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OT: The Bush Fires + Royal Commission

Messages
42,876
I always thought it was because embers can settle in the gutter and get in under the tiles or eaves tbh.

Like, landing on the roof tiles an ember is unlikely to to much damage but in a gutter it can get in the roof space a bit more?
I did exactly that when my Dad’s house was under ember attack abt 5 years ago at Umina Beach. I think the theory is that tiles don’t burn however if embers get into the gutters it can ignite loose leaves and quickly get into the roof via whatever the timber is called that the gutter attaches to.

View attachment 35278
Yeah cheers. I get the theory I think but it seems like taking a toy light sabre to a gun fight. Especially if the rest of the house is surrounded by a timber veranda. And the gutters are old so to have any chance of filling them you've gotta replace pretty much all of it.
 

Suitman

Post Whore
Messages
55,040
Two maps showing where the NSW fire fronts are heading.





Just came here to post those maps. Thanks. Tomorrow is actually looking dangerous in many areas, just not so much in areas that affect Sydney and larger population areas.
Look at KNP. An enormous amount could be lost. One ski resort is already gone. Another today was preparing for the worst.
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
74,075
BUSHFIRES
Firefighter compensation government sham
Jan 08 2020Updated 22 hours ago

Wendy Creighton

Only a very few volunteer firefighters or SES members are likely to be eligible for the compensation package promised by the Prime Minister Scott Morrison and the Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk.

The promise was that if the volunteer spent 10 days or more on the fire line or in direct support of those on the fire line, then they could be eligible for up to $300 per day, capped at $6,000.

The details of the compensation package were revealed yesterday and on investigation the Fassifern Guardian has found that the reality falls far short of the expectations raised by the promises.

  • The expectation was that the volunteer could claim for the first 10 days on the fire line and any days thereafter.
WRONG.

The first 10 days makes the volunteer eligible, but those first 10 days cannot be claimed, only day 11 onwards can be claimed.

  • The expectation was that the volunteer could claim $300 per day.
WRONG.

The volunteer can only claim their normal working day wage, after tax.

  • The expectation was that the volunteer could claim for the day they spent on the fire line.
WRONG.

If the volunteer’s normal working day was 8.00am to 5.00pm and they spent from 6.00pm to 10.00am fighting fires or directly supporting those fighting fires and then turned up for work, then they can only claim the two hours out of their normal working day - 8.00am to 10.00am.

If the volunteer did a deal with their boss and worked out of hours to make up for the time they were away from work, then they cannot claim compensation.

If the volunteer was retired and does not have a ‘working day’ then they too are not eligible to claim compensation.

In announcement on the Liberal party website it was posted: "The Prime Minister says this will include farmers, small business owners, tradies and contract workers in rural and regional areas who have been hit especially hard by this fire season."

But if the volunteer is a primary producer and cannot prove that they lost income by being away from their property to fight the fires, then they too are not eligible to claim compensation. The Fassifern is experiencing the worst drought on record, many are not planting crops due to lack of water; many have had to sell the majority or all of their herd due to lack of feed and water and many simply do not have an income - and so they too will not be eligible to claim compensation.

  • The expectation was that the compensation would be a fair and equitable process and that all volunteers could claim for the 10 days or more they spent on the fire line.
WRONG.

If the volunteer was a part time or casual worker and fought the fires on days they would not normally be working, then they cannot claim for those days.

If the volunteer undertook a full working day and then spent much of the night on the fire line before turning up to work the next day, they cannot claim for any of those hours on the fireline.

If the volunteer did not fight on the fire line and undertook, for example, the role of getting out of bed as soon as one or more of the trucks returned to the fire shed to undertake maintenance - check the engines, clean the filters, top up the fuel tanks and the water tanks so the firies could take a break before returning to the fire line and the support worker did this before turning up to their normal place of work - they are not eligible to claim compensation.

Article: ‘Bloody biased’: Farmers fume over firie compensation

OPINION:

The Fassifern Guardian contends that there is a huge difference between the expectations raised by the promises made by the Prime Minister and the Premier and the reality.

The promises were made long before the details of the eligibility criteria were revealed and won front page headlines.

