PNG 2025...

[The Partisan]

Personally not a fan of a PNG NRL team. Would much prefer to see money spent on development of the game domestically.

Plus I sense some well intentioned advocates for international RL have the goal for some kind of Oceania NRL competition.

Wouldn't we rather have a vibrant international competition in the Pacific rather than an elite level mega club comp including everywhere from Christchurch to Perth to Port Moresby to Port Vila.

Just because a location is nearby it doesn't make for the best option.

Strengthen the code in the Pacific through improved domestic pathways ( including schools and unis and womens) and an organised and evolving international program at both club / regional level and full internationals
.

A Pacific Under 20's comp every two years sounds good to me. Ditto an Oceana Invitational for clubs / regions.

PS. I do enjoy watching the Hunters in the Qld comp but have questions re their long term sustainability...especially if the government funding is slashed or removed.

Catching the PNG based Mt Hagen Eagles and another Island nation based team advance to the final of the Oceana Invitational Cup to play a couple of Australian or NZ teams would a better way forward for our game in my opinion.

 

[MugaB]

Personally not a fan of a PNG NRL team. Would much prefer to see money spent on development of the game domestically.

Plus I sense some well intentioned advocates for international RL have the goal for some kind of Oceania NRL competition.

Wouldn't we rather have a vibrant international competition in the Pacific rather than an elite level mega club comp including everywhere from Christchurch to Perth to Port Moresby to Port Vila.

Just because a location is nearby it doesn't make for the best option.

Strengthen the code in the Pacific through improved domestic pathways ( including schools and unis and womens) and an organised and evolving international program at both club / regional level and full internationals
.

A Pacific Under 20's comp every two years sounds good to me. Ditto an Oceana Invitational for clubs / regions.

PS. I do enjoy watching the Hunters in the Qld comp but have questions re their long term sustainability...especially if the government funding is slashed or removed.

Catching the PNG based Mt Hagen Eagles and another Island nation based team advance to the final of the Oceana Invitational Cup to play a couple of Australian or NZ teams would a better way forward for our game in my opinion.

Expand or Die...
Or die tryin

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

I agree with a lot of this.

Seemingly like yourself I don't immediately shitcan ideas or hose them down with why I think things won't work. I think that's the simple thing to do. Moreso I like to think how could it work and what would need to be managed / overcome to ensure it succeeds.

A lot of the proposed areas for expansion all have merit to some degree, but with circumstances that need to be overcome. Eg for mine..

• Adelaide - Juniors / existing RL footprint
• Perth - Travel
• NZ2 - Warriors to be proven a success / Travel.
• Central Coast - fan-base/new eyeballs to TV
• Central Qld - as per Central Coast.
• Brisbane2 - Fanbase of new team tbc. Ie RL fans already follow other clubs.

It's not that these are reasons NOT to take on a new team, but assessing the merits and what the added value to the NRL would be in taking on a team from any of these places (and others). What team would both be able to succeed itself but also add Value to the NRL as a whole.

I do believe there is some merit closely looking at PNG at some point down the track. I do however think they would need to overcome two major circumstances akin to locations above..

Travel Costs and $AUD Revenue.

Travel costs for them will be higher than all other (current) clubs in the NRL. They would be the furthest team from Sydney - a destination they'd need to travel the most to. (That is unless a conference-type competition model is developed, which I'm open to).

The second is club Revenue. Absolutely no doubt that the team would have one of the biggest supporter bases in the NRL, and would pack out home games each and every match. However with exchange rates of the Kina to AUD you'd need to know what the club could feasibly generate in terms of Australian Dollars. Yes, this level of income is only for "PNG" revenue while that from broadcast/advertising on Fox etc would be independent for reach into Oz.


I don't pretend to be a financial or economic expert but it strikes me that this is a major obstacle for PNG, or indeed any island nation to manage. The Hunters have been around the in QLD comps since the 1990's. I don't know how this is managed in terms of travel and revenue etc but something must be managed very well for their tenure to have lasted so long. Others here may know how this is supported. And how finances may need to look for viability at NRL level (what the financial model would need to look like etc).

While I've been an advocate for Adelaide to at least be in the serious discussion of expansion, I think a PNG team would be an exciting addition to the NRL at some point in the future when the time is right. And underlying any/every bid needs to be a strong business case which fosters a progressively and ultimately sustainably successful football club - that adds Value to the NRL.

The Port Moresby Vipers played in the 96/97 Queensland Cup seasons, but withdrew due to the travel costs imposed on them. They had to cover expenses for all the other clubs when they flew to PNG. The Hunters were introduced in 2013 or 2014.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

We know where @The Great Dane stands on expansion. He wants Brisbane 2, NZ2, Adelaide and Perth. That could work and would make the NRL stronger than it is without those teams.

Our game's problem is we have too many areas that need teams and not enough spots available.

