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Rumoured & Confirmed Signings - Part 5

Girds89

Juniors
Messages
926
Staines is taller and heavier than Papenhuyzen. Why doesn’t this get mentioned? Pap would have similar defensive, and metre gain issues to Charlie if he was plonked out on the wing.

But Bellamy is much smarter than that, our coach….isn’t.

I am honestly not a huge fan of the outside back hit up strategy of Ivan. He overcooks it in my opinion. There are multiple sets that we have where our outside backs take the 1st 4 hit ups. They often end up being sub 30m sets. I don’t see any other club go to this extreme as much as we do. I don’t mind the 1st two, sometimes 3.

What is worst is that they are often predictable. You can tell before the ball is played who will get it. I am sure that the opposition often does as well and the poor player gets smashed.

I absolutely love Brian To’o but if we line him up to get smashed 20 times a game as a human pinball, we have to be prepared for him to have a dramatically shortened career. He is still very young with fast recovery and hasn’t accrued huge NRL mileage yet.

But as he gets older the mileage will take it’s toll on him, he will accrue more niggles and he will take longer to recover. ATM he reminds me of Aquila Uate who was an absolute killer for about 4 years but then became fairly ordinary as his physicality dropped off.

I really like To’o and don’t want to see this happen to him.

I agree on most of this except the idea of our back 5 making sub 30m sets.

Generally this year its our back 5 bringing it out of of own end that starts our roll on.

Most games our back 5 is only a few 100m off the others sides 17 men total meters gained.

I think we will need to mix it up this weekend because as parra have showed in their wins to melbs, throwing the ball wide and stretching them breaks them down. So whilst the back 5 taking one on stuff probably wont work this weekend, for the most part this year its helped us dominate teams and has been a major strength of ours.
 

The Realist

Juniors
Messages
1,079
Its Edwards price tag which makes me think he stays here.

I'd actually re-sign him. If someone gets ahead of him at fullback then there are plenty of clubs who would take him I reckon. He would be very easy to transfer.

Honestly asking....which club would want Edwards as a 1st choice fullback?

This article comes to mind. I swear it could have been written by me.

 

The Realist

Juniors
Messages
1,079
I agree on most of this except the idea of our back 5 making sub 30m sets.

Generally this year its our back 5 bringing it out of of own end that starts our roll on.

Most games our back 5 is only a few 100m off the others sides 17 men total meters gained.

I think we will need to mix it up this weekend because as parra have showed in their wins to melbs, throwing the ball wide and stretching them breaks them down. So whilst the back 5 taking one on stuff probably wont work this weekend, for the most part this year its helped us dominate teams and has been a major strength of ours.

It flat out barely works at all without Brian To'o (and in the past Mansour). When they are/were playing it generally works. The problem is, if we persist with it, we are going to have a Brian To'o who will miss more games due to injury and his (effective) career will be shortened.
 

Fangs

First Grade
Messages
5,544
Honestly asking....which club would want Edwards as a 1st choice fullback?

This article comes to mind. I swear it could have been written by me.


Broncos and Bulldogs come to mind.

After that you'll have a host of clubs who will move players around. Newcastle for instance moving Ponga to 6. Cowboys with a million dollar winger playing fullback. Dragons with some great young players like Sloan but a guy like Griffin would love Edwards filling in until he thinks he is ready to play regular first grade.
 

Kilkenny

First Grade
Messages
9,966
It flat out barely works at all without Brian To'o (and in the past Mansour). When they are/were playing it generally works. The problem is, if we persist with it, we are going to have a Brian To'o who will miss more games due to injury and his (effective) career will be shortened.
Our back three were instrumental in our success during the Hook era. No different to 2020-2021. The work of our back three take so much pressure off our forwards, we have done it better than almost all sides during this past two seasons. It is far easier for the forwards to get back to the 40 metre zone on tackle three than having to get back to your 20 metre zone. It’s quite simple really, even if you can’t quite understand it.
 

The Realist

Juniors
Messages
1,079
Our back three were instrumental in our success during the Hook era. No different to 2020-2021. The work of our back three take so much pressure off our forwards, we have done it better than almost all sides during this past two seasons. It is far easier for the forwards to get back to the 40 metre zone on tackle three than having to get back to your 20 metre zone. It’s quite simple really, even if you can’t quite understand it.

I understand it plenty well thank you. I think we over do it at times. The good teams are prepared for it and limit our sets like Parra did last week and the Bunnies the week before. Often it is super predictable as well. Wish we would at least try a decoy or 2 just to put the opposition defence in two minds.
 

