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2nd Test: Australia v South Africa at Adelaide 22-26 Nov

Hallatia

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26,433
Cricket Australia tweeted 4 hours ago (I just saw ICC retweet it)
Cricket Australia said:
*All-rounder Shane Watson says he has ruled out bowling if he is selected for the 2nd Vodafone Test in Adelaide #AUSvSA #cmonmate
 

Red Bear

Referee
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20,882
you have Siddle as your third choice?
Are you only including currently fit guys on your list because I think Watson is Australia's top quick bowler at the moment and Harris and Cummins in my oopinion would be ahead of him. I'm sure there are other obvious ones as well
At this stage, based on durability and performance, I think Siddle is def top 3. I wouldnt even bother with Harris anymore, can barely get through a match, let alone back up for a consecutive test. It's unfortunate for him but he has issues that will not improve.

Cummins is at the other end of the scale, where he's quick and young but body clearly has not been built up for test cricket at this point. He's years of being a consistent member of the side.

Regardless of Gabba performance I'd still have Pattinson first quick chosen, followed by Hilf and Siddle. Beyond that there is basically a heap of potentially excellent bowlers but nothing really proven.

Re Watson, dont pick him as a batsmen only, You basically picking and injured player who will be slow around the field, slow between wickets etc. Fully fit or not at all.

Im also happy to see Quiney, Warner again. Writing careers off on one innings is, frankly, stupidity.
 

Earl

Coach
Messages
16,804
so he should be. if he can't bowl, how is he going to run effectively between the wickets, or throw himself around the feild.
 

madunit

Super Moderator
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62,358
Pity Siddle was picked again.

He needs to start watching shitloads of tape of all his wickets and find the common denominator with them - ie - ball pitched up on or just outside off stump.
 

madunit

Super Moderator
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62,358
Just had a look at some quick stats, of course they are subjective to interpretation, but do show something interesting.

A lot of the great quicks of the past claimed at least 60% of their wickets by LBW/Bowled & caught behind.

So here's a list showing our current bowlers and how they stack up with some past Australian bowlers and top bowlers from other countries.

Bowler - LBW - Bowled - Ct behind - Other Dismissal - % LBW/Bowled/Ct Behind
Siddle - 17 - 19 - 32 - 52 - 56.7%
Hilfenhaus - 16 - 15 - 22 -41 - 56.4%
Watson - 20 - 13 - 15 - 11 - 81.4%
Johnson - 25 - 29 - 58 - 78 - 58.9%
Bollinger - 5 - 9 -14 - 22 - 56.0%
Harris - 8 - 11 - 11 - 17 - 63.8%
Pattinson - 4 - 9 - 6 -12 - 61.3%
Starc - 3 - 2 - 2 - 3 - 70.0%

S.Clark - 19 - 13 - 25 - 37 - 60.6%
G.McGrath - 113 - 76 - 152 - 221 - 60.7%
J.Gillespie - 59 - 45 - 66 - 89 - 65.6%
M.Kasprowicz - 15 - 26 - 29 - 43 - 61.9%
B.Lee - 44 - 66 - 91 - 109 - 64.8%

D.Lillee - 62 - 54 - 97 - 142 - 60.0%
R.Lindwall - 31 - 98 - 44 - 55 - 75.9%

W.Akram - 119 - 102 - 70 - 123 - 70.3%
K.Dev - 112 - 87 - 96 - 139 - 68.0%
M.Marshall - 76 - 73 - 83 - 144 - 61.7%
W.Younis - 110 - 102 - 65 - 96 - 74.3%
I.Khan - 80 - 96 - 68 - 118 - 67.4%
C.Vaas - 100 - 37 - 88 - 130 - 63.4%
A.Donald - 41 - 62 - 100 - 127 - 61.5%
 

Twizzle

Administrator
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154,229
which is why I dont believe in stats, there are some here that will say Clarke can only bat at 5 and not 3 according to the stats, but they dont say where he batted at 3, like which country, was he at home or away, who was bowling, were they hacks or not, how did he get out, ct at the wicket or on the boundary, pace or spin, what was the pitch like, I could go on but............

