jersey flegg v's sharks

[mr x]

Have Been Waiting For Roopy's Report On The Game-have Not Seen Many This Year But Could Not Believe Yesterdays Game. After Half Time When They Were Getting Beaten So Easily Was Waiting For The Coaching Staff To Maybe Make Some Positional Changes Or Try Something Different However They Continued To Play The Same One Out Stuff-don't Think The Ball Went More Than 2 Passes Wide The Whole Game. Have Heard A Lot About Walsh & Dureau But They Were Completely Outclassed By The Opposition & Wondered Why They Defend Either On The Wing Or One Inside The Winger Were They Playing Hurt? Or Is Their Defence Suss! Because It Seems The Sharks Coach Did His Homework As Their Halves Continually Just Threw 2 Wide Balls Attacking The Fringes Where They Were Defending. Penrith Maybe Able To Try To Hide Preston Campbell In Defence But You Cannot Do This With 2 Players Leaving 11 To Defend. Hope The Coaching Staff Take Responsibily For The Loss As They Did Not Seem To Have Any Organisation.do All 3 Grades Base All The Play Around The 7 I Hope Not As We All Know What Happens When Andrew Johns Doesn't Play Or Have They Won On The Back Of Individual Play. Was Really Disappointed As Based On Roopy's Reports Thought We Had Some Great Talent Coming Thru.

 

[Jobdog]

We have got some really good youngsters coming through our ranks, but as a team,Flegg and Premier League just didnt turn up to play. Its quite simple, if u dont turn up to play in any grade, u will get beaten by 30 plus. I'm happy to just say it was one of those games, and look forward to next week.

 

[Swampy]

Have to agree with mr x .The Flegg boys were completeley outclassed.Oh yeah the Flegg boys for the Knights turned up to play but so did the Cronulla boys.The Cronulla side they played tonight is a completeley different side from the side they played and beat when the boys played them at home.IMO the Cronulla boys had a point to prove and simply they proved it. I've been watching some of the Flegg boys this season that have come up thru the Knights junior system and have been alarmed at the drop in there skill levels and confidence in there own abilities once they have come under the influence of the Flegg coaching staff.Its not until the boys play a classy outfit such as Cronulla that the deficiencies of some players and the coaching staff are exposed.As mr x pointed out you cannot hide two players in defence as any smart coach will expose those shortcomings as what happened in last nights game.Any side that is as skilled,as fast,well drilled and play as a team such as Cronulla will always give the Flegg boys a touch up.Until the coaching staff incorporate and place emphisis on skills,speed and the need for teamwork then this side is going no where.There is talent in this side but it isn't being nurtured and some individual players are not being given the opportunity to display there full potential.The sides obvious lack of professional coaching and training is glaring against the better quality sides they encounter.I'm left wondering if some of the boys where given the same focus and energies the club has put into Mullen would the club have more boys at the same level or standard.

 

[roopy]

Walsh doesn't usually hide in defence - but he did in the Roosters game after being hurt early - so he may still be carrying an injury from that game.
Dureau has had a dodgy shoulder since early last season. He can defend alright, but he avoids it if he can because he reinjures his shoulder pretty easily.

I didn't see the game, but I remember last season Cronulla put the cleaners through our Flegg side by basically doing surrender tackles and very quick play the balls, which is easier to do at Flegg level because the refs are very harsh on holding players down. The Cronulla sides seem very good at this tactic, while the Knights seem very bad at defending against it, because the Knights train for gang tackles and holding players down the time allowed in the seniors (which is why we have been so much down on the penalty counts this season).
I don't think the Cronulla surrender tackle tactic will serve the kids well in the long term.

 

[Jobdog]

Oh yeah the Flegg boys for the Knights turned up to play but so did the Cronulla boys.

With all due respect Swampy, we were never really in the game, which tells me that we just did not turn up mentally and paid the price for it. The scoreline indicates that. Watching it live, we were missing countless amounts of tackles that they were making a fortnight ago. Don't forget we had the bye last week, so it is understandable if they were a little flat, which IMO they were.

