2018 Crowd Watch

[Hoofhearted]

Comments like this are just ignorant.

The Round 1 AFL game in question between Richmond & Carlton will get a higher crowd than last years NRL Grand Final. Instead of taking pot shots at other sports, maybe we should look at what they do well?

Went to a luncheon a couple of years ago and the speaker was Andrew Demetriou, he spoke in detail about how in the late 80's the VFL was broke and going nowhere. The problem was all the self interest driven clubs who didnt want to see the game move outside Victoria had too much control.
Solution, they voted in an Independent Commission (backed by said clubs) that took control of the game, focused on long term goals such as club memberships, game day experience, revenue streams and expansion. They had a 20 year plan to have a local derby in every major city in Australia, their focus would not be on current supporters of other codes but rather the next generation.
He pointed out that the first 5 or so years were very rocky with discontent among clubs not liking having control taken away and basically finding their feet, but over time the results started to show. Fast forward 20 odd years later and they have achieved pretty much every KPI, almost all clubs have 50k+ members, their average crowd is in the mid 30k, record revenue through sponsorship and TV and they have a local derby in every major city.
I have not seen a strategic 20 year plan from the NRL, everything seems reactive. I agree totally with Mister M, we could do a lot worse than to learn from the AFL.

 

[Stallion]

Were they? Broke, 10 - 12k fans, homeless, even before SL they weren't setting the world on fire. The game is bigger now than when the bears were in.

Not in northern Sydney!

 

[Stallion]

It’s a shit sport played by emaciated spastics. I’ll continue to take pot shots at it.

It's a "training run"!

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Went to a luncheon a couple of years ago and the speaker was Andrew Demetriou, he spoke in detail about how in the late 80's the VFL was broke and going nowhere. The problem was all the self interest driven clubs who didnt want to see the game move outside Victoria had too much control.
Solution, they voted in an Independent Commission (backed by said clubs) that took control of the game, focused on long term goals such as club memberships, game day experience, revenue streams and expansion. They had a 20 year plan to have a local derby in every major city in Australia, their focus would not be on current supporters of other codes but rather the next generation.
He pointed out that the first 5 or so years were very rocky with discontent among clubs not liking having control taken away and basically finding their feet, but over time the results started to show. Fast forward 20 odd years later and they have achieved pretty much every KPI, almost all clubs have 50k+ members, their average crowd is in the mid 30k, record revenue through sponsorship and TV and they have a local derby in every major city.
I have not seen a strategic 20 year plan from the NRL, everything seems reactive. I agree totally with Mister M, we could do a lot worse than to learn from the AFL.

Agree with pretty much all of this but they do not have a derby in Brisbane - hell they are lucky to have 12k rock up to watch the one Brisbane team that they have play at the moment - and no, Gold Coast is not Brisbane.

 

[Stallion]

Were they? Broke, 10 - 12k fans, homeless, even before SL they weren't setting the world on fire. The game is bigger now than when the bears were in.

Not in Northern Sydney!

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Not in northern Sydney!

Melbourne is bigger than North Sydney and they have more than replaced the bears fans and had a much more positive impact on the TV deal.

Also:
Perth is bigger than North Sydney
Adelaide is bigger than North Sydney
Brisbane is bigger than North Sydney

All of these expansion options above would increase the footprint of the game and have a much higher potential for growing the game and it's revenues than the Bears who are restricted to a suburb (or group of) in Sydney.

Oh and on the game going backwards in NS - that is the Bears' fault. They have let it go to shit and they won't let anyone else step in and take it over. Another reason why they don't deserve a spot back in the NRL.

 

[Stallion]

Melbourne is bigger than North Sydney and they have more than replaced the bears fans and had a much more positive impact on the TV deal.

Also:
Perth is bigger than North Sydney
Adelaide is bigger than North Sydney
Brisbane is bigger than North Sydney

All of these expansion options above would increase the footprint of the game and have a much higher potential for growing the game and it's revenues than the Bears who are restricted to a suburb (or group of) in Sydney.

Oh and on the game going backwards in NS - that is the Bears' fault. They have let it go to shit and they won't let anyone else step in and take it over. Another reason why they don't deserve a spot back in the NRL.

Still not understanding. You lose top flight status you lose the locals! An established fan base was destroyed by poor decisions in planning the future of the code as a result of the superleague fiasco. You ignore this fact so we dissagree. Once again their are no issues with expansion clubs. The Bears would consolidate the code in Northern Sydney and the Central Coast. If you dont think that would work we will differ.

