2020 season

Discussion in 'Penrith Panthers' started by franklin2323, May 17, 2019.

  1. betcats

    betcats Coach

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    When every running metres stat points to us being down the bottom of the competition which lines up with what I saw all year then its safe to say we struggled for metres. You can over analyse anything to make it say what you want. Look at the ARM stat for the year, specifically who is at the bottom and who is at the top. its a pretty clear indicator.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  2. snickers007

    snickers007 Juniors

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    James Tedesco had the most handling errors of any player last year. Must mean he's the worst player in the comp right?
     
  3. betcats

    betcats Coach

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    What a stupid comment. I am saying we didn't make metres easily like others have claimed. I haven't cherry picked one stat and claimed it was definitive. You aren't even close to hitting the mark with this comment.
     
  4. franklin2323

    franklin2323 Referee

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    He is more then a quick play the ball though
     
  5. Pomoz

    Pomoz Juniors

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    Betcats, you seem sure that what you saw was us struggling for metres. What I saw was a team rolling up the field (when it had the ball and not having the lowest possession % in the NRL) without too many problems, showing a complete lack of creativity and then when in the 20m zone, running from side to side hoping a gap would appear.

    Given the forward pack issues you saw, can you explain how we had the most sets in the opposition 20? How would having the most errors and therefore he lowest possession percentage, impact that? I don't see, given the data available, how you can draw any conclusions about our forward pack based on run metre stats. Especially when you have the third lowest line breaks, an area where the top 50 is dominated by backs and which gives teams easy metres.

    Getting up the field wasn't an issue, the stats support that. As others have said, we toiled inside the 20m zone for endless sets of Cleary ball (turn the ball inside to Kikau/another player [insert player of choice]), this limits the metres made. With a poor pack, we just wouldn't get up the field to get the ball in the 20m zone. We were bottom of the NRL for kick metres, so we didn't get there with the brilliance of our kicking and massive kicks to get field position.

    I don't think our pack is the best in the NRL and can be improved, but I just don't see how it was the problem last year. Tamou and JFH were both top 30 for run metres. I think the truth lies closer to the fact that we don't create line breaks, or tackle breaks and we move the ball from side to side. We have limited dummy half runs and lack creativity making us predictable and easy to defend against. In spite of that, we still roll up the field so we can attack in the 20m zone. The side to side movement in the red zone is what killed our ability to score and kept our run metres low.

    Six of our players were in the top 50 for errors. Only two (Kikau and Martin) were forwards. Forwards our problem? Yeah but no.
     
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  6. betcats

    betcats Coach

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    He would be amazing for us I think. A skilled 13 with fast feet in amongst all our big bodies would be lethal. A Murray or Radley style lock would really suit us imo but we don’t really have anyone in that mould.
     
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  7. betcats

    betcats Coach

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    Im not saying the errors didn’t effect our metres, but do you really think the errors had such an effect that we are dead last in metres per set, 11th in PCT metres and 12th in ARM despite being able to make metres easily? It’s ridiculous . Having the most attacking sets in the 20 has far more to do with our inability to score tries then it does with our ability to make metres, we had many repeat sets this season which has contributed also to having more attacking sets in the twenty. The roosters had a a bottom 3 completion rate and yet they ran for the most metres. The roosters had the most errors in the competition and yet they ran for the most metres. So I think you are over blowing the impact making lots of errors has on running metres quite a bit. As for our backs being the problem because they made errors, as snickers just pointed out Tedesco made the most errors, does that make him a problem for the roosters?

    I think our backs certainly need to improve, I’m just arguing the idea that signing some good forwards is stupid because we made metres easily as has been claimed, because we did not make metres easily.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  8. franklin2323

    franklin2323 Referee

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    We know where we sat for errors, Missed tackles etc so won’t post them.

    Fox Stats backs up the NRL.com ones. 2 different stats virtually the same numbers

    13th in run metres
    16th kick metres
    13th tackle busts
    12th linebreaks
    11th linebreak assists
    12th try assists
    11th total runs

    very few of those stats are due to outside backs. So I don’t see how we wasted money on the 3 we signed given what they bring to the table
     
  9. franklin2323

    franklin2323 Referee

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    Kenny is the closest we have
     
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  10. Dave's mate

    Dave's mate Juniors

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    What if May is still at the club?
     
  11. franklin2323

    franklin2323 Referee

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    He was the hope to play that role. Not sure where he sits now
     
  12. betcats

    betcats Coach

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    He could be an old school lock for sure. I don’t think he has the speed of a Murray off the mark though.
     
  13. CCJohnC

    CCJohnC Juniors

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    What about Liam Martin?
     
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  14. Westernised Panther

    Westernised Panther Juniors

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    I like the idea of Liam Martin at lock. But has he ever played in that position?
     
  15. OldPanther

    OldPanther Coach

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    Oh definitely not, the comparison was more that there is a positive attribute we can get out of him. Cam Murray is 50x the forward Leota is. I do take you're overall point though. It makes sense.
     
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  16. Blade23

    Blade23 Juniors

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    Yes played plenty in lower grades at lock. He runs a good line thats why he gets shifted to the edge.

    He started half a dozen games last year at lock in fg. Our wins over Souths, Chooks and the Warriiors IIRC.
    He loves the competitiveness, hits hard and runs a good line. He is a good defender but needs a little work on defence. He made a few bad reads last year, to be fair some when he got tired.
    I think he will make an excellent lock in years to come as his game grows.
     
  17. franklin2323

    franklin2323 Referee

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    He is the forward that most excites me but he tackles hard. Runs hard but not very creative
     
  18. franklin2323

    franklin2323 Referee

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    He was a lock coming through the grades
     
  19. Kilkenny

    Kilkenny First Grade

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    Liam Martin really good debut season, he is gonna benefit from that enormously and I am expecting him to have a really good 2020 regardless of where Ivan plays him.
     
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  20. OldPanther

    OldPanther Coach

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