What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Jack DeBelin interview

Status
Not open for further replies.

TruSaint

Referee
Messages
20,237
Let the Court & Justice system make their decision in due process.
I had the experience of being a selected Juror on a sexual assault charge only last year. It was an incredible experience & an eye opener to our justice system.
Whilst the 12 Jurors were heavily stacked with predominantly 8 female to 4 male, it had little bearing on our closed discussions & opinions within the walls of our jury deliberation room.
The case went around 8 days & there were twists & turns along the whole process. The more witnesses involved the messier it became with conflicting versions of events.
The one thing the Judge stressed to us all, was do not make a judgement too early.
Wise words indeed.
May Justice prevail & ultimately there are no winners.

Thanks for sharing.
 

epDragon62

First Grade
Messages
5,076
I have no sympathy for any bloke who thrusts himself on a girl/woman and abuses her. I'm no fan of blokes who treat women like meat either... (that is not at the exclusion of pedos etc)

However, the reality is that many people in society happily get into sexual encounters that many of us would consider being immoral or whatever word works for you...

Ultimately I hope the jury can filter out the BS and determine if this young lady was genuinely abused or if she decided after the event that she was unhappy with her own conduct (and theirs), or even sees it as a chance to benefit.

I can't feel the same way I used to about JDB and I am sure if we knew the truth about each and every NRL player we would see a sordid truth.

He is either guilty as charged, or not; I just want the system to find the truth and deal with him on that basis.
 

T-Boon

Coach
Messages
15,296
Let the Court & Justice system make their decision in due process.
I had the experience of being a selected Juror on a sexual assault charge only last year. It was an incredible experience & an eye opener to our justice system.
Whilst the 12 Jurors were heavily stacked with predominantly 8 female to 4 male, it had little bearing on our closed discussions & opinions within the walls of our jury deliberation room.
The case went around 8 days & there were twists & turns along the whole process. The more witnesses involved the messier it became with conflicting versions of events.
The one thing the Judge stressed to us all, was do not make a judgement too early.
Wise words indeed.
May Justice prevail & ultimately there are no winners.

Well that is very interesting.
Were the women on the jury young or old or a mix of ages?
 

Coffs dragon

Bench
Messages
4,250
Well that is very interesting.
Were the women on the jury young or old or a mix of ages?
Predominantly younger Mum’s in their 20’s. Only 2 oldies being myself & another retired female Deputy School Principal. Opinions were very divided until the final day deliberation & then clear unanimous verdict.
The stretching of the truth & timelines become apparent the longer it goes.
 

boardlumps62

Juniors
Messages
1,481
If the legal teams do the job they get good money for then the truth should be plain as the nose on their face for the jurors to see.
When it comes time to make a decision if they the prosecutor have done enough well then.. .

"The Crown has to prove the essential facts or elements that go to make up the charge alleged against the accused. Each of the essential facts must be proved beyond reasonable doubt before the accused can be found guilty. Suspicion cannot be the basis of a guilty verdict nor can a finding that the accused probably committed the offence. The accused must be given the benefit of any reasonable doubt arising about his or her guilt.

Can we just stop trying to make accusations one way or another.
 

muzby

Village Idiot
Staff member
Messages
45,712
What’s important to remember is what we’re seeing reported each day is based on what has occurred in court.

Depending on who’s witness it is, and if it’s the prosecution or the defence doing the questioning, you’ll hear differing accounts each day..

The truth will (hopefully) come out at the end. Can’t base reporting from one day as the end outcome.
 

Dragsters

First Grade
Messages
5,362
I have no sympathy for any bloke who thrusts himself on a girl/woman and abuses her. I'm no fan of blokes who treat women like meat either... (that is not at the exclusion of pedos etc)

However, the reality is that many people in society happily get into sexual encounters that many of us would consider being immoral or whatever word works for you...