back to these idiot selectors, good to see Quiney rewarded for his brilliant 9 and as for our hack bowlers Patto fair enough but Starc should be the second bowler picked

can anyone really see Hilfy and Sids bowling the saffas out twice on a road like Adelaide oval

if this wasn't really happening, it would be pretty funny, but alas its real
 

Red Bear

Referee
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20,882
which is why I dont believe in stats, there are some here that will say Clarke can only bat at 5 and not 3 according to the stats, but they dont say where he batted at 3, like which country, was he at home or away, who was bowling, were they hacks or not, how did he get out, ct at the wicket or on the boundary, pace or spin, what was the pitch like, I could go on but............

back to these idiot selectors, good to see Quiney rewarded for his brilliant 9 and as for our hack bowlers Patto fair enough but Starc should be the second bowler picked

can anyone really see Hilfy and Sids bowling the saffas out twice on a road like Adelaide oval

if this wasn't really happening, it would be pretty funny, but alas its real
Why? He's bowling rubbish at shield level and if he bowls like that at the Adelaide Oval Kallis, Amla and AB will eat him alive.
 

Mr Angry

Not a Referee
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51,816
Well at least Australias most selfish sportsman was not picked.

I would go Starc over Hilfy.
 

Earl

Coach
Messages
16,804
People say Hilfenhaus looks underdone because of all the limited overs cricker he has played in the last few months. Starc is just as underdone.

They both only played 2 first class games. (Starc 2 Sheild games, Hilfy 1 Sheild/1 Test)

Starc will more than likely get his chance in Perth anyway. He'll be fighting it out though with Pattinson, Siddle & Hilfenhaus for the chance to join Mitchell Johnson at the WACA
 

Timbo

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Staff member
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20,281
Can't believe they retained Hilf after the 125kph pies he was dishing up in Brisbane.

Oh well at least we get Johnson back at the WACA. Huzzah!

And don't even start me on Quiney. Was the wrong decision in Brisbane. Is still the wrong decision now.
 

simmo1

First Grade
Messages
5,573
Watson on one leg is still better than Quiney.

Actually Watson on one leg is probably better than Watson on two legs as its harder for him to be given LBW.
 

madunit

Super Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,358
which is why I dont believe in stats, there are some here that will say Clarke can only bat at 5 and not 3 according to the stats, but they dont say where he batted at 3, like which country, was he at home or away, who was bowling, were they hacks or not, how did he get out, ct at the wicket or on the boundary, pace or spin, what was the pitch like, I could go on but............

back to these idiot selectors, good to see Quiney rewarded for his brilliant 9 and as for our hack bowlers Patto fair enough but Starc should be the second bowler picked

can anyone really see Hilfy and Sids bowling the saffas out twice on a road like Adelaide oval

if this wasn't really happening, it would be pretty funny, but alas its real

Batting stats wise i agree.

Bowling stats wise though, these figures do tell a more accurate picture, essentially showing the value of pitching it up consistently
 

Hallatia

Referee
Messages
26,433
Australia carry stronger form to Adelaide
The Preview by Brydon Coverdale
November 21, 2012

Match facts
November 22-26, Adelaide Oval
Start time 1030 (0000 GMT)
Big Picture
Australia and South Africa don't do draws. But for a Saturday completely lost to rain, that trend may well have continued at the Gabba. Instead, the teams have headed to Adelaide still locked at 0-0, although Australia took more positives from the Brisbane Test. After a disappointing first day on which their bowlers took only two wickets, they fought back to be in the prime position on the final day, but time ran out for them to manufacture a result. All the same, they will head in to the second Test knowing that Ed Cowan has proven himself a Test-quality opener, Michael Clarke's monumental 2012 has shown no signs of ending early, Michael Hussey has broken a seven-year century drought against South Africa, and most of the bowlers found form as the Gabba Test played out. David Warner remains a slight concern at the top of the order but in the main things are simmering away nicely in the Australian setup.

