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Do you want Brad Arthur as coach

Do you want Brad Arthur as coach

  • Yes

    Votes: 101 51.5%
  • No

    Votes: 95 48.5%

  • Total voters
    196

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
How did the Cowboys go downhill? They’re coming second on the ladder.
Because before that they won fewer games under Hannay than under Green in 2020 and the following year they were 15th. They might be coming second now but they made two grand finals under Green, winning one.
The Bulldogs went downhill because they made poor decisions.
I reckon they just stopped spending money.
They also made two grand finals while Hasler was there. Something Brad Arthur has currently failed to do.
Over the long term they are a bigger club than we are. Perhaps they will be able to secure the funding to be bigger than us again. The fact they got Gould onboard leads me to think it's possible. He doesn't go to clubs to balance the books ffs. He wants to spend money and win premierships. He doesn't care where it comes from.
There are no guarantees sacking the coach is going to make a team better but it beats remaining at the status quo.
I think our status quo is very good for a club our size. We could be doing worse. In fact we have done worse, missing the finals for six straight years under four different coaches. In the seven years prior to McElduff becoming Chairman we won three spoons under three different coaches.
Also 7 years between competitions isn’t that long. A lot of teams that kill for that.
It was 11 years for the Roosters, and for big clubs it's too long. The Broncos got rid of Wayne f**king Bennett because they hadn't won for 13 years. Now it's been 17 years.
So the Roosters have higher standards than us. Maybe we should raise our standards as well then?
There's no point having expectations that don't match your abilities. We should have the Roosters' standards when we have as much cash to throw around as they do. Otherwise we're like the scrawny, broke merkin who can't get a girlfriend because his standards are too high.
 

Chipmunk

Coach
Messages
14,350
Blokes who are happy to be assistants at the Roosters and Storm won't come to Parra for anything less than the head coaching job. Do you reckon we could prise Ciraldo away from the Panthers to be our defence coach? Not on your f**king life.
The point was about the rotation of assistant coaches, and the players getting new concepts from new people. This isn't happening at Parra, it needs to start if the Head Coach wants stay long term.
 

Gary Gutful

Immortal
Messages
48,307
Oh, absolutely. We’re a shit club, with shit standards and a history of failure. The point being, though, that the current coaching set-up entirely aligns with that history, rather than breaking it.
It actually fares well when you look back over the previous coaches since 1986. Sad as f**k and unforgivable, but undeniably true. When you have 9 coaches over 36 years who have failed it would be worth setting expectations accordingly when the 10th one arrives.

That said, its worth a change...
 

Chipmunk

Coach
Messages
14,350
It actually fares well when you look back over the previous coaches since 1986. Sad as f**k and unforgivable, but undeniably true. When you have 9 coaches over 36 years who have failed it would be worth setting expectations accordingly when the 10th one arrives.

That said, its worth a change...
I think some of those coaches have some excuses for not having success.

The Club completely lost its way for a decade before Super League came along and we were able to assemble a strong roster in an off season.

The ensuing Brian Smith era the club was one of the strong clubs of the era.

Brian was alway going to have a use-by-date from the moment he arrived and when that point came, we probably should've handled the replacement better. In hindsight I think that Jason Taylor would have been a very good coach with a high calibre group, which is what we had a time.

For whatever reason, Hagan didn't work out and in hindsight, and a sliding doors moment, I think if his appointment hadnt occurred and Jason Taylor was here then maybe things could've gone differently.

The next period of almost a decade was all about off field politics that destroyed any chance of success. The Dogs had similar issues a decade later and seen similar performance issues on the field. With Gus there now they will probably get out the other side.

I think if we'd won either 2001 or 2005, Brian Smith likely heads into a General Manager of Football role, the fans are content and don't kick out the board. Hell, Fitzy is probably still the CEO and we go on to be a super power.
 
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Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
How very convenient to exclude the spoon.
Well it was a massive failure on the team's part but also an extreme outlier. I just don't think it's especially relevant when judging the coach. Ricky Stuart also won a spoon at our club and he's a premiership winner elsewhere.
I’m sorry, but the 2018 squad was his. You can’t exclude that.
It's not like he got to hand pick from every qualified player like a rep team. It was the squad we could afford after the salary cap sanctions had fully hit. Even now we only have the squad we could afford, as we will again next year. It's hard to continually improve the squad when you need to reimburse your mercenaries entirely under the cap.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
Yeah but if I put $200 into the Football club is that in addition to what the leagues club puts in or does the leagues club put $200 less in (as a stated goal of financial independence from Leagues club would suggest).
If it is the former then I feel I am making the football club richer and making a difference to something I support, if it is the later it makes me feel sick in the stomach because I hate leagues clubs.
I suspect it's the latter.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
Oh, absolutely. We’re a shit club, with shit standards and a history of failure. The point being, though, that the current coaching set-up entirely aligns with that history, rather than breaking it.
Sure, but you don't get thinner by wearing a tighter dress. Sacking the coach without fixing the underlying problem is putting the cart before the horse.