Ultimately I hope the jury can filter out the BS and determine if this young lady was genuinely abused or if she decided after the event that she was unhappy with her own conduct (and theirs), or even sees it as a chance to benefit.

I can't feel the same way I used to about JDB and I am sure if we knew the truth about each and every NRL player we would see a sordid truth.

He is either guilty as charged, or not; I just want the system to find the truth and deal with him on that basis.

Well put...
 

Gareth67

First Grade
Messages
8,407
Let the Court & Justice system make their decision in due process.
I had the experience of being a selected Juror on a sexual assault charge only last year. It was an incredible experience & an eye opener to our justice system.
Whilst the 12 Jurors were heavily stacked with predominantly 8 female to 4 male, it had little bearing on our closed discussions & opinions within the walls of our jury deliberation room.
The case went around 8 days & there were twists & turns along the whole process. The more witnesses involved the messier it became with conflicting versions of events.
The one thing the Judge stressed to us all, was do not make a judgement too early.
Wise words indeed.
May Justice prevail & ultimately there are no winners.

I also Coffs back in ‘91 or ‘92 at Parramatta court house , same charge - sexual assault .
The circumstances in this particular case was that it was the girls boyfriend being brought before the court .
 

WoyD4LWoy

Juniors
Messages
245
The Sydney Morning Herald. gus Thompson
November 12, 2020 — 2.50pm
The manager of a woman, who has accused St George Illawarra star Jack de Belin and footballer Callan Sinclair of raping her, said the alleged victim appeared upset and dishevelled when she arrived at work later that day.

Maddison Harris, who managed a Wollongong venue where the then 19-year-old woman worked, told the NSW District Court on Thursday the woman "wasn't her normal self" as she began her shift on the afternoon of December 9, 2018, and that she was "quite blank" as she walked past.

"She was quite dishevelled. We work in quite a pristine [venue] so it's important to come well dressed," Ms Harris said, while giving evidence before Judge Andrew Haesler in Wollongong.

"Her make-up had been clearly run. She wasn't crying when she came in but it was clear she had been previously."

Ms Harris said she noticed the woman continually leaving and re-entering the work area, and later appearing to have a serious discussion with another manager.

"[The woman] said something happened last night I wasn't comfortable with," Ms Harris said.


She said, 'I think I was raped last night. I had gone back to the house, they took my shirt, they wouldn't let me go,' and that's when we stopped and I said, 'That's not something we can deal with here.' "

Ms Harris said she sent the woman to the police station with the other manager to support her.

Jake Johns, another colleague of the woman, told the court that, after he greeted her at work, she didn't respond, to which he replied, "Bit grumpy this morning?"

He said she replied that she had been taken back to someone's house and that "one guy" had pinned her down and sexually assaulted her. Mr Johns then said he asked her if she screamed, but said he couldn't recall her response.

Mr Johns also said that during the same shift, "she pinched me on the ribs, I'd say in a flirty manner".

The woman alleges that, after going back to a Wollongong apartment with Mr de Belin and Mr Sinclair in the early hours of December 9, Mr de Belin forced himself on top of her and began raping her, with Mr Sinclair joining in.


Mr Johns said that, after speaking to the woman, he spoke to a mutual friend of theirs, and then Mr Sinclair, asking him what had happened.

"He said that he was on a night out and that he'd had a threesome with Jack," Mr Johns said, adding under cross-examination that Mr Sinclair had seemed shocked.

The court heard that Mr Sinclair had told Mr Johns that the three of them went out to a nightclub following the incident.

"At the end she said, 'See you later, I have to go because I have work tomorrow,' " Mr Sinclair allegedly said.

The trial continues.


https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...lled-at-work-court-hears-20201112-p56e0r.html
 

WoyD4LWoy

Juniors
Messages
245
A man who lived at the Wollongong apartment where a woman was allegedly raped by St George Illawarra star Jack de Belin said he initially lied to police about what he'd witnessed, partly because he didn't want to reveal the footballer was cheating on his girlfriend.

