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parramatta & penrith limiting junior teams??

the beavers

Juniors
Messages
384
been hearing bits and pieces about parra and penrith junior leagues limiting the numbers of teams in each age for next year?
anyone know whats going on and what the reason is?
seems an odd thing to do esp when AFL etc are trying to attract kids to their game....
 

aussiegirl

Juniors
Messages
25
from what i have heard it is to stop the bigger clubs from haveing 5 or 6 sides in the junior ages while smaller clubs are finding it hard to field 1 or 2 sides
 

Delboy

First Grade
Messages
6,907
The reason givemn, is that the "big" clubs are storing numbers and in so doing are makeing life difficult for the samller suburban clubs.

I guess if you draw a line through the successful clubs, ie St Marys, Wenty and Hills, they are run very well and have no problem enticing players from the smaller clubs to strengthen their 2nd and 3 rd teams.

The idea is to get these kids into a more even playing field and not just have big clkubs with 2 dirst div teams etc, the counter argument is to get the junior leagues to do more for these smaller clubs to encourage them to grow, there is little foresight in either junior league.

There is considerable friction in the junior league between the exec and the clubs, actually think that changes in the exec would help.
 

the beavers

Juniors
Messages
384
hearing people on the radio saying they wont travel from 1 club to another if they dont get picked in the top sides.... just play a different local sport instead
big clubs like st marys have always had massive numbers... why they trying to change it now.....
 
Messages
201
The reason for this in Parramatta's case is purely because the junior league management have a personal vendetta against the bigger clubs because they stand up for what is right.
For years now the PDJRL have promised a lot and delivered little and instead of working hard to grow the game they find it easier to try and bring the big clubs down.
Despite what you hear the participation numbers for rugby league in Parramatta are in alarming decline.
I hear that some of the bigger clubs in the district close to the borders have applied to enter other districts.
 

CC_Roosters

First Grade
Messages
5,221
So how has the situation progressed if at all? I heard on 2SM there is a similar issue in Newcastle with the Raymond Terrace club.
 

IFR33K

Coach
Messages
17,043
The reason for this in Parramatta's case is purely because the junior league management have a personal vendetta against the bigger clubs because they stand up for what is right.
For years now the PDJRL have promised a lot and delivered little and instead of working hard to grow the game they find it easier to try and bring the big clubs down.
Despite what you hear the participation numbers for rugby league in Parramatta are in alarming decline.
I hear that some of the bigger clubs in the district close to the borders have applied to enter other districts.


What a joke, your response is. In the Parramatta district, clubs such as wenty are a disgrace.

The supposed 'vendetta' is because the bigger clubs poach the better players from other clubs, and hold on to their weaker players, if they cant field an additional team, they send those less talented players home. They been raping other clubs for years, are that big and powerful, want to dictate how the eels run the juniors.

If clubs aren't restricted to 2 teams per age group, the comps will have to merge. The bulldogs, saints, balmain and souths have merged their 15's and overs, because there isnt enough 'competition' in their own comps

Sometime the little guys need to win too.
 
Messages
201
What a joke, your response is. In the Parramatta district, clubs such as wenty are a disgrace.

The supposed 'vendetta' is because the bigger clubs poach the better players from other clubs, and hold on to their weaker players, if they cant field an additional team, they send those less talented players home. They been raping other clubs for years, are that big and powerful, want to dictate how the eels run the juniors.

If clubs aren't restricted to 2 teams per age group, the comps will have to merge. The bulldogs, saints, balmain and souths have merged their 15's and overs, because there isnt enough 'competition' in their own comps

Sometime the little guys need to win too.

Wow, what an incredibly restricted view of the world you have.

So there is a vendetta, thanks for confirming that.

The Eels run the juniors, hmmmm, no, two people run the juniors and the rest just follow.
The last time I looked there was no competition committee and all changes to rules and competitions were passed through a junior league forum where no agenda was distibuted before hand and every desicion was made via ambush.

If clubs are restricted to two age groups, who is going to pick up the 300 hundred + players that suddenly find themselbes out on the street?
Surely not the smaller clubs as they just dont have the capital and human or terrestrial resourses to take that influx, therefore around 70-80 kids will be distributed to smaller clubs and the rest will be forced to find another sport close by because a) the parents have already stated they wont travel and b) they wont be able to afford playing at a club that can't subsidise their children. It will come down to a matter of cost.

The inner west and south of Sydney competitions have been forced to merge because of a lack of playing numbers in their respective districts.
This is because of the stiff competition they face from soccer, AFL and rugby, not because one or two clubs were bigger than the rest, that has been the case since 1908.
The merged competitions are now growing and it wont be long before they pull apart again and go back into their districts.

