Scrums - the final solution

[Willow]

This is not the first time I've raised this subject. I made it a topic early in the year at the old discussion room but it got swamped by 'other stuff', so I thought I'd give it a go here.

Basically, I want a return to a proper scrum.... but without the scrum penalty.

The problem we had with scrums in the 70s and 80s was the scrum penalty. It was a blight on the game. There were calls to scrap scrums altogether as they were deemed to be a relic from the unlimited tackle days. Thankfully, commonsense prevailed and the powers that be recognised the value of the scrum as the backs had an opportunity to put on various moves while the forwards ran back into the line.
Unfortunately, we had to sacrifice the true role of the Hooker as half backs were now allowed to throw the ball in the direction of the 2nd row. I think this is still technically an infringement but no one seems to care anymore.

I propose that the half back be forced to feed the ball squarely into the scrum and if the ref deems that the half back or front rowers have broken one of the27 or so rules which relate to scrumplay, then instead of penalising the offenders, there is a simple handover.

The halfback of the non-offending team simply plays the ball.
This would do away with the scrum penalty which brought about this situation and bring back fair dinkum scrums.

I'm open to criticism on this because there are a few flawsin my proposal but I do think they can be ironed out.

What do you think?

 

[ozbash]

i think that scrums should be done away with altogether.
replace them with either a tap/play the ball or penalty.
they are a waste of time.
the game would be faster,it would weed out overweight clowns like webcke and howe.
plus its a union thing--scrumaging......

 

[Ramit54]

I would like to see us go back to proper scrums. Having hookers who can win you a ball against the feed.I don't mind scrum penalties, as long as you can't kick for goal from a scrum infringement.
Cheers Retread

 

[imported_Reservoir Dog]

I'm with ozbash on this subject.

Scrums have become a borring and pointless part of the game. It's just an excuse for unfit and overweight forards to take a breather, and for the spectators to grab a bite out of the picnic basket or to take a quick squirt.

The sooner they rid them from the game - the better.

They certainly won't be missed by me.

 

[Willow]

Yeah Retread, wasn't it awful to see a game decided by a scrum penalty? Used to happen a lot. IMO, it was often a ref penalty more than anything. I understand that the shot for goal was abolished with the introduction of 'diferrential penalties'. Again, this is something which is probably still in the laws of the game.
Unfortunately, there were too many hold ups with scrum penalties and the ref was often conned. Thats justone reason why I suggested the handover.

 

[Hass]

I think we should return to old-fashioned scrums. I might be biased considering that my position of the football field was hooker, but contesting for the ball used to be one of the good parts of the game. Surely we could see the employment of differential penalties where you can't kick for goal.

The scrum should be an integral part of the game where the respective packs can try and exert their dominance- let's get it back there again.

Cheers.

 

[Hass]

While we are at it, I'd also like to see a return to striking being allowed in the ruck. Apart from adding another dimension to the game, it would mean there would be an actual logiocal reason behind penalising people for incorrect play-the-balls.

The less we make our game 1,2,3,4,5- Kick, the better.

Cheers.

 

[Willow]

Well Hass, being a halfback with very limited potential, I was also sorry to see scrums devalued.

IMO,the newand accepted way of scrumplay has taken away the skills of feeding the tunnel. The hookers and half backs stopped bothering with communicating with each other.
Timingis no longer an issue.

 

[Ramit54]

I agree with everything you said Hass. Our game has become to predictable. Let's start working hard for this ball. Someone drops a ball now no one dive on it they know it will be a hand over or a scrum feed to the opposition and you got buckleys chance of winning it.
Cheers Retread

 

[Willow]

"I'd also like to see a return to striking being allowed in the ruck..."

Well I couldn't agree more!

A clever hooker at dummy half could win posssesion for his team at critical moments.

Why was it made illegal? The only reason I ever heard was because it was decided that it was old relic of a rule. IMO, it made the tackled player play the ball properly!

Is it because it was seen as another part of the game thathad to be scrapped becausethe game's controller's wanted more tries?

 

[Hass]

I believe it was scrapped during the Super League year. It was done in this year of madness and somehow got retained when the two got back together in 1998. I think one excuse offered was "one-on-one steals are now acceptable so there's no need for stricking".

Bring it Back!

Cheers.

 

[Willow]

One-on-one steals are messy and the ref often gets it wrong.

The striking in the ruck rule was more transparent. Everybody could see what was going on.

Yeah... bring it back!

 

[legend]

While we're at it, bring back the tap forward if there is no marker. It penalises a lazy defence and I find it a fair rule.I also would like to see scrums contested again as I was a prop for part of my career and I used to win many against the feed.

 

[ozbash]

gents, unless scrums are properly contested,a la union, what is the point of even packing it down ?
as for this striking bussines, the more the merrier. props striking 2nd rowers, centers striking wingers, just like in the good ol days.....sigh,,,

 

[Willow]

Thats another one Legend. I agree. The strange thing about that isthe tap forward rule should lead to more tries!
In fact by not having it, the markers are less relevant and are at best, encouraged not to stand square (offside but rarely penalised), thereby impeding the first receiver.
I think it was also dropped around the same time as the striking in the ruck rule.
As Hass said... during the year of madness.

 

[Cronulla_Mania]

Just on a side note, thats why they were called hookers in the first place! They were there to rake the ball in a scrum. Trust me, the no9 was not given the label hooker because they stood behind the man in the play the ball ....In todays environment, you might as well call them daffodils!
I like Willows original suggestion. FORCE them to feed the ball into the middle of the scrum, no buts asked. An unfair feed = turnover. Similar to how unfair lineouts in the rahs are punished. Striking in the play the ball is ugly, it does slow the game down. Id prefer a rule where striking at the ball is only allowed in the last 10mins of each 1/2, in order to keep people excited towards the end of the 1/2s... sound good?
Tap Forward rule sounds good as well...Very good, the think tank is working well today.
MFC.

 

[Willow]

MFC:
Rake,
Hooker,
the littlechubby guy in the middle of the front row
... any of the above will do.

BTW, you say No. 9.
I'm so stuck im my ways that I still think of them as No.12s.
I think it happened in sometime in the 80s...why were the numbers changed? Anyone know?

 

[Ramit54]

Willow
Australiachanged their numbering so that theywould be the same as International numbering. Australia was always different to International numbering.
Cheers Retread

 

[Willow]

ThanksRetread. I remember now.

 

[imported_Noodles]

It's not a bad idea Willow, you've eliminated many peoples argument that contested scrums will mean a return to games won by scrum penalties.
I like having scrums in the game, even if left the way it is.
OK, you know who is going to win, but it gives a different attacking dimension - no forwards and fullback usually in the line.Thsi situation would be lost if a changeover was used, and just lead to more monontony.
I don't understand why people want to keep speeding the game up. If you want to speed the game up, the easist way is to eliminate tackles and make it that you just have to touch the guy with the football.
How about a few rules to toughen the game up again.