Primary school teacher Troy Martin told a NSW District Court jury on Thursday that he woke to noises in the early hours of December 9, 2018 and found Mr de Belin naked in his absent housemate's bedroom with a woman lying naked on the bed and Mr Sinclair standing in the room fully clothed.
Mr Martin admitted he lied to police when he initially told them he had woken briefly to some noises before going back to sleep, telling the court that he had withheld the truth for multiple reasons.

"The first one obviously being that I didn't want to be a part of what I had witnessed, which now has worked out ... worse," Mr Martin told the court under cross-examination by Mr de Belin's barrister David Campbell, SC.



"The second reason, I also knew that Mr de Belin had a partner, and I didn't want to be the responsible one for telling that he was cheating on her."

Asked if there was a third reason, Mr Martin said he also had the distinct impression that police already knew someone else had been inside the apartment, and there were security cameras outside they would probably check.

" I thought] they're going to find out from someone else, not me," he said.

Mr de Belin, 29, and Mr Sinclair, 23, are on trial before Wollongong judge Andrew Haesler, after both pleaded not guilty to five charges each of aggravated sexual assault, claiming the encounter with the then-19-year-old woman after a night of partying was consensual.

Mr Martin said that when he saw the trio through the open bedroom door, the woman asked Mr de Belin, "Who was that?" before someone closed the door, and he went to the bathroom and to get a drink of water.

He then said a still-naked Mr de Belin approached him and said, "Sorry mate, just borrowing your house, didn't realise anyone was home."

Crown prosecutor David Scully put to Mr Martin that he was continuing to lie in his newer version of events, to which Mr Martin replied, "I disagree."

The woman, who cannot be named for legal reasons, previously told the court she never saw another man come to the door, contradicting Mr Martin's version of events, which had earlier been put to her by Mr Campbell.
Under cross-examination, Mr Martin said that police came to the house on the night of December 9, 2018 and confiscated his mobile phone, and after accompanying them to the police station he resolved not to tell them any more than he had to. He agreed in hindsight that he would've behaved differently.

The court heard the police returned his phone to the school where he worked the next day, prompting questions from the school executive about their attendance.

He said he told the executive, as well as his girlfriend and roommate whose room Mr de Belin had been in, that he hadn't been truthful with the police, and in October 2019 completed a statutory declaration that set out the version of events he gave in court.

"I told him that I didn't tell them Jack's name," he said of his conversation with the roommate.

He said he hadn't heard any screams or the word "no" used, to which Mr Campbell replied, "it just looked like three people collected in a room, doing what they wanted to be doing."

Mr Martin agreed.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw...to-protect-jack-de-belin-20201112-p56e2x.html
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
A man who lived at the Wollongong apartment where a woman was allegedly raped by St George Illawarra star Jack de Belin said he initially lied to police about what he'd witnessed, partly because he didn't want to reveal the footballer was cheating on his girlfriend.

Primary school teacher Troy Martin told a NSW District Court jury on Thursday that he woke to noises in the early hours of December 9, 2018 and found Mr de Belin naked in his absent housemate's bedroom with a woman lying naked on the bed and Mr Sinclair standing in the room fully clothed.
Mr Martin admitted he lied to police when he initially told them he had woken briefly to some noises before going back to sleep, telling the court that he had withheld the truth for multiple reasons.

"The first one obviously being that I didn't want to be a part of what I had witnessed, which now has worked out ... worse," Mr Martin told the court under cross-examination by Mr de Belin's barrister David Campbell, SC.



"The second reason, I also knew that Mr de Belin had a partner, and I didn't want to be the responsible one for telling that he was cheating on her."

Asked if there was a third reason, Mr Martin said he also had the distinct impression that police already knew someone else had been inside the apartment, and there were security cameras outside they would probably check.

" I thought] they're going to find out from someone else, not me," he said.