And by your narrow view of the world it is about winning and losing huh?
Wenty have been around for 99 years and have not always been a rich club, if you bothered to research their history they went through the same process that every club goes through, they start off small and by good management and offering they grow and expand.
Do yourself a favour and read their history, you might learn something that is being kept from you by the morons at the junior league who you so resolutly follow.
http://www.wentyleagues.com.au/yourclub/History.aspx

What is a disgrace is that people are willing to try and drag down such a great club and other clubs such as hills district who have an equally proud heritage and dont have the backing of a licenced club yet still manage to put 400 + kids on the park each week.
Surrounded by Rouse Hill, Winston Hills, Lalor Park and numerous Penrith clubs they fight each year to retain their kids and in the process do such a great job that they attract players who want to be there.

It amazes me that the stooges for the junior league always seek a way to try and drag these clubs down.
I have never once heard them say, what a great job they do to keep rugby league alive and growing in their district and how wonderful it would be if other clubs followed their base model as a way of improving their own operation, or better, actually asked Wenty and Hills to mentor smaller clubs which I am sure they would do as they are here for one purpose.
To propogate rugby league, not like the peasents in the junior league who restrict the competitions to the point of strangulation.

In case you havent noticed, there are massive holes in age groups from 12's to 17's and dont even mention A Grade, that's a disgrace however instead of planning to shore up those age groups against the rising threat of AFL the junior league choose to try and denigrate the two clubs who are winning the battle, WTF?

Let me guess, you are 35-45, have or had a son playing at, lets say, Marconi, Merrylands or maybe Parramatta Junior Eels and got roped onto the committee and suddenly became the secretary of the club.
You were promised by the junior league that your club would be looked after if you followed them and you duely did, never stopping to think of the impact your weak actions would have.
You now find yourself trapped in that you dont understand why these rules are being put in place but you have been assured it is for the betterment of your club and you blindly follow, or better still, you are a junior league executive who cant stand the fact that for the last 10 years you have been responsible for the mismanagement of the district and will do anything to distract people away from that fact.

Shame on the people that try and drag a club/s down because they are successful.
You should be applauding them and trying to emulate them but instead you try and destroy them.
What good are you to the game of rugby league.
The tall poppy syndrome at it's best right there folks.
 

franklin2323

Immortal
Messages
33,546
So how has the situation progressed if at all?

I work with 1 of the big clubs so i know 1st hand. It still happening in Penrith. Only the Sunday teams u15's up. From what I can gather it was initally brought up by a group of parents. They were annoyed their kid played all trials, a few games in Matts is over & the kid is on the sideline for the rest of the year.

St Marys for example has Colyton, West Tigers, Rooty Hill, PCYC all within 10mins drive. Yet can't fill teams while others have kids sitting on the sideline. So if they want to play they can just elsewhere. If a few go together they can carpool etc. So i can't see many leaving.
 

aussiegirl

Juniors
Messages
25
what a typical response from the big clubs open your eyes instead of your mouth and you will see the small clubs are slowly dying you moron if it keeps going there will only be 5 or 6 super clubs and the rest will slowly dissapear it is the only way to try and make an even comp.
 
Messages
201
what a typical response from the big clubs open your eyes instead of your mouth and you will see the small clubs are slowly dying you moron if it keeps going there will only be 5 or 6 super clubs and the rest will slowly dissapear it is the only way to try and make an even comp.


Hahah, another puppet of the regime rears their head.

Show me the evidence that says the big clubs have made any of the smaller clubs go under in the last 10 years......

Cant think of any huh, that's because there is none.

The only clubs to have folded during the last 10 years is Holroyd and that was because of poor management.
Farifield United almost went under, again because of poor management however it was the great Cabramatta club who bailed them out and stopped them from going into extinction.

That my friend is not raping and pilaging, that is doing the right thing for the love of the game.

Same deal with Lalor Park, the once great club was so poorly managed that it almost fell of the globe however, the Parramatta club bailed it out and Wentworthville assisted to make it viable again, so another myth is busted.

Oh and by the way, the person who mismanaged Lalor Park is now mismanaging the entire district, go figure that one out.

Of the big clubs, Cabramatta voluntarily cap their teams, Mounties have fielded under 20 teams ever since the rocket scientists at the junior league decided that they couldn't subsidise their fees anymore and drove everyone to the Wests comp, Wenty have consistantly had the same amount of teams for the last decade and so have Hills who are completely self funded.

Of the smaller clubs around these, none have shown a net decrease in playing numbers for the same period, in fact Parramatta City Titans have grown by 150%, and clubs around Cabramatta and Mounties continue to prosper.

At the end of the day, there is no evidence to support your claims, it is nothing but a witch hunt to try and denigrate the great clubs of the district and save the smaller clubs with lazy committee's from having to emulate their peers.
The majority of committee's do a great job and have no problem with the bigger clubs, it is the small vocal minority who are too lazy to aspire to be the next Hills or Titans that just want to bring everyone down to their level.

Go back to your club and figure out where and when it all went wrong and you will see who the common denominator is and then we will see who is the moron. :lol:
 

aussiegirl

Juniors
Messages
25
well well well must have hit nerve if you read everyones posts no one is trying to run these clubs down it is about trying to make it an even playing field.What i am saying is why do clubs need 4 or 5 teams in an age group, i will tell you why because you have 99% of club secretaries doning it for the love of it not getting paid like some that is why certain clubs need multible teams:D
 

Captain Mulga

Juniors
Messages
116
There is a lot of emotion in this subject and while I think this comment will mostly fall on deaf ears and be shouted down as is generally the case when a big club voices its opinion, let me give you a perspective on this from a big clubs point of view.