 

[mr x]

roopy i don't think you get my point-the play the balls were not the issue the sharks side were a class above our flegg side as swampy points out eg skill level & the fact that they play good football involving the whole team. the knights only attack seemed to involve the fullback - the centres do not even touch the ball. In regard to your comments about walsh & durea if they aren't fit they should not be on the field & it shows lack of respect for the other players in the squad.

 

[roopy]

The interesting thing is that we beat them earlier in the season - but that was the game we had a 12-0 penalty count against us by halftime and the count was nearly as bad in the second half - but we just smashed them with strong defence all game.

Their game is basically to surrender as soon as a hand is put on them, and play the ball as quickly as possible, so the other side is always on the back foot.
Our game is to defend strongly and hold players down as long as possible. I suspect we tried to keep the penalty count down this game - which means we didn't get the chance to smash them out of the game.

 

[mr x]

cannot understand your preoccupation with defence-you can't win football games when you do not have any attack which is what i am referring to & the sharks were as swampt points out a well drilled & skilful side who knew how to attack. if the knights are to make the semis then the coaching staff if what swampy says is true need to have a good look at themselves & the reason they are there-as in all sports some people get carried away with their own self importance. if supporters can see the problems why can't the coaching staff of this side or the heirachy. seems a shame that talent may be lost beacuse these boys are not being coached!!!!!!

 

[Jobdog]

Yesterday, yes we struggled to post points, but I said it before and I'll say it again, we had the bye last week, so that, for me, explains why we were sluggish. Premier League, well I hav no answers for them.

 

[macavity]

mrX what is with that capital letters bizzo? your post made my head hurt.

oh and swampy, both you and X need to learn about paragraphs. Please, we beg you. Makes your posts much much easier to read, especially to us dyslexics.

 

[roopy]

The Flegg side is coached by Rip Taylor - who has coached more premiership winning sides than you can point a stick at.
All his sides have one thing in common - strong forwards and bruising defence.
I think the 'skills' being coached in Flegg at the moment - bruising defence etc - will really be good for our young guys in the future.

 

[mr x]

again i don't agree you can't win games if you don't score points.
swampy seems to agree with me & seems to have knowledge that we supporters do not have & yet you still can't see a problem.
am going to parramatta next week & will make the effort to be there for jersey flegg parramatta are up the top of the ladder i believe. they will have to improve by 100% to change my mind.i don't believe they do not have talent there but after hearing from swampy it is not being encouraged which goes back to the coaching staff & this is a problem as most of you recognise when it comes to hagan.

 

[Jobdog]

Mr x, there is PLENTY of talent in our Jersey Flegg team champ. As I said before and I will say it for the thousandth time, we had the bye last week, so it makes sense that we were a bit flat the week after (this week). U look at first grade, just about every team which has the bye one week, hardly ever win the following week. We were not leading the Jersey Flegg competition earlier in the season for no reason.

 

[roopy]

I think the Flegg side has lost a fair amount of attacking ability with McManus going up to PL and Abel seemingly out of form (possibly not over his injury completely). I also think Terrence Seu Seu is obviously playing injured, and I have no idea why we are risking a good player in this way.
Having said that, Walsh and Dureau have completely dominated some sides this year with their attacking brilliance - and our forwards have dominated every pack except Easts IMO.
Unfortunately, refs at the Flegg level try very hard to keep strong forward play to a minimum by calling held very early and being very harsh on holding down. They also penalise any tackle that is even a hint of being high - sometimes they seem to penalise for just being too hard in the tackle.
This all means our side is copping big penalty counts against them - so they often have less than 40% of the ball in games to attack with.
I want our guys to continue to be the most physical side in Flegg, even if we lose games because of it, because the guys are getting ready to play against men in the near future, and learning to play soft football won't help them when they step up.

 

[Rex Banner]

I have been reading this topic and opions seem to vary widely. Hiding 2 players in defence is very hard to do, but you cannot get away with it against good sides or sides with smart coaches. It is true the attack of the Flegg side has dropped with McManus and Abel not being in the centres. McManus in PL I can understand but (from what I've been told) a 100% fit Abel on the bench last week and wing against Cronulla defies all logic. They pick a guy who is a hooker or backrower playing in the centres with the knights 6 or 7 hiding next to him against a team of Cronulla's skill level and there was ever only going to be one result. Then to make things worse when things were not working out NOTHING CHANGED.