Mr de Belin, 29, and Mr Sinclair, 23, are on trial before Wollongong judge Andrew Haesler, after both pleaded not guilty to five charges each of aggravated sexual assault, claiming the encounter with the then-19-year-old woman after a night of partying was consensual.

Mr Martin said that when he saw the trio through the open bedroom door, the woman asked Mr de Belin, "Who was that?" before someone closed the door, and he went to the bathroom and to get a drink of water.

He then said a still-naked Mr de Belin approached him and said, "Sorry mate, just borrowing your house, didn't realise anyone was home."

Crown prosecutor David Scully put to Mr Martin that he was continuing to lie in his newer version of events, to which Mr Martin replied, "I disagree."

The woman, who cannot be named for legal reasons, previously told the court she never saw another man come to the door, contradicting Mr Martin's version of events, which had earlier been put to her by Mr Campbell.
Under cross-examination, Mr Martin said that police came to the house on the night of December 9, 2018 and confiscated his mobile phone, and after accompanying them to the police station he resolved not to tell them any more than he had to. He agreed in hindsight that he would've behaved differently.

The court heard the police returned his phone to the school where he worked the next day, prompting questions from the school executive about their attendance.

He said he told the executive, as well as his girlfriend and roommate whose room Mr de Belin had been in, that he hadn't been truthful with the police, and in October 2019 completed a statutory declaration that set out the version of events he gave in court.

"I told him that I didn't tell them Jack's name," he said of his conversation with the roommate.

He said he hadn't heard any screams or the word "no" used, to which Mr Campbell replied, "it just looked like three people collected in a room, doing what they wanted to be doing."

Mr Martin agreed.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw...to-protect-jack-de-belin-20201112-p56e2x.html
I have been waiting to hear the testomony of the person who can to the door while all 3 were inside the room. He is an actual witness not hear say or just saying what he was told by another.
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
the fact he isn’t an independent witness and knows the accused will have an impact on his “first hand witness” account.

Anyway hopefully the truth comes out either way.
I doubt there will be anymore significant information come out in the case.

Summing up of both sides argument will be powerful however the jury must consider the facts not hear-say.
 

blue bags

First Grade
Messages
7,898
The woman who says NRL star Jack de Belin raped her sent a second message on social media asking for help during the night, a jury has heard.

Jurors had already heard the then-19-year-old woman sent a "help" message to a friend on Instagram moments after leaving the St George Illawarra forward and his co-accused, Callan Sinclair, outside a Wollongong nightclub in the early hours of December 9, 2018.

But the existence of the second message - not mentioned in the woman's evidence - emerged during evidence from Kiama man Toby Nobes on Wednesday.

Mr Nobes said he'd also participated in a Santa pub crawl on December 8, drinking heavily.

After waking up at a bus stop later that night, he realised his phone was missing and went home.

The next day, he found the phone at the North Wollongong Hotel and discovered the woman had messaged him on Snapchat.

"It just said 'help'," Mr Nobes told the Wollongong District Court.

He said the text was a caption on a photo of "nothing in particular".

Mr Nobes wasn't sure when the message came in or to what extent he replied to it.

As is standard on Snapchat, the messages were automatically deleted shortly after being viewed.

De Belin, 29, and Sinclair, 23, have both pleaded not guilty to sexually assaulting the woman in a North Wollongong unit on the night of the Santa pub crawl. Both men say the sexual activity was consensual.

Mr Nobes told the court he received another photo via Snapchat from the woman on December 9 of a floor. The photo caption was "trying to get my attention that something was wrong", he said.

The woman was at the time in a police station reporting the alleged rape.

Mr Nobes said he couldn't recall any other messages the pair sent each other.

The court has seen records that the woman said "I got raped" and that it was "hard to say how it all happened".


De Belin jury hears of second 'help' msg

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/aap/article-8936439/De-Belin-jury-hears-second-help-msg.html
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top