Kilkenny

First Grade
Messages
9,966
I understand it plenty well thank you. I think we over do it at times. The good teams are prepared for it and limit our sets like Parra did last week and the Bunnies the week before. Often it is super predictable as well. Wish we would at least try a decoy or 2 just to put the opposition defence in two minds.
The game plan of all sides bringing the ball out from within your own 20 metre zone is to get as much go forward as possible in those first three tackles. Hit ups from a fullback and two wingers. We’ve been fortunate in so much as we have done it better than most, if not all sides since say 2016. It’s been a foundation which we have built on to be a successful team. It is predictable, every team does it, we just have done it better than most. Who do you suggest we try we try and use decoy plays with when 10 of our 13 players are just trying to get back on side off the back of a deep kick. Maybe send your CV to Ivan you seem to think you can offer something our coaching staff is unable too.
 

soc123_au

Coach
Messages
14,386
Honestly asking....which club would want Edwards as a 1st choice fullback?

This article comes to mind. I swear it could have been written by me.

The article loses all credibility for me as defence is a thing too. If you are judging someone in their position you have to look at both sides of the ball to come up with a serious ranking. He is middle of the pack for me.
 

Kilkenny

First Grade
Messages
9,966
Honestly asking....which club would want Edwards as a 1st choice fullback?

This article comes to mind. I swear it could have been written by me.

Your a dead set doomsayer mate.

You just bang on about Dylan Edwards it is so painful.

We would all love to have Tommy T or Latrell or Tedesco instead of Dylan but what world do you live in.

One of the above means two, three or more players who would have to be moved on to accomodate them regardless of which we can’t recruit them anyway.

Your hate of Dylan Edwards borders on an obsession, it really does, no objectivity at all. Do you still think Richard Jewell was responsible for the Atlanta Olympic bombings?
 

Girds89

Juniors
Messages
926
Honestly asking....which club would want Edwards as a 1st choice fullback?

This article comes to mind. I swear it could have been written by me.


Edwards was the best player on ground from both teams against parra.

Watched the replay and honestly lost count of how many times he saved a try scoring chance, be it a last ditch tackle on our line or cleaning up a kick (some on the other side of the field after the last ditch tackles).

Quite simy without edwards we lose on the weekend.

For the coin hes on and how overrated king ploddo is. Id take edwards over him for starters. Ploddo did stuff all against us.

That article was clearly written by someone who has no idea about the game and only sees it as attack.

Edwards is the best fb in the comp in regards to defense, getting our line set and doing all the clean up plays. Hence its one of the main reasons we are the best defensive team in the comp.

His work rste is also higher than the other fbs as the article suggests.

Yes he doesnt have that magic in attack in him but its become bloody obvious to me that just about everyone misses or is blind to the magic he does cleaning up and saving tries in defence. That shit goes unnoticed every week.

He was by far our best on the weekend and theres barely been a word spoken about how good he was. Especially by all those who are only to keen to hammer him when he does something wrong...which us just another myth that was getting around on here.. that he was unsafe.

Being an nrl fb isnt all about attack mate. Its just thats all people want to see sometimes.
 

The Realist

Juniors
Messages
1,079
Your a dead set doomsayer mate.

You just bang on about Dylan Edwards it is so painful.

We would all love to have Tommy T or Latrell or Tedesco instead of Dylan but what world do you live in.

One of the above means two, three or more players who would have to be moved on to accomodate them regardless of which we can’t recruit them anyway.

Your hate of Dylan Edwards borders on an obsession, it really does, no objectivity at all. Do you still think Richard Jewell was responsible for the Atlanta Olympic bombings?

I was basically responding to the possibility of moving Edwards on. I don't think it would be all that easy - as per the article I linked. Did you even read it before seeing red launching into me here? Other clubs either have someone who is BETTER, or someone who is more PROMISING.

I could argue that your ardent defence of Edwards is bordering on an obsession. You attack anyone who is critical of him at all. Mate I understand that he is a 'value for money' player and agree. But he just isn't as good as some fans in here pretend he is - and to make matters worse - he is highly injury prone.

Maybe you are satisfied with mediocrity (winning more than we lose) and are happy to be in the mix in the finals. I am not of that ilk. I want Premierships and sustained success. This club can do it, it can finally fulfill the decades of promise and create a dynasty - but only if it has the will to make the hard calls. I contend that one missing piece is having a fullback who is more than just merely 'serviceable'.

Just for the record I would be more than happy if Edwards suddenly learns to put players into holes - breaks the line and streaks away to score and doesn't go all 'dick fingers Dyl' at critical times of a game. But he has had enough games now and his trajectory suggests he isn't improving to any significant degree.
 
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The Realist

Juniors
Messages
1,079
*SNIP*

That article was clearly written by someone who has no idea about the game and only sees it as attack.

*SNIP*

At least you read the article.

Regarding his defence - I have seen better. You bag Gutho but he has stopped a Rampaging Kikau 1 on 1 and has had several similar plays this season.

On the Contrary I have seen Edwards get beaten all ends up as our last line of defence more than just a few times this season. You believe I undervalue his defence - I believe you are overestimating it. Just a disagreement - no hard feelings, at least on my end.