 

[Stallion]

Wonder if the NRL or clubs will aggressively promote the double header at ANZ this Saturday! ? It's worth promoting. If some decent publicity and decent pricing occurs a high crowd can be achieved. (weather permitting ) Something like the doubleheader needs to be hyped up big time. Wonder if this will happen!?

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Still not understanding. You lose top flight status you lose the locals! An established fan base was destroyed by poor decisions in planning the future of the code as a result of the superleague fiasco. You ignore this fact so we dissagree. Once again their are no issues with expansion clubs. The Bears would consolidate the code in Northern Sydney and the Central Coast. If you dont think that would work we will differ.

They 1) do not deserve a spot in the NRL due to the state of the game in their area (which is by-the-way one suburb out of the entire country) and 2) are not needed, the game is bigger and richer with more members, TV viewers and a higher average attendance than at anytime during the Bears' time in top flight.

Why waste an NRL licence on North Sydney (max ceiling 16k fans when they are having a good season) when Perth and Brisbane 2 will add an incredibly more value to the broadcast rights and in terms of average attendances to their game, members and TV viewers. It is a no brainer.

I know you think that there is room for all of the expansion teams plus North Sydney but there is not and I think you'll find the NRL agree with me. They won't bring in Perth, Brisbane 2, Adelaide, NZ 2 and North Sydney - it is not going to happen. They already have their hands full with the oversaturation of the Sydney market as it is.

 

[Stallion]

They 1) do not deserve a spot in the NRL due to the state of the game in their area (which is by-the-way one suburb out of the entire country) and 2) are not needed, the game is bigger and richer with more members, TV viewers and a higher average attendance than at anytime during the Bears' time in top flight.

Why waste an NRL licence on North Sydney (max ceiling 16k fans when they are having a good season) when Perth and Brisbane 2 will add an incredibly more value to the broadcast rights and in terms of average attendances to their game, members and TV viewers. It is a no brainer.

I know you think that there is room for all of the expansion teams plus North Sydney but there is not and I think you'll find the NRL agree with me. They won't bring in Perth, Brisbane 2, Adelaide, NZ 2 and North Sydney - it is not going to happen. They already have their hands full with the oversaturation of the Sydney market as it is.

Central Coast stadium holds in excess of 20000. And their is no oversaturation in the three regions you label as Sydney . This "oversaturation " comment is purely a furfy aimed at mistakenly diluting the code and its relevance in this part of NSW . Very disrespectful and not good business or smart for the consolidation of the code in its major foundation region going forward.

 

[Zadar]

It’s a shit sport played by emaciated spastics. I’ll continue to take pot shots at it.

LOL.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Central Coast stadium holds in excess of 20000. And their is no oversaturation in the three regions you label as Sydney . This "oversaturation " comment is purely a furfy aimed at mistakenly diluting the code and its relevance in this part of NSW . Very disrespectful and not good business or smart for the consolidation of the code in its major foundation region going forward.

NIB in Perth holds 20,500 but has a much greater upside in terms of TV broadcast dollars and viewership

Suncorp in Brisbane holds 52,500 and again, a potential expansion team there hold the ace in terms of a game in Brisbane every week for Broadcasters - again they bring TV $ and fans to the table.

I'm not sure what you mean by the 'three regions of Sydney' I don't remember making reference to this.

Central Coast has been taken by the Roosters as an area - the Bears had their chance and f@#ked it, just like North Sydney.

Oh and Sydney is overcrowded. Underperforming clubs are preventing Perth and Brisbane 2 from growing the game further and they are preventing the big Sydney clubs from growing into the powerhouses of Australian sport that they should be.

Keep going with the 'diluting' line - I've shown you how the game is bigger now than it was with the Bears in the comp. Same will be the case if other non-performing (key term) clubs are cut from the NRL in the future.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Silly and ignorant comment. Its been discussed before. The critical and crucial difference is the Sydney club competition rose to national notoriety as a result of the tv exposure of the 70s, 80's and early 90s. This was not the case for the clubs you refer to. Not too say their is no respect from myself, however the reality is the Sydney clubs became household names and had widespread recognition as a result of this unprecedented tv exposure. That's why the Sydney brands are so dynamic and should be respected at all costs. It’s a market and established cultural advantage on other codes. It matters !

Just because YOU say this tv shit makes a Sydney-centric comp ok, does not make it true...

And even if you are right, it just proves that we dont need local teams in every suburb since TV can cover most areas.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Not in northern Sydney!

Honestly, if the Bears are so bad a junior development that they cannot bring in players without an NRL team, they shouldnt be put in charge of ANYTHING...