I don't know what to think with regards to PNG. Their undying love for the game deserves to be rewarded with a team, but it's probably not economically feasible at this point. The 16 clubs will vote against it. The QRL and NSWRL will do the same.

Colin Smith is an advocate of PNG, so maybe they've got some hope.

I'd like to see New Caledonia and Logan join PNG in the Queensland Cup, which is set to expand into a 16 team competition. New Caledonia will provide a huge shot in the arm for French RL, with pro players from France listed to play in their team if its bid is accepted. After that we can add Adelaide and Perth so that the game can grow.

 

[Perth Red]

Hunters only survived after being bailed out by nrl and png govt (who I’d suggest have more important things to spend their money on than an nrl club)

the politics of rl up there are also insane
https://www.cairnspost.com.au/sport...b/news-story/21cd9d5779298b404cb96c106ef9c9f5

It’ll be interesting to see how the hunters develop now they are no longer under the pngrl administration and are a stand alone club.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Hunters only survived after being bailed out by nrl and png govt (who I’d suggest have more important things to spend their money on than an nrl club)

the politics of rl up there are also insane
https://www.cairnspost.com.au/sport...b/news-story/21cd9d5779298b404cb96c106ef9c9f5

I'd like to see the NRL do something similar with Adelaide and Perth. It'll provide results in the long term.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

There is also the $3 million turnover the Intrust Super Cup entity generated in 2014, including a first-year profit.

“Security was the No.l concern the QRL had before we got in,” Tassell says.

“But we proved that it was not an issue.

“The NRL should be thinking ‘Well, if they can do that (make a profit) with a Queensland Cup team what can they do with an NRL team?’.

“Originally I thought 10 years and we could have an NRL team but it could be sooner than that. If the Hunters go as we expect them to then it could be much sooner.”

https://www.cairnspost.com.au/sport...b/news-story/21cd9d5779298b404cb96c106ef9c9f5

 

[Perth Red]

There is also the $3 million turnover the Intrust Super Cup entity generated in 2014, including a first-year profit.

“Security was the No.l concern the QRL had before we got in,” Tassell says.

“But we proved that it was not an issue.

“The NRL should be thinking ‘Well, if they can do that (make a profit) with a Queensland Cup team what can they do with an NRL team?’.

“Originally I thought 10 years and we could have an NRL team but it could be sooner than
that. If the Hunters go as we expect them to then it could be much sooner.”

https://www.cairnspost.com.au/sport...b/news-story/21cd9d5779298b404cb96c106ef9c9f5

how much of that revenue was club generated compared to grants from png, australian govts and nrl? An nrl club needs to generate in the region of $15million a year, primarily from sponsorship and fan generated revenue. Can png deliver that? like I said I’d love to see it but nrl are super conservative organisation so chances are pretty much zero for the foreseeable future.

a png nrl club would add some excitement and interest to what’s becoming a pretty stale nrl and boost the international game in same way tonga has managed to do,

 

[betcats]

PNG is an extremely poor, violent and corrupt country with one of the most dangerous cities in the world as its capital. An estimated 70% of women there are raped. I’ve been there before it’s not a place you would like to walk alone in. And nobody would want to move there and play for them

This. You are not getting NRL players to sign there. You are not going to get NRL clubs going to PNG regularly to play.

My uncle worked there a lot, he married a local and still would not stay in a place that didnt have armed guards on the door. He ended leaving his wife and getting with a different local woman and the two womens families went to war people got seriously hurt. Its a third world, violent place where tribal ties are still very important.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

how much of that revenue was club generated compared to grants from png, australian govts and nrl? An nrl club needs to generate in the region of $15million a year, primarily from sponsorship and fan generated revenue. Can png deliver that? like I said I’d love to see it but nrl are super conservative organisation so chances are pretty much zero for the foreseeable future.

a png nrl club would add some excitement and interest to what’s becoming a pretty stale nrl and boost the international game in same way tonga has managed to do,

I cannot answer those questions as I have no idea on their financials.

I think the Perth bid has a good business case and have waited long enough. They should be the 17th or 18th team.

 

[Perth Red]

I cannot answer those questions as I have no idea on their financials.
.

that’s why I’m always very mindful when clubs claim strong financials, without the details we have no idea if it’s real and relevant or not. Like eels saying they made a profit last year, but failing to mention if it was due to a multi million hand out from the LC. Or Dolphins claiming they should be in nrl due to $100mill in assets, without knowing their liabilities and bottom line.

 

[T-Boon]

PNG is an extremely poor, violent and corrupt country with one of the most dangerous cities in the world as its capital. An estimated 70% of women there are raped. I’ve been there before it’s not a place you would like to walk alone in. And nobody would want to move there and play for them

This sounds like a place NRL players will fit in well.

 

[T-Boon]

The goal should be to get the PNG national team stronger and get the local league as strong as possible. I don't necessarily think a team in the NRL would even be good for PNG RL.