Perhaps those who designed the eligibility criteria should have first spent a 12 to 18 hour day on the fire line - as many of our firefighters did on the 74 days of fire in the Fassifern - then perhaps they would not equate a normal working day with the horror, the sweat, the heat, the physical and mental hardship and the danger of fighting or mopping up after a wildfire.

x1wzb6gtgwpexeludbpr

Photo: Drew Creighton

The promise
Eligibility criteria: 10 days or more volunteering as a Rural Fire Brigade member fighting fire

Compensation: $300 per day up to a maximum of $6,000

The reality in Queensland
Eligibility criteria:

• Volunteer becomes eligible to claim for days on the fire line after fighting fires for 10 days - cannot claim for first 10 days, can only claim for days after the first 10

• Can only claim for those hours fighting the fires within normal working hours e.g. if a firefighter fought fire for 18 hours on one day and only 4 of the 18 hours were within the volunteer’s normal working day, then can only claim for those 4 hours

• If a firefighter made up the hours away from work by working at night or on the weekend, or received payment from their employer, then cannot claim those hours

• Must prove loss of income

Compensation:

• Volunteer can only claim a daily rate commensurate with their normal daily wage, after tax, up to a maximum of $300

• If a volunteer works part time and they fought a fire on days that they do not normally work, then they cannot claim for those days

• If a volunteer is retired, then they cannot claim any days

• If a volunteer is a primary producer then they must be able to prove that if they had stayed home on the days they fought the fire, they would have made money

https://www.fassifernguardian.com/bushfires/firefighter-compensation-government-sham
 

TheParraboy

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
66,244
Nothing gets the click bait counter going than a headline (and leaving out some minor details lol)

There have been arrests, how much we won't know just yet....



Can’t you just hear the keyboards across the country typing the words FAKE NEWS right now ?


from the article....

In a statement to 10 daily, Victoria Police said the reported figures are not accurate -- they were for the 12 months to September 2019 -- and have little link to the recent fire emergency which escalated in December.

Statistics for the period from September to December 2019 won't be released until March

 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
99,893
Yeah cheers. I get the theory I think but it seems like taking a toy light sabre to a gun fight. Especially if the rest of the house is surrounded by a timber veranda. And the gutters are old so to have any chance of filling them you've gotta replace pretty much all of it.

Yeah not sure how effective it is, but I guess any improvement in the chance of a house surviving is decent at worst.

I think they suggest putting strips of tarp or something like that down in the case of leaky gutters. Mine are the same, if I did manage to fill them they'd probably drop straight off the f**ken house
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
99,893
Nothing gets the click bait counter going than a headline (and leaving out some minor details lol)

There have been arrests, how much we won't know just yet....





from the article....

In a statement to 10 daily, Victoria Police said the reported figures are not accurate -- they were for the 12 months to September 2019 -- and have little link to the recent fire emergency which escalated in December.

Statistics for the period from September to December 2019 won't be released until March

There was an article saying 24 arrests that I read somewhere.

Out of 6000 odd fires.

Even if we say that only 1/10 get caught, that amounts to what, 4%?

The arsonist rage is pure, unadulterated deflection by sources with heavy denier interests
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
74,075
The Truth About the Australian Bushfires

Executive summary: climate change denier merkin who lives in another country posts baseless propaganda piece. I think the whole arson thing has been dealt with sufficiently with multiple law enforcement and government organisations confirming that criminal acts of arson are minimal.

As the mythbusters would say ...

00275197-961885_1200-e1333472909234.jpg
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,626
BUSHFIRES
Firefighter compensation government sham
Jan 08 2020Updated 22 hours ago

Wendy Creighton

Only a very few volunteer firefighters or SES members are likely to be eligible for the compensation package promised by the Prime Minister Scott Morrison and the Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk.

The promise was that if the volunteer spent 10 days or more on the fire line or in direct support of those on the fire line, then they could be eligible for up to $300 per day, capped at $6,000.

The details of the compensation package were revealed yesterday and on investigation the Fassifern Guardian has found that the reality falls far short of the expectations raised by the promises.

  • The expectation was that the volunteer could claim for the first 10 days on the fire line and any days thereafter.
WRONG.

The first 10 days makes the volunteer eligible, but those first 10 days cannot be claimed, only day 11 onwards can be claimed.

  • The expectation was that the volunteer could claim $300 per day.
WRONG.

The volunteer can only claim their normal working day wage, after tax.

  • The expectation was that the volunteer could claim for the day they spent on the fire line.
WRONG.

