
If the Fox mob are paying $190m now ,admittedly getting a cut on that til 2022, one cannot imagine V'Landys or even Greenberg signing up for a long 5 years at a ridiculously lower figure than $190m pa.Even Raelene Castle from the ARU wouldn't sign that.

A 5% increase when Foxsports needs the NRL to continue with Pay in this country, in conditions that at least would be better than now.is hardly going overboard.It's a very modest increase considering the circumstances and the unknowns for 2023 and beyond.

We just have to wait and see what ch10 does for 2023, and whether 7 are interested in SOO then. ATM are sh*t scared and playing "safety" first.They(ch9) could end up with no NRL, and I'd be cheering all the way to the Qld border.

 

[Perth Red]

I'll accept your apology now then for the last two years telling me I'm crazy for saying the next TV deal could me more valuable lol. You've posted countless times that its crazy to expect more money when Fox is hemorrhaging cash and subscribers and KAYO is much lower revenue for them than traditional satellite subscriptions.

Not really. Grants make up 40% of NRl spending, they could divert money from elsewhere (the much fabled $50mill in admin cuts he's going to find lol) plus that is just the Fox deal the FTA deal could be more or around same giving $250-300mill a year. Time will tell.

 

[flippikat]

I think he s done a great job getting NRL back, he rolled the dice and the game won.
Its good that he is still talking about bringing Brisbane2 in (though with him I do get a suspicion he is appealing to the masses more than reality but time will tell. He knows how to play the crowd ( look at his press relases since he started; suburban grounds, tribalism, dissing AFL, poo pooing expansion into AFL states, Brisbane2 etc)) so its hard to know if he is just playing the crowd for popularity or if that is what he genuinely thinks should happen. Again its the way it was done. NRL was in the middle of a expansion review project, talking to potential expansion areas and backers and he comes out and puts out a comment that Brisbane2 should be next and Perth is a waste of time. Burning all sorts of bridges and progress being made in WA in the process.

My concern is that he'll bring in a 2nd Brisbane club, run a 17 team competition for 2 or 3 years, then discover that a competition with a bye every week is really awkward to manage.

So he'll be faced with the stark choice of culling a club or bringing in team 18. Well, he can't cull a club - he said he'll protect them all.. so he goes fishing for an 18th team....

...and he comes up with one of the losing 'Brisbane 2' bids as Brisbane 3, or the Central Coast Bears, because the NRL has done sweet FA groundwork in Perth, Adelaide, or NZ.

 

[siv]

Following the anti rusted on AFL states

We could end up with Brisbane 2 and
CC Bears (promised by Politis)

Basically sufficating AFL out of Sydney and Brisbane

 

[typicalfan]

My concern is that he'll bring in a 2nd Brisbane club, run a 17 team competition for 2 or 3 years, then discover that a competition with a bye every week is really awkward to manage.

So he'll be faced with the stark choice of culling a club or bringing in team 18. Well, he can't cull a club - he said he'll protect them all.. so he goes fishing for an 18th team....

...and he comes up with one of the losing 'Brisbane 2' bids as Brisbane 3, or the Central Coast Bears, because the NRL has done sweet FA groundwork in Perth, Adelaide, or NZ.

I'd say he already knows who he'd want as an 18th team in the event of this happening.

 

[flippikat]

I'd say he already knows who he'd want as an 18th team in the event of this happening.

Fair point.. and I think the Central Coast is probably odds-on as team 18.

Not sure if a 3rd Brisbane team so soon after Brisbane 2 would be an option, and I see nothing indicating Perth, Adelaide or NZ2 would even be considered. Perhaps Sunshine Coast or Central Qld at a pinch.. but kinda long-shots.

 

[Spot On]

People really believed the NRL would continue to see growth in the tv rights????

Dreamin'.

 

[chrisD]

He's even killing the broncos, what can't this man do?