I hope we're big enough to get a Bellamy or a Robinson one day but I honestly don't think they would be getting premierships or regular top four finishes here the way they do at their current clubs. Part of me suspects the results mightn't be any different than what we've had since the end of 2018. Look at Maguire's results after Souths, or Stuart's results after Easts. Even Hasler since coming back to Manly after Penn took control.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
You were commenting that changing the coach won't change anything... the impliation being that who is coach is irrelevent, and therefore we may as well stick with the incumbent in perpetuity.

I'm glad you've agreed how silly the logic behind your comment was. My comment did not indicate that there are only two options, however (as others have noted) it is a little misguided to argue changing a coach will change nothing about the team's and players' perfromances.
Except I never said we should stick with him in perpetuity. That's your stupid, dishonest strawman. I assume we're looking at other options (and I'm supportive) for after Arthur's contract expires but I suspect our results won't be any better, whomever we get. To improve results we need to spend more money, not shuffle deck chairs.
 
Messages
2,371
I suspect our results won't be any better, whomever we get. To improve results we need to spend more money, not shuffle deck chairs.
...Or simply get someone who is better (or better value) for the money we spend.

Which is what people are on about when they say the coach has passed his use by date after 9 seasons and not being able to consistently get the squad to demonstrate motivation and perform near their best week in week out.

Sometimes "shuffling deckchairs" instead of complaining about the clouds will give you the chance to get a better tan.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
What a load of tosh... this is exactly the same situation and impact that each and every club has to manage every season.
Well my point is different clubs are better equipped to ‘manage’ this problem better than others, and this is evidenced by their differing average results over the long term. How well equipped the various clubs are is what I refer to when I discuss resources rather than just money. But make no mistake, even non-monetary resources (e.g. club hangers-on offering investment or employment opportunities to relatives of players) boil down to money.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
75,391
...Or simply get someone who is better (or better value) for the money we spend.

Which is what people are on about when they say the coach has passed his use by date after 9 seasons and not being able to consistently get the squad to demonstrate motivation and perform near their best week in week out.

Sometimes "shuffling deckchairs" instead of complaining about the clouds will give you the chance to get a better tan.
What’s the suntan represent in your analogy?
 

Frank Burge

Juniors
Messages
80
Because before that they won fewer games under Hannay than under Green in 2020 and the following year they were 15th. They might be coming second now but they made two grand finals under Green, winning one.

I reckon they just stopped spending money.

Over the long term they are a bigger club than we are. Perhaps they will be able to secure the funding to be bigger than us again. The fact they got Gould onboard leads me to think it's possible. He doesn't go to clubs to balance the books ffs. He wants to spend money and win premierships. He doesn't care where it comes from.

I think our status quo is very good for a club our size. We could be doing worse. In fact we have done worse, missing the finals for six straight years under four different coaches. In the seven years prior to McElduff becoming Chairman we won three spoons under three different coaches.

It was 11 years for the Roosters, and for big clubs it's too long. The Broncos got rid of Wayne f**king Bennett because they hadn't won for 13 years. Now it's been 17 years.
There's no point having expectations that don't match your abilities. We should have the Roosters' standards when we have as much cash to throw around as they do. Otherwise we're like the scrawny, broke merkin who can't get a girlfriend because his standards are too high.
Could you please list the clubs in order of size in your opinion, I would love to know where we stand and will temper my expectations when I see we are below Wentworthville and St Mary’s leagues clubs
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
67,350
Is 36 years of no premiership, 9 of which presided over the current coach, enough of a long term trend?
I have made my thoughts clear on BA and how his inability to close the gap between our best and worst is a massive fail. However I do think it’s important to acknowledge some facts about BA viz “9 years” and how he took on a basket case club, copped the blows of the cap scandal and dragged us kicking and screaming into a team that always makes the semis.

Give him a gold watch and send him on his way IF we can land the right replacement.
 

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