None of the bigger clubs wish to see any small clubs fold.
The bigger club have and will continue to help smaller clubs for the betterment of the game however, these are the facts:

The restrictive nature of the competitions in all age groups is causing a heavy loss of playing numbers (4 teams in U17's 1st Div and U12's 1st Div) and these further restrictions on playing numbers particularly U6- U9's will diminish playing numbers in the long term as once parents direct their children to another sport or withdraw them from rugby league because they cant play for the club they wish they are more than likely to stay away for good.

Parents in low income areas are reliant on the bigger clubs to offer their children affordable sporting activities however this is being slowly eroded and we have found that parents are now not registering their children in rugby league but are taking them to other sports or selecting when the children can play.
In some instances children from the same family alternate years that they play as the parents cannot afford for both to participate together.

Restricting players in these age groups at club level is not the answer as invariably the children spread out to other clubs as they get older anyway due to proximity or peer influence.

A reduction in numbers at this stage will see age groups in 7-10 years time fall further behind and give other codes a perfect opportunity to boost numbers that will be unrecoverable.
We have already seen an influence from the GWS AFL franchise in the last 6-12 months and that can be expected to rise.
Speaking to some ARL liaison officers it is apparent that the AFL are becoming aggressive in their targeting of school age children with the district.

A loss of numbers now will have a dramatic effect on the Parramatta representative teams and NYC team and for a district that prided itself on producing local talent to NRL level, it would be a shame.
In order to combat these issues we need to have a strong base at Mini and Mod level and keep these children in the game for as long as possible at International level so that senior numbers at district and NSWRL level remain equally as strong and we have a larger pool of talent to choose from when it comes to district representation.

Whether you like it or not, the bigger clubs provide the district with stablity in both playing numbers and standards and restricting numbers to the bigger clubs will just see more parents take their children to other sports or withdraw.
We have comprehensive research that supports this although it has been largely ignored by the district, what the parents tell us is in these surveys is a general indication across the board of what will occur.
I have to agree that there is no evidence that the bigger clubs have effected the numbers at smaller clubs in fact, it is the opposite.
When you take a look at player transfers, there are more outgoing from big clubs to smaller clubs than incoming which proves that you need to the bigger clubs to hold as many players as they can, and want to be at the club in mini and mod.
Once the players reach international level they tend to make their own decisions on what club they wish to be at based on demographics and peer influence.
With 44 playing fields now allocated as AFL only in the greater west, now is not the time to restirct numbers from the big clubs.
 
Messages
201
well well well must have hit nerve if you read everyones posts no one is trying to run these clubs down it is about trying to make it an even playing field.What i am saying is why do clubs need 4 or 5 teams in an age group, i will tell you why because you have 99% of club secretaries doning it for the love of it not getting paid like some that is why certain clubs need multible teams:D

Its even now, its just that some clubs can afford to hold more than others.

Anyway, there will be no convincing people like you, puppets of the regime.

Read the link dopey and enough said.

http://hills-shire-times.whereilive.com.au/sport/story/rugby-league-offer-for-primary-schools/
 

Maroubra Eel

Coach
Messages
19,044
I have two boys (2 and 3). It scares me when I read threads like these. I hope if my boys decide to play league we never run into the people who post in these threads. You all sound nasty and self interested.
 
Messages
201
I have two boys (2 and 3). It scares me when I read threads like these. I hope if my boys decide to play league we never run into the people who post in these threads. You all sound nasty and self interested.


Dont mistake passion for predujice, people have a right to their opinion, right or wrong.

I personally think enough has been written on this subject and that we need to take action to ensure clubs are not limited and there are no adverse restrictions placed on clubs as I see it as a danger to the continued viability of rugby league in western Sydney.

If we don't change our districts management position very soon here are my predictions for league in western Sydney.

Western Suburbs - Extinct and will become part of the Canberra or St George / Illawarra district.

Parramatta - Merged with Balmain to become one district and become the Inter City Tigers (as Parramatta is now classed as inner city) with Wests Magpies completely obliterated from the face of the earth, much to the embarrasment of the NSWRL.

Penrith - Will stand alone and expand to take in emerging suburbs on the outer fringe of the Parramatta and Western Suburbs Districts.

Canterbury - Will stand alone for now.

Out of the three clubs that can truly be classed as western suburbs districts (Wests, Parramatta and Penrith) only Penrith will survive as a rugby league stronghold.
Both Wests and Parramatta will be amoungst the first to fall to the AFL and it will take over a decade and millions of dollars to get it back.
 

Delboy

First Grade
Messages
6,907
I believe the clubs on the board were the smaller ones for some reason, Merrylands, Kellyville and Marconi come to mind but not really sure

The bigger clubs did not get on with the Exec Officer and the board and will feel much more comfortable with the change
 

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