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Rumours and Stuff

Happy MEel

First Grade
Messages
9,677
I rate DCE, Cleary above Moses.
I'd probably also pick Hughes over him. Is anyone else superior? I don't think so.
Cleary - yes
DCE - I’d say on par due to DCE’s garbage defence
Hughes - Moses gets the nod due to his kicking game.

I get the frustration at having to fork out $1-$1.2 for Moses. But that’s just what elite halves cost. I think the perfect example of what you get for the next tier down is our other half. He’s a very good second fiddle, but he can’t run the show.

We always talk about freeing up Drown when Moses is injured. I wonder how we’d go freeing up Moses and giving him more possessions without Drown.
 

Happy MEel

First Grade
Messages
9,677
I see Bennett is making moves already at Souths. 4 or 5 were mentioned tonight. Whoever we get this is what we need. Players like Jnr should be tapped. Fingers crossed.
Will a current assistant in his first stint as head coach have the balls to do this? That’s why I wanted Cheika. He at least has experience in the top job making the tough calls.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
60,986
Cleary - yes
DCE - I’d say on par due to DCE’s garbage defence
Hughes - Moses gets the nod due to his kicking game.

I get the frustration at having to fork out $1-$1.2 for Moses. But that’s just what elite halves cost. I think the perfect example of what you get for the next tier down is our other half. He’s a very good second fiddle, but he can’t run the show.

We always talk about freeing up Drown when Moses is injured. I wonder how we’d go freeing up Moses and giving him more possessions without Drown.

Agree with most of what you've said but I just never see Moses step up when we are down and need him to.
At 14-0 Hughes did on the weekend. DCE lead Manly to an awesome win with no men on bench.
Moses is more talented then all halves in comp but I just don't think he has the temperament or game management or should I say that calming influence of a few other halves. When behind he gets a bit erratic.
 

Happy MEel

First Grade
Messages
9,677
Agree with most of what you've said but I just never see Moses step up when we are down and need him to.
At 14-0 Hughes did on the weekend. DCE lead Manly to an awesome win with no men on bench.
Moses is more talented then all halves in comp but I just don't think he has the temperament or game management or should I say that calming influence of a few other halves. When behind he gets a bit erratic.
These are all fair points but I also wonder if he’s a product of his environment. He has been coached for a long time to play possession, make your tackles and essentially play safe. That doesn’t lend itself to an attacking minded halfback, particularly when we’re behind on the scoreboard. When we’re in front, I think it’s completely reasonable to suggest the instruction is to just complete sets and kick long. That may work for a team like Penrith, but our defence and discipline isn’t anywhere near theirs. I truly believe with a new attacking minded coaching staff we wouldn’t put the cue in the rack so to speak and we might actually start to put teams to the sword.
 

Gazzamatta

Coach
Messages
15,237
Will a current assistant in his first stint as head coach have the balls to do this? That’s why I wanted Cheika. He at least has experience in the top job making the tough calls.
We shall see. It should be part of the interview presentation driven by the interviewers. Opinions on current roster, what changes would you make immediately etc etc. We cant have someone who wants to wait and see. Players form and consistency over these past 2 seasons is enough to make ruthless decisions now.
 

Gazzamatta

Coach
Messages
15,237
We shall see. It should be part of the interview presentation driven by the interviewers. Opinions on current roster, what changes would you make immediately etc etc. We cant have someone who wants to wait and see. Players form and consistency over these past 2 seasons is enough to make ruthless decisions now.
And further to this. What if Ryles or Hannay or whoever gave a presentation that included watching all of Parras 23 and 24 games prior and providing thoughts on where we went wrong and how they would change. Structure, roster, staff, etc, etc. I want someone whos ready to go and has a plan from day dot. Bring it boys. Dont wait for questions. Provide answers to questions they havent even thought to ask.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,785
Taking into account pay packet, output and any other factor I can think of, the only players I have ahead of Moses are Cartwright and Hopgood. So there are 20 odd other players I’d let go before Moses.
He’s nowhere near our biggest problem

I'd say he's a fairly big problem when we are winning the field position battle, and he goes MIA - which has already happened a couple of times in recent weeks.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,785
Sorry mate, can’t agree with this. Who are you replacing him with and what savings do you think we’ll get. Drown would be the half to let go if we want to spend elsewhere in the cap.

They're both overpaid.

Maybe therein lies the problem - they're too "similar" in that nether one is a half who will ice a game for you with regularity.

Perhaps finding a stable 6, rather than a dynamic 6, may be what the doctor ordered - perhaps even moving Gutherson there, seeing as his days at fullback are obviously behind him.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,785
I rate DCE, Cleary above Moses.
I'd probably also pick Hughes over him. Is anyone else superior? I don't think so.

Do they have to be "superior" to Moses, though?

Mitch's biggest issue is that he goes missing when we need him to step up - against the Dogs, against a 12-man Chookies team...

He's probably more skilful than DCE, Cleary, et al, but until he can take a game by the scruff of the neck consistently, we won't be doing much in any post-season visits.

He's perhaps not our biggest issue, but I'm sick, and tired, of seeing us constantly hit our opponents' 20-metre zone, and his last tackle option results in nothing.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
60,986
Do they have to be "superior" to Moses, though?

Mitch's biggest issue is that he goes missing when we need him to step up - against the Dogs, against a 12-man Chookies team...

He's probably more skilful than DCE, Cleary, et al, but until he can take a game by the scruff of the neck consistently, we won't be doing much in any post-season visits.

He's perhaps not our biggest issue, but I'm sick, and tired, of seeing us constantly hit our opponents' 20-metre zone, and his last tackle option results in nothing.

That's why he is referred to by opposition fans as a down hill skier.
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
75,457
I think a lot of his problems are because others aren’t doing their jobs.

Johnathan Thurston had a horrific record with Nth Qld with a handful of years only getting single figure wins. There lies the problem with dismissing halfbacks based on their record. Squad and effort by others is an unavoidable metric. One of the greatest 7s ever.

 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,785
Johnathan Thurston had a horrific record with Nth Qld with a handful of years only getting single figure wins. There lies the problem with dismissing halfbacks based on their record. Squad and effort by others is an unavoidable metric. One of the greatest 7s ever.


In two of those lean years, Thurston missed 9 games.

He still managed to kick goals over 78% during those lean years, and kicked multiple field goals.

I'm not saying Moses isn't great- I'm saying I expect more from him as our highest paid player.

I do not think he will help us win a title, though.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
60,986
I think a lot of his problems are because others aren’t doing their jobs.

Yes agree. I think biggest issue starts with backs. No pigs carting it up like a Too. That means our already bigger and slower forwards have to run back further and do more work so they are even more farigued.
Pensini is our only power back.

Russel,Gutho,Blaize,Sivo,Harper,Simmonson are all weak and have not tackle break and PCM power.
 
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