If the volunteer’s normal working day was 8.00am to 5.00pm and they spent from 6.00pm to 10.00am fighting fires or directly supporting those fighting fires and then turned up for work, then they can only claim the two hours out of their normal working day - 8.00am to 10.00am.

If the volunteer did a deal with their boss and worked out of hours to make up for the time they were away from work, then they cannot claim compensation.

If the volunteer was retired and does not have a ‘working day’ then they too are not eligible to claim compensation.

In announcement on the Liberal party website it was posted: "The Prime Minister says this will include farmers, small business owners, tradies and contract workers in rural and regional areas who have been hit especially hard by this fire season."

But if the volunteer is a primary producer and cannot prove that they lost income by being away from their property to fight the fires, then they too are not eligible to claim compensation. The Fassifern is experiencing the worst drought on record, many are not planting crops due to lack of water; many have had to sell the majority or all of their herd due to lack of feed and water and many simply do not have an income - and so they too will not be eligible to claim compensation.

  • The expectation was that the compensation would be a fair and equitable process and that all volunteers could claim for the 10 days or more they spent on the fire line.
WRONG.

If the volunteer was a part time or casual worker and fought the fires on days they would not normally be working, then they cannot claim for those days.

If the volunteer undertook a full working day and then spent much of the night on the fire line before turning up to work the next day, they cannot claim for any of those hours on the fireline.

If the volunteer did not fight on the fire line and undertook, for example, the role of getting out of bed as soon as one or more of the trucks returned to the fire shed to undertake maintenance - check the engines, clean the filters, top up the fuel tanks and the water tanks so the firies could take a break before returning to the fire line and the support worker did this before turning up to their normal place of work - they are not eligible to claim compensation.

Article: ‘Bloody biased’: Farmers fume over firie compensation

OPINION:

The Fassifern Guardian contends that there is a huge difference between the expectations raised by the promises made by the Prime Minister and the Premier and the reality.

The promises were made long before the details of the eligibility criteria were revealed and won front page headlines.

Perhaps those who designed the eligibility criteria should have first spent a 12 to 18 hour day on the fire line - as many of our firefighters did on the 74 days of fire in the Fassifern - then perhaps they would not equate a normal working day with the horror, the sweat, the heat, the physical and mental hardship and the danger of fighting or mopping up after a wildfire.

x1wzb6gtgwpexeludbpr

Photo: Drew Creighton

The promise
Eligibility criteria: 10 days or more volunteering as a Rural Fire Brigade member fighting fire

Compensation: $300 per day up to a maximum of $6,000

The reality in Queensland
Eligibility criteria:

• Volunteer becomes eligible to claim for days on the fire line after fighting fires for 10 days - cannot claim for first 10 days, can only claim for days after the first 10

• Can only claim for those hours fighting the fires within normal working hours e.g. if a firefighter fought fire for 18 hours on one day and only 4 of the 18 hours were within the volunteer’s normal working day, then can only claim for those 4 hours

• If a firefighter made up the hours away from work by working at night or on the weekend, or received payment from their employer, then cannot claim those hours

• Must prove loss of income

Compensation:

• Volunteer can only claim a daily rate commensurate with their normal daily wage, after tax, up to a maximum of $300

• If a volunteer works part time and they fought a fire on days that they do not normally work, then they cannot claim for those days

• If a volunteer is retired, then they cannot claim any days

• If a volunteer is a primary producer then they must be able to prove that if they had stayed home on the days they fought the fire, they would have made money

https://www.fassifernguardian.com/bushfires/firefighter-compensation-government-sham
Paid volunteers

The NSW RFS leader was on media adimantly stating that volunteer fire fight must remain voluntary

This article sounds like a mass of horse shit. Of course there were going to be rules. Just cos the media never had them doesnt mean the whole thing was some massive hoax

Is the fassifern guardian the new beetoota advocate?
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
99,893
I wonder if they realize its a replica as I believe he gave his original baggy green to Kerry Packer, which probably still had his original hair in it

It's not a replica. I'm not sure it's one he ever wore or not, but it's the real deal.

Not that it ever meant anything to Warnie anyway.
 

Twizzle

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
151,019
It's not a replica. I'm not sure it's one he ever wore or not, but it's the real deal.

Not that it ever meant anything to Warnie anyway.

its a genuine replica, if you know what I mean

I'm not suggesting its fake, its just not the original
 

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