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Went to a luncheon a couple of years ago and the speaker was Andrew Demetriou, he spoke in detail about how in the late 80's the VFL was broke and going nowhere. The problem was all the self interest driven clubs who didnt want to see the game move outside Victoria had too much control.
Solution, they voted in an Independent Commission (backed by said clubs) that took control of the game, focused on long term goals such as club memberships, game day experience, revenue streams and expansion. They had a 20 year plan to have a local derby in every major city in Australia, their focus would not be on current supporters of other codes but rather the next generation.
He pointed out that the first 5 or so years were very rocky with discontent among clubs not liking having control taken away and basically finding their feet, but over time the results started to show. Fast forward 20 odd years later and they have achieved pretty much every KPI, almost all clubs have 50k+ members, their average crowd is in the mid 30k, record revenue through sponsorship and TV and they have a local derby in every major city.
I have not seen a strategic 20 year plan from the NRL, everything seems reactive. I agree totally with Mister M, we could do a lot worse than to learn from the AFL.

There is the Phoenix Rises book by Ross something that covers all of this.

Great read, even if it is about flogball.

 

[Stallion]

Just because YOU say this tv shit makes a Sydney-centric comp ok, does not make it true...

And even if you are right, it just proves that we dont need local teams in every suburb since TV can cover most areas.

But it does! And that's a fact! And a massive fact! Says I and others! You implosion dudes just haven't worked it out!

 

[Stallion]

NIB in Perth holds 20,500 but has a much greater upside in terms of TV broadcast dollars and viewership

Suncorp in Brisbane holds 52,500 and again, a potential expansion team there hold the ace in terms of a game in Brisbane every week for Broadcasters - again they bring TV $ and fans to the table.

I'm not sure what you mean by the 'three regions of Sydney' I don't remember making reference to this.

Central Coast has been taken by the Roosters as an area - the Bears had their chance and f@#ked it, just like North Sydney.

Oh and Sydney is overcrowded. Underperforming clubs are preventing Perth and Brisbane 2 from growing the game further and they are preventing the big Sydney clubs from growing into the powerhouses of Australian sport that they should be.

Keep going with the 'diluting' line - I've shown you how the game is bigger now than it was with the Bears in the comp. Same will be the case if other non-performing (key term) clubs are cut from the NRL in the future.

What a dumb response! You just cant get in your head that expansion can occur without diluting the most recognisable and significant club brands in Australia. You cant replicate the advantage the tv exposure decades have given to this competition with these very popular "Sydney" clubs! Their are three regions implicated with your destructionist stance not one but three. Six million people and growing can easily accomodate ten Top flight clubs but you can't do the maths or understand the rivalries at play. That's you and a few of your equally nauve 'mates", not others, that can see your flawed thinking!

 

[M2D2]

Oh and Sydney is overcrowded. Underperforming clubs are preventing Perth and Brisbane 2 from growing the game further and they are preventing the big Sydney clubs from growing into the powerhouses of Australian sport that they should be.

 

[Last Week]

Went to a luncheon a couple of years ago and the speaker was Andrew Demetriou, he spoke in detail about how in the late 80's the VFL was broke and going nowhere. The problem was all the self interest driven clubs who didnt want to see the game move outside Victoria had too much control.
Solution, they voted in an Independent Commission (backed by said clubs) that took control of the game, focused on long term goals such as club memberships, game day experience, revenue streams and expansion. They had a 20 year plan to have a local derby in every major city in Australia, their focus would not be on current supporters of other codes but rather the next generation.
He pointed out that the first 5 or so years were very rocky with discontent among clubs not liking having control taken away and basically finding their feet, but over time the results started to show. Fast forward 20 odd years later and they have achieved pretty much every KPI, almost all clubs have 50k+ members, their average crowd is in the mid 30k, record revenue through sponsorship and TV and they have a local derby in every major city.
I have not seen a strategic 20 year plan from the NRL, everything seems reactive. I agree totally with Mister M, we could do a lot worse than to learn from the AFL.

Precisely.

But no let's give clubs and state leagues positions on the commission Because they've done great so far.

 

[unforgiven]

Melbourne is bigger than North Sydney and they have more than replaced the bears fans and had a much more positive impact on the TV deal.

Also:
Perth is bigger than North Sydney
Adelaide is bigger than North Sydney
Brisbane is bigger than North Sydney

All of these expansion options above would increase the footprint of the game and have a much higher potential for growing the game and it's revenues than the Bears who are restricted to a suburb (or group of) in Sydney.

Oh and on the game going backwards in NS - that is the Bears' fault. They have let it go to shit and they won't let anyone else step in and take it over. Another reason why they don't deserve a spot back in the NRL.

Attracting new a customer is anywhere from 5 to 25 times more expensive than retaining an existing customer.