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Seasons 2020 + 2021 COVID-19 discussion thread

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
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60,255
It’s not just a flu, but what people are getting upset about, is how the government seems to put a twist on things.

it’s obvious if someone dies, that may of had the virus, the cause of death will be covid. But when they die after taking the jab, it seems to be they died from natural causes, a clot or heart attack.
There is a lot of people in the chain who all need to be corrupt to hide stuff as you are suggesting.

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Gronk

Moderator
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60,255
It looks like one person if its a natural death

And im not trying to say that person is corrupt .... just saying
Sure, patient gets a blood clot (short time frame after AZ for example), gets admitted to hospital and unfortunately dies. The consulting physician declares it not a "reportable death" and signs a death certificate easy peasy ?

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Kornstar

Coach
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15,493
Perhaps not but I don't think the risk justifies it and it erodes the public's trust in authorities. And when we're being denied what appear to be some safe and effective treatments then I have a hard time believing it's got much to do with the greater good.

So your entire issue is that we are not endorsing Ivermectin? Do you have shares in the company or something?

The exact tactics used by anti-vaxxers. Both sides are looking to brainwash.

You may be right but one side is using science and medical facts and the other is reading a FB post, twitter feed or watching a 2 hour YouTube video to get their advice and "facts".

I'm simply saying that I don't know what the procedure is when that happens. Do they routinely look for the cause? Isn't that more of the coroner's job? I haven't seen the statement from the hospital. Or maybe as I said it's just a covid death due to a recent positive PCR. I'm not suggesting any wrongdoing on their part.

Out of curiosity, if you die from a coward punch and go into cardiac arrest, did you die from the punch or heart attack? On your death certificate I am positive it says heart attack but we all know that without the punch there was no heart attack.

Yes but if the cause of death is a heart attack do they usually investigate what caused it?
I thought we did know it was a heart attack. And no, don't disagree. Also think it's wrong to go public with this if they don't know what role if anything covid had. I doubt his family appreciate it.

Dr Chant stated it is being referred to the coroner because it was all of a sudden later into his infectious period and obviously that was concerning, what else do you want from them? One thing for certain was that he had COVID!

@abc news are saying that old mate Aude who died was healthy with no comorbidities.

He was a soccer player, he was a very fit guy. He used to always do sports. He never smoked, doesn’t drink,” Mr Mnati said.


Someone is lying then and I bet I know who will be painted into the lying category.......and it won't be the tweets from yesterday that's for sure.
 

Gary Gutful

Immortal
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42,425
You may be right but one side is using science and medical facts and the other is reading a FB post, twitter feed or watching a 2 hour YouTube video to get their advice and "facts".
I think that’s unfair. The YouTube videos often reference and discuss science and are even presented by scientists. Some of the information regarding the effectiveness of Ivermectin looks pretty solid from what I can see.

There is some decent information being presented on both sides of the argument and it’s a shame that the extreme views on both sides have impacted on our ability to have a sensible conversation around the risks/benefits of vaccination or the efficacy of supplementary treatments such as Ivermectin.

I’m risk averse and will generally go with what I am told to do but if I wanted to explore alternatives it’s pretty hard to weed through the bullshit.
 

Gronk

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60,255
I think that’s unfair. The YouTube videos often reference and discuss science and are even presented by scientists. Some of the information regarding the effectiveness of Ivermectin looks pretty solid from what I can see.

There is some decent information being presented on both sides of the argument and it’s a shame that the extreme views on both sides have impacted on our ability to have a sensible conversation around the risks/benefits of vaccination or the efficacy of supplementary treatments such as Ivermectin.

I’m risk averse and will generally go with what I am told to do but if I wanted to explore alternatives it’s pretty hard to weed through the bullshit.
Ivermectin has been politicised and it's a shame. As I posted a few times, the merkins from FLCCC (even their hero Kory) is on the record as saying that it should not be considered as an alternative to vaccinations (as he himself is vaccinated).


