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Past demons and premiership pressure

IFR33K

Coach
Messages
17,002
Wanted to make a new thread where there isn’t too much player or coach bashing.

Simple question.

Are the demons of our ‘failures’ from 1997-2009 and premiership pressure to break our drought coming back to haunt us?

We’ve been good enough to make 3 finals series’ appearances under BA. Could of been 4 if not for the rorts of 2016. We’ve gone out in straight sets each occasion except for last years win over the broncos.

Is it a mental thing that’s stopping this team? We’ve been in many games Only to fold like toilet paper.

thoughts? Are we still feeling the effects of the Brian smith years? Are those failures having a bearing on us today?
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,603
IMO only us fans feel it. The players rarely have any connection to the past and none of them nor the coaching staff were around in that period to have gone through it.
exactly .... don't pass off the fans feelings onto players

you would be hard pressed to find any current players who even know more than a handful of players who played for us a decade ago - they would hardly have a clue where parra finished ..... yes they would be told we haven't won a GF for a long time, but I don't think it makes a massive difference to them
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
73,538
Wanted to make a new thread where there isn’t too much player or coach bashing.

Simple question.

Are the demons of our ‘failures’ from 1997-2009 and premiership pressure to break our drought coming back to haunt us?

We’ve been good enough to make 3 finals series’ appearances under BA. Could of been 4 if not for the rorts of 2016. We’ve gone out in straight sets each occasion except for last years win over the broncos.

Is it a mental thing that’s stopping this team? We’ve been in many games Only to fold like toilet paper.

thoughts? Are we still feeling the effects of the Brian smith years? Are those failures having a bearing on us today?

Nope. To win a premiership you need to make those 1%ers and some luck.

This year in the clutch game to play off for the GF, we lost two wingers and our best centre. Then in 90 seconds our season was over. Clint Eastwood said in his presser that he had a bit of luck (ball hitting post) and that turned the match. He also complimented us playing busted.
 

Captain BF

Juniors
Messages
1,947
We have a soft underbelly and have had one since Ray Price retired.
Absolutely 100% agree. For a long time I thought Sterlo was the main man but we did nothing after Price retired.
I thought for a while that Hindmarsh was the greatest ever Eel but realistically brought us nothing. May have been a different story in 05 had he not been injured in the final round though.

I thought Hayne might have been the one to lead us back to Premiership success but his massive ego probably got in the way of him achieving what he could/should have.

I think we have the makings of a reasonably good and consistent team and i think we have a genuine leader in Gutherson.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,603
I think the only teams that don't consistently have a soft underbelly in recent times are the Storm and Roosters

a few other teams pop up for a while - Sharks were tough (and also on drugs and over the cap), Souths are toughish (and also backed by big dollars off the field), Dogs have had fleeting toughness as have Manly and the Broncos - but we've seen even the might broncos fall off the perch ..... every other team can probably be said to be soft

so are these tough teams tough for a reason? ... a strong coach - yes ... well stacked lineups - but they probably build alot of their success ..... i hate melbourne and they clearly buy alot of their success, but they have built a strong club - be interesting to see how they go once bellamey and smith depart
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,107
Wanted to make a new thread where there isn’t too much player or coach bashing.

Simple question.

Are the demons of our ‘failures’ from 1997-2009 and premiership pressure to break our drought coming back to haunt us?

We’ve been good enough to make 3 finals series’ appearances under BA. Could of been 4 if not for the rorts of 2016. We’ve gone out in straight sets each occasion except for last years win over the broncos.

Is it a mental thing that’s stopping this team? We’ve been in many games Only to fold like toilet paper.

thoughts? Are we still feeling the effects of the Brian smith years? Are those failures having a bearing on us today?

I'm not sure.

But what I could see was that we were playing very strong defence before the covid-enforced break, and when the season resumed, we went away from our great defence a bit.

This side is lacking a genuine halfback - if we had Nathan Cleary, or Adam Reynolds, at 7 last night, we win, imo.

Moses is the most talented halfback in the NRL, but his temperament, and decision-making are below par.

Aside from our halfback not quite being up to it, our biggest issue is that our bench forwards don't have the same impact as our starters do.

And when you combine that with Arthur's weird bench rotations, you get a recipe for disaster.

I'm not trying to blame anyone here, but I don't feel that this team got better as the season progressed. Souths were making up the numbers two months ago, but they have since exploded into outrageous attacking form. We've stagnated, and we haven't evolved our game.

I don't want to be too harsh on the coach, because our team is lacking in key areas (lack of speed out wide, lack of punch off the bench, lack of game-controlling halfback); however, Arthur really needs to be smart with his recruitment for 2021, and he needs to tick all the right boxes.
 

Angry_eel

First Grade
Messages
8,547
We need a good leader and a good coach. We have a good leader in Gutho but I don't know if we have a good coach.

I've been watching a lot of the sports successes and failure shows on netflix and anazon. In all of the success, you have these 2. Mourinho-Lampard, MJ-Phil Jackson and Bellany-Smith.

I think this year Arthur refused to listen to people. People were questioning attack - We are winning, people questioned Sivo and Fergo - We are winning, any question - We are 3rd. It seemed like getting in the top 2 was the aim rather than winning in the finals.
 
Last edited:

Angry_eel

First Grade
Messages
8,547
This side is lacking a genuine halfback - if we had Nathan Cleary, or Adam Reynolds, at 7 last night, we win, imo.

Moses is the most talented halfback in the NRL, but his temperament, and decision-making are below par.

Aside from our halfback not quite being up to it, our biggest issue is that our bench forwards don't have the same impact as our starters do.

