Qld Cup and NSW Cup

[KalgoorlieRed]

I know this subject may have come up previously, but doesn't it make sense for an interstate-cum-national lower leagues comp if the Qld Cup and NSW were merged? I am positive it would raise the profile and attract a TV deal and like the National Leagues in the UK, could be a platform for future NRL clubs like the WA Reds etc..?

 

[Scott Gourley's Lovechild]

There are a few problems, such as promotion/relegation in the National Leagues and the fact that a number of clubs don't have much scratch to drive to Newcastle let alone to get to Burleigh. I do think it would be a good thing to do, but it just seems as if there are too many barriers in the way.

 

[Ram Man]

Add to the fact the NSWRL is completely useless and even NRL clubs are beginning to show how feed up they are that they are now sending their players to the QLD Cup instead of coming up with the $400K to start a NSW Cup side.

 

[hellteam]

No the QLD Cup is very good. Teams from all over QLD and still the traditional Brisbane clubs. Merging with the NSW Cup would change this and I don't think there'd be too many people in QLD happy with that.

 

[Brownie.Kougari]

They should try and establish a proper NSW Cup before they come forward with any plans like this.

 

[KalgoorlieRed]

Somebody ages ago in the games was saying how the two should merge.

 

[Lockyer4President!]

I've had my say in the thread about this in the QRL section but I was wondering what NSW people think would be the best setup for the NSW Cup. ie Would they prefer a Sydney centric comp with a couple of teams from places like Newcastle and Wollongong? Or maybe a true statewide comp with only half the comp made up of Sydney teams?

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

I've had my say in the thread about this in the QRL section but I was wondering what NSW people think would be the best setup for the NSW Cup. ie Would they prefer a Sydney centric comp with a couple of teams from places like Newcastle and Wollongong? Or maybe a true statewide comp with only half the comp made up of Sydney teams?

A few things would need to addressed before much is to change in NSW...

Back in 2003 when they created the Jim Beam Cup out of the old Metropolitan Cup it was intended to be the beginnings of a "genuine State-wide competition".

They invited the Central Coast sides to come in (Ourimbah, Woy Woy, The Entrance, and Erina did) but that was as far as it went.

This is probably because at the same time the NSW Cup started to also evolve into a competition containing "stand-alone" clubs and the Central Coast teams started to drop out...

Clubs like Ryde-Eastwood, St Mary's etc. abandoned JBC in favour of JVs with NRL clubs for the NSW Cup -- suddenly the original idea of the JBC becoming the State-wide competition wasn't so clear.

I think there's a place for both competitions - they provide different levels of competition for open age players - though I don't see either of them becoming "state-wide" until there's something more in it for the clubs - otherwise they'll just go back to their original CRL Groups or District competitions. There needs to be an incentive for these clubs to step up and invest. At the moment there is no reason for them to do so.

 

[Lockyer4President!]

A few things would need to addressed before much is to change in NSW...

Back in 2003 when they created the Jim Beam Cup out of the old Metropolitan Cup it was intended to be the beginnings of a "genuine State-wide competition".

They invited the Central Coast sides to come in (Ourimbah, Woy Woy, The Entrance, and Erina did) but that was as far as it went.

This is probably because at the same time the NSW Cup started to also evolve into a competition containing "stand-alone" clubs and the Central Coast teams started to drop out...

Clubs like Ryde-Eastwood, St Mary's etc. abandoned JBC in favour of JVs with NRL clubs for the NSW Cup -- suddenly the original idea of the JBC becoming the State-wide competition wasn't so clear.

I think there's a place for both competitions - they provide different levels of competition for open age players - though I don't see either of them becoming "state-wide" until there's something more in it for the clubs - otherwise they'll just go back to their original CRL Groups or District competitions. There needs to be an incentive for these clubs to step up and invest. At the moment there is no reason for them to do so.

What kind of incentive do you think is needed?

 

[Brownie.Kougari]

What kind of incentive do you think is needed?

Do what we say or country NSW league will die.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

The NSW Cup is sh*t. No history, no clear future, stupid joint ventures that change every year. Then there's the JBC which is even worse. It's all over the place and neither of them are even nearly representative of the whole state. Qld Cup clubs would be mad to want to join a comp with that basket case and there's no benefit to country clubs/teams to join either. The whole thing would be expensive and of no benefit. The money would be much better spent elsewhere.

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

The NSW Cup is sh*t. No history, no clear future, stupid joint ventures that change every year. Then there's the JBC which is even worse. It's all over the place and neither of them are even nearly representative of the whole state.

While I agree with you that neither competition is particularly stable and that they need a clear direction I would draw the line at statements like "The NSW Cup is sh*t. No history..." Not that it needs "history" to be a good competition but I would have thought the fact that it features three 100 year old clubs (and four if you could Balmain in it's "Balmain Ryde-Eastwood" form) with large and genuine followings would cover off on this aspect.

"Stupid joint ventures"? Why are they "stupid"? They're actually pretty smart ideas if you want our NRL clubs to concentrate on running and paying for NRL teams while Community-based (for want of a better word) clubs like Wentworthville concentrate on running and largely paying for development-level teams.

It's all about diversifying the participants who invest in developing Rugby league players and takes the pressure off NRL clubs to run lower-grade , open-age teams. This is actually good for our game and in the case of Wentworthville has been well-embraced by Eels fans.

Qld Cup clubs would be mad to want to join a comp with that basket case and there's no benefit to country clubs/teams to join either. The whole thing would be expensive and of no benefit. The money would be much better spent elsewhere.

As I said above in this thread there needs to be an incentive for clubs to provide this investment and with that will come stability... As far as I can see, if you created a national 2nd tier with a combined NSW and Qld Cup there could potentially be great benefits such as a competition that broadcasters will want to broadcast, sponsors want to sponsor and clubs want to invest in...

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

What kind of incentive do you think is needed?

Well, a competition that is properly televised (or at least gets some decent media coverage), with a reasonable geographic spread and therefore gives sponsors value for money would be a good start.

Other things I've heard people who run JBC clubs gripe about is the lack of decent prize-money.

 

[Ram Man]

Well, a competition that is properly televised (or at least gets some decent media coverage), with a reasonable geographic spread and therefore gives sponsors value for money would be a good start.

Other things I've heard people who run JBC clubs gripe about is the lack of decent prize-money.

To be totally honest, there is actually Zero prize money for winning the JBC.
So whatever money is spent during the year, there is no reward at the end of it.
Pretty $hit for a 2nd Tier Competition....:?

 

[Scott Gourley's Lovechild]

It's not as if Qld Cup sides are perminant fixtures either. Lots of clubs come and go from that competition just like from Reserve Grade and the Metro Cup.

Old Metro Cup (Windsor, Ryde-Eastwood, etc) and NSWRL (North Sydney, Newtown, etc) sides are taking up JV's with NRL clubs to form the NSW Cup, which I have no problem with. I think that the current JB Cup is moving in the right direction, introducing south coast and holding onto central coast sides. Probably shouldn't have introduced the useless Southern Sharks however. This competition needs to expand though, possibly to the Central West (Bathurst Panthers) and the North Coast (Foster, Coffs Harbour, etc)