The mere fact that this is ignored is evidence enough to say that there is manipulation of the truth. Is there manipulation by big pharma ? You decide.

 

Kornstar

Coach
Messages
15,493
I think that’s unfair. The YouTube videos often reference and discuss science and are even presented by scientists. Some of the information regarding the effectiveness of Ivermectin looks pretty solid from what I can see.

There is some decent information being presented on both sides of the argument and it’s a shame that the extreme views on both sides have impacted on our ability to have a sensible conversation around the risks/benefits of vaccination or the efficacy of supplementary treatments such as Ivermectin.

I’m risk averse and will generally go with what I am told to do but if I wanted to explore alternatives it’s pretty hard to weed through the bullshit.

Yes, sorry you are correct. There is some that is valid but there is also a f**k load that is irresponsible and whenever it is updated you never hear retractions and the misinformation is spread.

Alternatively it doesn't work the other way, people jump on everything that is negative and spread it like wild fire.

Out of curiosity, why do you think Australia are not interested in Ivermectin?
 
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35,878
Yes, it is not unusual to do so if there are any other medically related circumstances that may have brought on the heart attack.

In May, my MIL passed away during surgery for a hip replacement. She suffered a heart attack on the operating table. Her case went to the Coroner to work out whether the surgery and not any other underlying conditions, was the cause of the heart attack. The Coroners findings attempt to identify the root cause of the death.

In the case of this gentleman, the fact that he had a heart attack (which killed him) whilst also infected with the SARS-COV-2 virus would be sufficient to have the Coroner seek to confirm the cause of the death.
I'm sorry to hear that but I was asking if it's the hospital that investigates or the coroner. And that looks like confirmation that it's the coroner, as I suspected. So calling this a covid death at this stage could well be premature.
 
Messages
35,878
So your entire issue is that we are not endorsing Ivermectin? Do you have shares in the company or something?



You may be right but one side is using science and medical facts and the other is reading a FB post, twitter feed or watching a 2 hour YouTube video to get their advice and "facts".



Out of curiosity, if you die from a coward punch and go into cardiac arrest, did you die from the punch or heart attack? On your death certificate I am positive it says heart attack but we all know that without the punch there was no heart attack.




Dr Chant stated it is being referred to the coroner because it was all of a sudden later into his infectious period and obviously that was concerning, what else do you want from them? One thing for certain was that he had COVID!



Someone is lying then and I bet I know who will be painted into the lying category.......and it won't be the tweets from yesterday that's for sure.
No shares in ivermectin and no, that's not my only issue. Get a grip.
 

Gronk

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60,255
It's just a jab. Doesn't hurt a bit.

Did you read the article ? He reckons that pathologists don't know to autopsy properly. He has no proof, but anyway everyone else is wrong ! Meanwhile this is today's viral antivax super share item on twitter.

Google Translate -- https://translate.google.com/transl...loge-pocht-auf-mehr-Obduktionen-von-Geimpften

Stuttgart / Heidelberg - The chief pathologist at the University of Heidelberg, Peter Schirmacher, urges many more autopsies of vaccinated people. In addition to corona deaths, the corpses of people who die in connection with a vaccination would have to be examined more frequently, said Schirmacher of the German Press Agency .

The director of the Pathological Institute in Heidelberg even warns of a high number of unreported cases of vaccination deaths and complains: The pathologists do not notice anything about most of the patients who die after and possibly from a vaccination. However, other scientists disagree with him on this point, as do the Standing Vaccination Commission ( STIKO ) and the Paul Ehrlich Institute ( PEI ).

Coronatote autopsies have been performed at the university clinics in the southwest for a year in order to better understand the disease. The state supports the COVID-19 autopsy research of the university pathologies with around 1.8 million euros. Schirmacher heads the autopsy project. The findings of more than 200 autopsies so far have led, among other things, to better treatment and ventilation for people with COVID, he says.