 

[taipan]

I'll accept your apology now then for the last two years telling me I'm crazy for saying the next TV deal could me more valuable lol. You've posted countless times that its crazy to expect more money when Fox is hemorrhaging cash and subscribers and KAYO is much lower revenue for them than traditional satellite subscriptions.

Not really. Grants make up 40% of NRl spending, they could divert money from elsewhere (the much fabled $50mill in admin cuts he's going to find lol) plus that is just the Fox deal the FTA deal could be more or around same giving $250-300mill a year. Time will tell.

"Accept my apology" just LOL.Your ego needs a bit of desperate polishing.
I've stated all along in my posts 'neither you or I know the inner workings of these deals.".
They are paying $190m pa now from 2023 est $200m hardly. a massive increase to stay in business.
The fact ch9 has not extended says something.The fact Treasury says things will be crap for 5-7 years.You know more than treasury, yep you can lay it on thick?

I have stated til I'm blue in the face ,broadcasters are losing ,money and have huge debt, and rugby league is vital to Pay subscriptions.But in any business regardless of its size when costs become untenable or unsustainable ,they tend to pull up stumps or shut shop.

Then we can expect you apologising for suggesting V'Landys was screwed time after time.Apologising for bagging Greenberg for 3 years, then all of a sudden giving him wraps saying there's not a problem with him when he leaves.And if the AFL get a cut in their TV deal, you will no doubt apologise LOL.

They NRL could, they should whatever.Guesswork doesn't solve the problem.Nor does hypotheticals.

 

[Big Moose]

Following the anti rusted on AFL states

We could end up with Brisbane 2 and
CC Bears (promised by Politis)

Basically sufficating AFL out of Sydney and Brisbane

The second Brisbane team is essential to bed down the rugby league presence in the city. You cannot have only one game per round at the supposed heartland capital.
Ideally a Perth team compliments the national league so that would be of greater benefit to the overall competition long term if it were a successful oufit.

 

[LeagueXIII]

My concern is that he'll bring in a 2nd Brisbane club, run a 17 team competition for 2 or 3 years, then discover that a competition with a bye every week is really awkward to manage.

So he'll be faced with the stark choice of culling a club or bringing in team 18. Well, he can't cull a club - he said he'll protect them all.. so he goes fishing for an 18th team....

...and he comes up with one of the losing 'Brisbane 2' bids as Brisbane 3, or the Central Coast Bears, because the NRL has done sweet FA groundwork in Perth, Adelaide, or NZ.

Or Gold Coast falls over and Brisbane #2 slides in as team 16.

 

[LeagueXIII]

Following the anti rusted on AFL states

We could end up with Brisbane 2 and
CC Bears (promised by Politis)

Basically sufficating AFL out of Sydney and Brisbane

Can you elaborate on what Politis promised about the CC Bears?

 

[LeagueXIII]

Mate, even though I may not agree entirely on your feelings on V'landys, I appreciate your concerns. All your knockers many times are way too over zealous. It's not like you are just knocking the bloke for no good reason, you present a decent argument at times. There are to many unknowns at the moment about the TV deal that still need clarity. We need a dissenting voice otherwise we are all just sheep.

So from me thank you for that constant cautionary voice. Time will clear this matter up and he will be hailed as the new king or crock pot soon enough.

As for all his other decisions(less expansion) and innovations, surely you must be pleased?

I agree Perth Red articulates his points very well. Even in the face of personal attacks.

Well done mate.

 

[Big Moose]

Or Gold Coast falls over and Brisbane #2 slides in as team 16.

Can’t imagine they’ll let the Titans fall over. They need to find on field success. Simple in theory but the reality is the people have demonstrated in the psst they’ll turn up when they win. I do wonder how things would have worked out if Cherry-Evans didn’t backflip.

 

[Whip Whitaker]

There seriously needs to be a second Brisbane team after last night. Brisbane people need more options to score a try over a weekend.