 

[MugaB]

This sounds like a place NRL players will fit in well.

Or david Fafita signing up for a Balinese team

 

[The Great Dane]

I’ve never claimed to be right or wrong in this thread or my posts

I don’t confuse my opinions with facts. Unlike you.

I’ve not posted “a position” on whether PNG are a viable option for expansion or not. What I did do was post an article, and areas I feel they’d need to address to be considered. But you read it however your brain wants to read it.

So..

Whats my position?

Well you haven’t changed much. This “ridicule” of yours is full the same self-righteousness and self-serving misinterpretation present in previous posts you’ve chased me on in other threads.

I accept ridicule (actually I welcome it) if I’ve posted something ridiculous, claimed something as a fact when it isn’t, or it’s written in good humour. Ridicule from you is never anything related to the above. Ridicule from you is like being flogged with a wet newspaper.

You’ll only ever read things with a closed mind that you interpret in a manner to pick an argument. Actually - that’s a factual assessment not an opinion. My mistake... maybe you’ll change. I don’t know.

While it’s not a fact that you’ll write a long-winded reply to this post that helps you pump your own tyres up, while boring the tits off me and many others in this thread, I’d be highly surprised if you didn’t.

You use 'facts' in forming and presenting your opinion, everybody does, it's impossible not to, and when I'm attacking your 'opinion' I'm actually attacking the information within, i.e. the facts that you've used to build and present your opinion.

Your problem is that often the information you use is at either faulty or not built on anything concrete, and you get the shits when I point it out.

Take for example some of the facts you presented in the post I first replied to that I (and @Get Rid of The Donkeys FYI) disputed, you know the Hunters having been around since the 90s (they haven't been), and then making a series of bad assumptions built on that single piece of bad information.

Instead of 'welcoming' the ridicule for being flat wrong you ignored it and pretended it was some BS personal attack, while, rather ironically, engaging in a BS personal attack, like you always do.

So yeah so much for welcoming ridicule, and BTW you having a go at anybody for being long winded is the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[Perth Red]

We know where @The Great Dane stands on expansion. He wants Brisbane 2, NZ2, Adelaide and Perth. That could work and would make the NRL stronger than it is without those teams.

Our game's problem is we have too many areas that need teams and not enough spots available.

I don't know what to think with regards to PNG. Their undying love for the game deserves to be rewarded with a team, but it's probably not economically feasible at this point. The 16 clubs will vote against it. The QRL and NSWRL will do the same.

Colin Smith is an advocate of PNG, so maybe they've got some hope.

I'd like to see New Caledonia and Logan join PNG in the Queensland Cup, which is set to expand into a 16 team competition. New Caledonia will provide a huge shot in the arm for French RL, with pro players from France listed to play in their team if its bid is accepted. After that we can add Adelaide and Perth so that the game can grow.

Adelaide and perth would be better in nsw cup. Less travel and cost involved.

 

[flippikat]

Adelaide and perth would be better in nsw cup. Less travel and cost involved.

I like the idea of a frontier team like Adelaide or even Perth having a season or two in NSW Cup as a "lead-in" to NRL status. Get the buzz going.

Could even have some of their games as curtain-raisers to NRL games that are taken over there.

 

[TheRam]

Everyone is looking at this in completely the wrong way.....

Every year, the comp is going to see 8 clubs miss the finals (once we move to 18 teams, itll be 10 teams missing out). And, with this, the fans b*tch and whinge and stop turning up to watch.

Well, what if we could bring in teams that would almost permanently fill that bottom parts of the ladder and their fans are super excited just to see their team playing.

Obviously, PNG team wont be signing very many top players and they will be regular easy-beats. But they will pack out their stadium every single week and they will probably never need to worry about money; Im guessing the government might be TOO excited to help out with funding.

Seriously, imagine the wooden spooners playing their last home game in front of this

Sounds to me like the PERFECT team to add to the comp....

You have a point and I agree, but only if they built them a Titans type of cheap Stadium. I'm sick of watching NRL footy played in what basically is a park with some crappy cheap stands. The NRL must look professional and an all seater Stadium should be one of its demands for entry. It would look amazing with the way they would fill it every time they played and the way they go off.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Adelaide and perth would be better in nsw cup. Less travel and cost involved.

NSW Cup has a logistical advantage over Queensland for potential teams from Adelaide and Perth, but its teams are mostly made up of full time professional players. Adelaide and Perth would be thrashed each week, which wouldn't do much for the game.

 

[Perth Tiger]

I like the idea of a frontier team like Adelaide or even Perth having a season or two in NSW Cup as a "lead-in" to NRL status. Get the buzz going.

Could even have some of their games as curtain-raisers to NRL games that are taken over there.

Having Perth in the NSW cup would generate no 'buzz' over here