"The knowledge gained here therefore helps to be able to treat sick people better and more successfully and to save lives," says Science Minister Theresia Bauer (Greens). Schirmacher, a member of the National Academy of Sciences Leopoldina since 2012 , hopes that the funding will continue next year.

The doctor now wants to get to the bottom of rare, serious side effects of vaccination - such as cerebral vein thrombosis or autoimmune diseases. The problem from his point of view: Vaccinated people usually do not die under clinical observation. "The corpse-examining doctor does not establish a context with the vaccination and certifies a natural death and the patient is buried," reports Schirmacher. "Or he certifies an unclear type of death and the public prosecutor sees no third-party fault and releases the corpse for burial."

In Baden-Württemberg, the pathologists therefore worked with public prosecutors, the police and resident doctors, reports Schirmacher. More than 40 people have already been autopsied who died within two weeks of being vaccinated. Schirmacher assumes that 30 to 40 percent of them died from the vaccination. In his opinion, the frequency of fatal consequences of vaccinations is underestimated - a politically explosive statement in times when the vaccination campaign is losing momentum, the delta variant is spreading rapidly and restrictions on non-vaccinated people are being discussed.

Schirmacher received a clear contradiction from other scientists. The statements that there is currently too little knowledge about side effects and the dangers of vaccination are underestimated are incomprehensible, said the Paul Ehrlich Institute.

In particular for serious reactions, which also include when a person dies after a vaccination, there is a reporting obligation under the Infection Protection Act. "I do not know of any data that would allow a reasonable statement to be made here and I am not starting from an unreported number," said the head of the Standing Vaccination Commission, Thomas Mertens.

There is no reason to assume a high number of unreported vaccination complications or even deaths, emphasized the immunologist Christian Bogdan from the Erlangen University Hospital . “There can also be no question of neglecting the possible dangers of COVID-19 vaccines.” The last few weeks and months in particular have shown that the surveillance system is working well. In Germany, for example, the rare occurrence of cerebral vein thrombosis after vaccination with Astrazeneca (1-2 cases per 100,000 vaccinations) was recognized as a complication, says Bogdan.

Schirmacher insists on his opinion. “My colleagues are definitely wrong because they cannot assess this specific question competently,” he responded. He doesn't want to spread panic and is by no means opposed to vaccinations, says the professor, who says he himself had himself vaccinated against corona. Vaccination is an essential part of the fight against the virus, he clarifies.
 

Gary Gutful

Immortal
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42,425
Out of curiosity, why do you think Australia are not interested in Ivermectin?
Probably think the risk isn’t significant enough yet that we need to offer it. The government is also following the medical advice from our experts who support WHO’s advice.
 

Kornstar

Coach
Messages
15,493
Probably think the risk isn’t significant enough yet that we need to offer it. The government is also following the medical advice from our experts who support WHO’s advice.

I think you are right, it isn't as out of control as some places so therefore there is no clamouring for solutions.

I believe that the biggest thing that people still fail to understand is just how the circumstances of each and every country and even region requires completely different measures put in place. What we see in one place may not work in another and there are a plethora of reasons why.

We happen to have a great health system (regardless of what people think), where as somewhere like the USA is f**king train wreck for the most part and the way their entire system works, makes it impossible to compare and give meaningful data to support why they do something versus why we don't.

Booked my first vax. Will get it in a couple of weeks time.

Make sure you do your magnetic video evidence test of before and after........I also want to see your tremor videos after the vaccine with a big smile on your face like ti is some kind of funny event.......

I am in the very slow process of booking mine in, I could actually get one tomorrow if I wanted but I am going to book mine in but book it in for the latest date possible cause I need a lot of preparation to get a needle. I've registered.......actually booking it is the next hurdle.......
 

eels_fan

Bench
Messages
4,937
6th death from AZ in Australia just confirmed.


how can something that has a risk of killing you be mandated??? It simply can’t be. Yes other vaccines, medications can have side effects as well, but none of those are mandated for you to be able to live in freedom or to work in your chosen field
 
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