I don't agree with this. We as a club always blame the halfback. I think we should get over finding the next Thurston or Johns or Sterling.

Don't forget we got into the Grand Final with Jeff Robson and Finch. Robson was a park footballer and even Melbourne Storm couldn't fix Finch he was so terrible.
 

emjaycee

Coach
Messages
12,868
I'm not sure.

But what I could see was that we were playing very strong defence before the covid-enforced break, and when the season resumed, we went away from our great defence a bit.

This side is lacking a genuine halfback - if we had Nathan Cleary, or Adam Reynolds, at 7 last night, we win, imo.

Moses is the most talented halfback in the NRL, but his temperament, and decision-making are below par.

Aside from our halfback not quite being up to it, our biggest issue is that our bench forwards don't have the same impact as our starters do.

And when you combine that with Arthur's weird bench rotations, you get a recipe for disaster.

I'm not trying to blame anyone here, but I don't feel that this team got better as the season progressed. Souths were making up the numbers two months ago, but they have since exploded into outrageous attacking form. We've stagnated, and we haven't evolved our game.

I don't want to be too harsh on the coach, because our team is lacking in key areas (lack of speed out wide, lack of punch off the bench, lack of game-controlling halfback); however, Arthur really needs to be smart with his recruitment for 2021, and he needs to tick all the right boxes.
Bennett made a comment that in 2019, Souths peaked too early and that he decided that during the Covid break he wouldn't work them too hard and set them to peak towards the end. He said that Parra trained hard (like some other teams) during the Covid period and like Souths in 2019, they probably peaked too early.
Yep, people will quickly jump on BA for this, however interesting that a 30+ year coach admitted his own mistake in 2019 led to his team peaking too early and not playing their best footy at the end of the season.
 

Noise

Coach
Messages
17,106
Bennett made a comment that in 2019, Souths peaked too early and that he decided that during the Covid break he wouldn't work them too hard and set them to peak towards the end. He said that Parra trained hard (like some other teams) during the Covid period and like Souths in 2019, they probably peaked too early.
Yep, people will quickly jump on BA for this, however interesting that a 30+ year coach admitted his own mistake in 2019 led to his team peaking too early and not playing their best footy at the end of the season.
Souths still didn’t go out in straight sets in 2019. They finished 3rd and still made the preliminary final only losing to the Raiders in a closely contested grand final qualifier.
 

emjaycee

Coach
Messages
12,868
Souths still didn’t go out in straight sets in 2019. They finished 3rd and still made the preliminary final only losing to the Raiders in a closely contested grand final qualifier.
Yet to get to the prelim they got towelled up by the Roosters 6 tries to 1 and then beat Manly who scored the same number of tries despite having 2 sin binnings and a 9-3 penalty count against them with the difference being 3 penalty goals and a conversion. Not exactly a convincing end to the season.
 

Noise

Coach
Messages
17,106
Yet to get to the prelim they got towelled up by the Roosters 6 tries to 1 and then beat Manly who scored the same number of tries despite having 2 sin binnings and a 9-3 penalty count against them with the difference being 3 penalty goals and a conversion. Not exactly a convincing end to the season.
But they didn’t go out in straight sets and got to a gf qualifier. Only lost that by a converted try. It was a decent finish. Meanwhile we had 74 points put on us in our 2 finals games.
 
Messages
42,876
IMO only us fans feel it. The players rarely have any connection to the past and none of them nor the coaching staff were around in that period to have gone through it.
I agree about the players not being affected by history but I wonder if coaching staff and administration might consistently fail to instill mental toughness, or recruit the tough players. Or that could be something I just made up.
 

Incorrect

Coach
Messages
11,828
I would say that I feel as far away from a premiership now as we have been at any point in the last 10 years. From looking like heavyweights after 7 or 8 rounds, we've regressed. The premiership window that looked wide open earlier in the season looks to be closing in a hurry IMO. I think we'll be flat out making the bottom half of the 8 next year. Unless we get some fresh ideas in the assistant coaching area and a couple of key recruits which I think we've all identified. Mitch Moses is at a crossroads, no question. 2021 is looking like being a defining year for him.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,107
I don't agree with this. We as a club always blame the halfback. I think we should get over finding the next Thurston or Johns or Sterling.

Don't forget we got into the Grand Final with Jeff Robson and Finch. Robson was a park footballer and even Melbourne Storm couldn't fix Finch he was so terrible.

Robson was average, at best, but he played his role.

Moses can't control a game.

I firmly believe that if we had a halfback with a strong temperament last night, we win.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,107
Bennett made a comment that in 2019, Souths peaked too early and that he decided that during the Covid break he wouldn't work them too hard and set them to peak towards the end. He said that Parra trained hard (like some other teams) during the Covid period and like Souths in 2019, they probably peaked too early.
Yep, people will quickly jump on BA for this, however interesting that a 30+ year coach admitted his own mistake in 2019 led to his team peaking too early and not playing their best footy at the end of the season.

I don't want to blame Arthur - no coach has ever had to deal with something like a covid-enforced break, so it was impossible to determine which was the right call to make.

But before the break, we were defending like a Premiership-winning team.

Once we returned from the break, our defence was still strong, but our 1%er effort areas dropped a little.

I still think that 2020 was a great success, but we need to build from this year.
 

Gary Gutful

Post Whore
Messages
51,727
IMO only us fans feel it. The players rarely have any connection to the past and none of them nor the coaching staff were around in that period to have gone through it.
1000%

Our f**k ups years ago mean f**k all to the current players. How many of them are even old enough to remember any of those games?
 

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