Just remember he was responsible for 6 of the Eel's points....and if a Guthos IMO line ball wasn't called forward, he'd be at least partially responsible for another 4-6 that would have seen us lose (Finals Galaxy Brain Kikau certainly didn't help). He often has good solid games that are punctuated by absolutely shocking errors at critical times. He has got to get that out of his game.
 

Kilkenny

First Grade
Messages
9,966
I was basically responding to the possibility of moving Edwards on. I don't think it would be all that easy - as per the article I linked. Did you even read it before seeing red launching into me here? Other clubs either have someone who is BETTER, or someone who is more PROMISING.

I could argue that your ardent defence of Edwards is bordering on an obsession. You attack anyone who is critical of him at all. Mate I understand that he is a 'value for money' player and agree. But he just isn't as good as some fans in here pretend he is - and to make matters worse - he is highly injury prone.

Maybe you are satisfied with mediocrity (winning more than we lose) and are happy to be in the mix in the finals. I am not of that ilk. I want Premierships and sustained success. This club can do it, it can finally fulfill the decades of promise and create a dynasty - but only if it has the will to make the hard calls. I contend that one missing piece is having a fullback who is more than just merely 'serviceable'.

Just for the record I would be more than happy if Edwards suddenly learns to put players into holes - breaks the line and streaks away to score and doesn't go all 'dick fingers Dyl' at critical times of a game. But he has had enough games now and his trajectory suggests he isn't improving to any significant degree.
Dylan Edwards is a Panther so read into that what you wish, he will have my support. I support our players. It would be great to have the equivalent of Tommy T but we don’t, aren’t going to have any time soon so support the incumbent until a far better option comes along. Death riding the incumbent achieves nothing.
 
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Original Name

Juniors
Messages
601
At least you read the article.

Regarding his defence - I have seen better. You bag Gutho but he has stopped a Rampaging Kikau 1 on 1 and has had several similar plays this season.

On the Contrary I have seen Edwards get beaten all ends up as our last line of defence more than just a few times this season. You believe I undervalue his defence - I believe you are overestimating it. Just a disagreement - no hard feelings, at least on my end.

Just remember he was responsible for 6 of the Eel's points....and if a Guthos IMO line ball wasn't called forward, he'd be at least partially responsible for another 4-6 that would have seen us lose (Finals Galaxy Brain Kikau certainly didn't help). He often has good solid games that are punctuated by absolutely shocking errors at critical times. He has got to get that out of his game.
These things are hard to judge. If our line organisation is better than other teams there's less try scoring opportunities for the opposition so less chances to make one on one dramatic try saving tackles particularly on big forwards because good defense pushes the tries to the edges where the outside backs are. The best defensive record of any team in the history of the league would certainly indicate Edwards is quite good at it (backing it up when asked about Edwards Cleary said he's one of the best at it without being prompted) but a lot relies on the boys working hard for each other.
 
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ColdWetPanther

Juniors
Messages
752
Dylan Edwards is a Panther so read into that what you wish, he will have my support. I support our players. It would be great to have the equivalent of Tommy T but we don’t, aren’t going to have any time soon so support the incumbent until a far better option comes along. Death riding the incumbent achieves nothing.
I like Dyl and am glad he is Panther; he has been a big part of a very successful part of our history.

But his position on the team seems like it is dependant on others at this stage. We know what we are going to get with Dyl (100% effort always, strong running and backing up, but a clanger in him quite often), but the ceiling of others seems higher and if they meet their potential over the coming year he may find himself on the outer.

As an aside, I have liked over the last few years that we have played to win now; in years gone past the dependable vet like Dyl would have been jettisoned in favour of the youngster with potential. Play the best guy and trust that the youngster won’t leave the system.
 

maple_69

Bench
Messages
4,006
I think he's a great player and think the article is dumb as Girdz said, it just completely ignores defence. Latrell is a gun but he's bloody hopeless without the ball in hand and has spent 8 weeks suspended this year because he's a twat. I'd consider mounting an argument for Dyl over Latrell all things considered. For a shambles like the Dragons he'd be great. Sure get a kid into the team to score a flashy try but don't worry about structurally improving your defence and culture at all...He'd be a massive asset to a lot of clubs.

BUT, I don't think going forward he'll be the right fullback for us. We're a little bit too predictable and little too clunky on our ball movement which I believe leads to us wiffing on more half chances than anyone else. Lose a little in defence to become more clinical in taking our chances and putting teams to the sword and I think we'll be a more dangerous side.
 
Messages
4,978
BUT, I don't think going forward he'll be the right fullback for us. We're a little bit too predictable and little too clunky on our ball movement which I believe leads to us wiffing on more half chances than anyone else. Lose a little in defence to become more clinical in taking our chances and putting teams to the sword and I think we'll be a more dangerous side.

I would agree, but I see nothing in Crichton (or Staines, though he has had only one game at fullback) to suggest he has any real ball-playing skills either. So we may end up weakening the defense for no gain in attack at all.
 

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