For South Africa, there wasn't much to like about the Gabba Test apart from the continued brilliance of Hashim Amla and Jacques Kallis. Alviro Petersen showed why he should not be underestimated on the first day with 64, but that was about it. Questions remain around whether Jacques Rudolph offers enough value; since his return to the side last November he has played 12 Tests for one century. But more than the batting it was South Africa's bowling that left much to be desired at the Gabba. Perhaps they expected the pitch, by reputation a seamer but in reality a true surface, to do the work for them. Whatever the case, that they allowed 487 runs to pass between bowlers' wickets - Cowan's run-out was the only breakthrough on the fourth day - was a massive problem. Vernon Philander lacked impact, Dale Steyn showed only glimpses of his best and Morne Morkel needs to curb his habit of over-stepping on crucial deliveries. Not that any of these issues concerned the coach Gary Kirsten enough to encourage him to spend every day working with the squad between Tests; instead he flew home for a whistle-stop trip to see his wife and children.

At Adelaide Oval, the teams will again be greeted by a good batting surface. Life won't be easy for the fast men early on but the pitch will wear and provide some uneven bounce and help for the spinners later on. During the 1980s the venue had the reputation of being a ground where draws were almost inevitable but that is no longer a fair assessment, and only three of the past 20 Adelaide Tests have failed to find a winner. If that trend continues this year, whichever team comes out on top cannot lose the series. And if it's South Africa, the No.1 ranking will be out of Australia's reach.

Form guide
(Most recent first)
Australia DWDWW
South Africa DWDWD
In the spotlight
South Africa's batsmen tried to belt Nathan Lyon out of the attack at the Gabba but he kept his nerve, continued to flight the ball and picked up two wickets in each innings, as well as having a skied catch put down off his bowling. A 25-over spell on the third day helped Lyon get back into his rhythm after some undemanding Sheffield Shield work in the lead-up, and at his home venue of Adelaide Oval, where he took five wickets against India last summer, he will be a key man as the pitch deteriorates. With Shane Watson unable to bowl even if he does play, Lyon will again be asked to bowl some long spells to give the fast men some rest.

Vernon Philander had so much success in his first ten Test matches that it was a major surprise that he went wicketless at the Gabba, having also failed to claim a victim the tour match in Sydney. At times in Brisbane the Australians found it a little too easy to leave Philander's deliveries alone and on a pitch like Adelaide, which won't offer the bowlers much apart from perhaps some variable bounce as the game wears on, he will need to make the batsmen play more often.

Team news
Australia are unchanged from Brisbane, with Shane Watson's bid to play as a batsman ending predictably on match eve. Ben Hilfenhaus retains his spot ahead of Mitchell Starc, and Rob Quiney has another Test to prove himself at No. 3.

Australia 1 Ed Cowan, 2 David Warner, 3 Rob Quiney, 4 Ricky Ponting, 5 Michael Clarke (capt), 6 Michael Hussey, 7 Matthew Wade (wk), 8 Peter Siddle, 9 James Pattinson, 10 Ben Hilfenhaus, 11 Nathan Lyon.

JP Duminy's injury meant South Africa had to make at least one change from the Gabba side and it has been confirmed that Faf du Plessis will make his debut in Adelaide. Imran Tahir has also been named and will replace Rory Kleinveldt in the starting XI.

South Africa 1 Graeme Smith (capt), 2 Alviro Petersen, 3 Hashim Amla, 4 Jacques Kallis, 5 AB de Villiers (wk), 6 Jacques Rudolph, 7 Faf du Plessis, 8 Vernon Philander, 9 Morne Morkel, 10 Dale Steyn, 11 Imran Tahir.

Pitch and conditions
Like the Gabba, the Adelaide Oval surface should provide plenty of runs early in the match, but it is also likely to deteriorate as the game wears on, which will bring the spinners into play. The forecast for the duration of the match is hot and sunny.