Roopy!!!!! As for the style of defence the club is using and there is something to be gained from it in the long term, I can accept provided all coaching staff and trainers (I use that term very loosely) accept that losses will happen but it's the big picture the club is looking at. Or does the ego of those involved get the better of them.

As for specialised training for talented juniors(from what I've been told) the boys can only dream about that unless you have the rite connections.

 

[Swampy]

Have to agree with what mr x is trying emphisis.Rex Banner I fully concur with every thing you have said especially your last sentence.Why can't the club select an elite squad of juniors and give them the benifit of specialised training.
Jobdog great you watched the game live as I did you must have watching a different game to me.It was obvious the Cronulla were a far better drilled side in comparison to the Knights.They displayed greater ball skills,speed off the line in defence and the precision in execution of plays was far superior to the Knights boys.Also you seem to be fixated on the notion the boys had a bye and that is the reason for there loss.Come on.Cronulla could have the bye this week then play the boys and I'm sure the result would be the same.As for leading the comp earlier in the season just go back and have a look at who they played in the early rounds.
Roopy who said the Flegg boys were the most physical in the comp?As for this smash them mentality that went out with the dinosaurs and I'm afraid Rip Taylor is one as far as his coaching philosophies go.He needs to get in touch with the modern aspects of the game.As I've said any side that displays superior skills against the boys they seem unable to respond to the challenge.This is no fault of the boys as they are not receiving the coaching that is required to be on equal terms.So Roopy you'd rather we smashed them but still got beat by 50.You'd have bunch of punch drunk kids.
Hopefully from what I've learnt tonight things may be on the improve for next season.The boys deserve it.
Macavity what are paragraphs and dyslexics?

 

[Jobdog]

Also you seem to be fixated on the notion the boys had a bye and that is the reason for there loss.Come on.Cronulla could have the bye this week then play the boys and I'm sure the result would be the same.As for leading the comp earlier in the season just go back and have a look at who they played in the early rounds.

Well, you will NEVER know if the result would change if the Sharks had the bye now, will u? As a matter of fact, we BEAT them earlier in the season when we played them up here, the score in that match was 12-8, which tells me that we can match it with any team in the comp if we turn up mentally. We didn't do that on Saturday night and ultimately paid the price. We led the comp earlier in the season and won our first 7 games straight and came in a little complacent and lost to the Magpies, who are now running seventh. I'm telling u that the bye is a necessary evil and once again, u look at any clubs record coming off the bye, I assure u it wont be promising reading.

 

[Swampy]

Head in the sand stuff and simplistic Jobdog when the obvious is staring you in the face.The boys even by there own admission were outplayed in every aspect of the game on the night.Sorry to disappoint you they didn't win there first 7 games. Wests beat them in Rd 5 at home.The Cronulla side they played at the weekend was far different side to the one they beat.You seem to miss the point the boys could be a lot better if they were coached and trained in a more professional and each individual players skills utilised in a combined team effort.It may pain you but there are better drilled sides out there and I'll repeat it again if the boys received the correct coaching and training they then would more then match it with the better quality teams.

 

[Jobdog]

It looks to me like we are going to have to agree to disagree. I never at any stage said they weren't outplayed in every aspect of the game on Saturday night, the scoreline says it all. However I did say that the bye last weekend certainly would not have helped matters.

 

[roopy]

I have had a bit of a think about Abel on the wing, and I think it may be a good idea.

He is never going to make firstgrade as a 5/8 at the Knights. That position belongs to Mullo or Kidley for the next 10 years.

He is a bit of a chance as a centre, but the position we really suck at right now is the wing.

The thing Abel has in his favour is that he really can find his way to the line. This year he has scored several tries where he got the ball out wide with plenty of work to do and found his way to the corner - real wingers tries.

He is tall, fast and athletic and goes for the line like a madman when he gets a sniff.

A lot of people will say he has the skills to do better than wing, but what we need is a quality winger, and I think he has the makings. A great off season could see him a bolter for firstgrade as early as next year.