Stats and trivia
The Gabba match was the first draw between these two sides in 14 Tests, the previous one having come at the WACA in December 2005. The teams haven't drawn two consecutive Tests since 1921
Michael Hussey is in line to play his 75th consecutive Test since his debut in November 2005, but AB de Villiers is in the midst of an even better run and should step out for his 79th consecutive Test since his debut in 2004
The only member of South Africa's side who has played Test cricket at Adelaide Oval is Jacques Kallis, who in two matches there has scored 15, 15, 5 and 65 not out
Ricky Ponting has scored more runs at Adelaide Oval than any other Test venue, 1723 at an average of 63.81
Quotes
"I think the players can take confidence from the way we performed and improved in that Test match, but it doesn't guarantee much. Like words, it doesn't really matter what you say it's what you do and we need to have that attitude and make sure come tomorrow we're 100% ready for that first delivery whether we're batting or bowling."
Michael Clarke

"The changeroom attendant said the one thing you can expect is the same Adelaide wicket. It will probably get drier as the game goes on. It's got a good grass covering. The field is looking really good. The square is probably the greenest I have seen it in a long time."
Graeme Smith
Sauce
 

Hallatia

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26,433
Du Plessis ready to take his chance
The injury to JP Duminy has given Faf du Plessis his shot at Test cricket, and he has prepared well for this opportunity
Firdose Moonda in Adelaide
November 21, 2012

Faf du Plessis knew he would make his Test debut in Adelaide almost two weeks ago. The moment he saw JP Duminy being carried into the dressing room at the Gabba, with agony splashed across his face and rumours of a ruptured Achilles' starting to sprout, du Plessis knew.

In those moments, nobody actually told du Plessis that he was going to play the second Test, but he was next in line and Duminy's replacement, Dean Elgar, would join the squad at the end of the queue. Picking either Robin Peterson or Thami Tsolekile would change the balance of the XI, so du Plessis knew.

"I knew I am the replacement batter if something goes wrong with one of the guys playing, I would be next in line," Du Plessis had said. "I felt so bad because I am really close with JP. The feeling was there that I am going to play in the next Test but it wasn't a nice feeling, it was a bad feeling."

Almost two weeks have passed, Duminy's operation was declared a success, and du Plessis has no need to feel apologetic. He isn't the only player whose chance has come at someone's expense. He knows that irrespective of how the door opened, he should walk through it.

Du Plessis has spent the last six months preparing for this. His growth in the longer format was best explained by Matthew Maynard, his coach at Titans. When Maynard mooted the idea of Du Plessis playing higher up the order, at No. 5, he was keen to give it a try. In four matches last season, Du Plessis scored 599 runs with three hundreds and spent more time at the crease than he had ever done before.

His actions highlight his commitment to first-class cricket. While Du Plessis was at the IPL this year, Somerset requested his involvement in their Twenty20 campaign. Du Plessis agreed. However, CSA asked him to withdraw from the Friends Life t20 to captain South Africa A in two unofficial Tests against Sri Lanka A, and in a triangular series in Zimbabwe. It meant foregoing a lucrative deal, believed to be worth about US$50,000, but Du Plessis had no qualms doing so.

He said playing for South Africa A would help further his Test ambitions. In that series, he scored a hundred in the first match, which South Africa A won by an innings. Elgar was the other centurion. Du Plessis would have also toured Ireland with South Africa A in August but he was called up to the senior squad as back up for Albie Morkel, who had injured his ankle in England.

That was the first sign that Du Plessis would be the next middle-order batsman for South Africa. He got his first taste of Test cricket when he fielded in place of Alviro Petersen at Headingley and immediately felt the difference from a limited-overs environment. "It was a really intense, serious vibe. You can see the guys are really geared up," he had said. "I'm part of the one-day side and that's all about energy but here, you can see it's proper cricket."

Du Plessis has enough experience for his selection to be a natural step and his captain Graeme Smith spoke with pride about the newest debutant. "It's a wonderful opportunity for Faf. He has had really high standard the last few years. He has been around this group since England and he has been part of some special times, so he is looking forward to making a mark on this team."

Du Plessis' part-time legspin could also be useful on the Adelaide pitch but Smith said South Africa would not rely on him heavily. "He is in the same mould as JP in that he can play a role with the ball," Smith said. "But with us picking Imran [Tahir], he will front up for majority of that spin option, although having Faf does allow you someone else in the group that can contribute."

In 26 ODIs and four Twenty20s, Du Plessis is yet to have a defining moment in international cricket. November 22 at Adelaide Oval could be it, and he seems to know that.
Sauce
 

TheParraboy

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69,422
how good is it to have test cricket around the globe for a few weeks on end, cant wait for adelaide to start, working tomorrow but have Friday off :D
 
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