What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Seasons 2020 - 22 COVID-19 discussion thread

hindy111

Immortal
Messages
42,822
should everyone who has done things that adversely affect their health foot the bill for their hospital treatment? ..... smokers, drug takers, people who speed and crash their car - I'm sure we could come up with a sizeable list

Drinkers, people who eat fatty foods, participate in dangerous sports. The list goes on
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,161
I read yesterday that 40% of deaths in USA over the last 100,000 where people under 60 from Delta. I am not going to try and find it again and source it but that is what I read. Maybe can find it.

I'm 40 and fairly fit. But I still would feel nervous if caught it tbh.
I got the flu bad a few years back and I was this -> <- close heading off to emergency cos I couldn't breathe. So I reckon covid would knock me around if I got it, considering that it is primarily a respiratory disease.
 

hindy111

Immortal
Messages
42,822
yes I had shingles .... they took a swab and tested it - it was shingles - but there was no explanation why - usually there is ....... I'm not sure i had covid, I suspect I might have - thats all I have said ....... yeah there is no proof - if there was I'd be more adamant I had it

and sorry, but you are slinging shit around

I'd say unlikely due to timing. Unless you'd been to China.
I'd say I may of based on timing and Swedish guys flying in and out before border shut
 

hindy111

Immortal
Messages
42,822
I got the flu bad a few years back and I was this -> <- close heading off to emergency cos I couldn't breathe. So I reckon covid would knock me around if I got it, considering that it is primarily a respiratory disease.

Do you think there is a relation between people who have side effects off vaccine like flu symptoms, headaches etc to how the would of reacted from the actual virus?

Around 10 people I know like myself had zero side effects. But I know 3 who had the flu and spent a day in bed.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
72,987
I'd say unlikely due to timing. Unless you'd been to China.
I'd say I may of based on timing and Swedish guys flying in and out before border shut
You think there was no one going to and from china in december? .... people are even starting to ponder if it was in china mid 2019 .... theres also evidence of unusually high rates of pneumonia in europe and usa in their autumn sep/oct/nov - obviously not called covid cos it wasnt a thing then

No one has ever conclusively gotten to the bottom of how/when this all came about
 

hindy111

Immortal
Messages
42,822
You think there was no one going to and from china in december? .... people are even starting to ponder if it was in china mid 2019 .... theres also evidence of unusually high rates of pneumonia in europe and usa in their autumn sep/oct/nov - obviously not called covid cos it wasnt a thing then

No one has ever conclusively gotten to the bottom of how/when this all came about

Sure. But chances would of been low is what I am saying. Same as mine even though the Swedes and time frame match up. I reckon there was a chance I had it but a higher chance I didn't.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
72,987
Well I was making the point that your decision doesn't only affect you, that happens in a myriad of ways. I sorry you find that objectionable.

As far as I'm aware asymptomatic spread is still a thing, I don't see that as at all at odds with the idea that people who are more sick, for a longer period of time, will also be more contagious for a longer period of time.

You seem to want to dwell on absolutes and ignore degrees. It's fact that the vaccinated are less likely to get the disease. That alone is enough to tell you they are less likely to be contagious ( and therefore spread it ) because you can't spread what you don't have.
Sorry, still dont see your fact about less likely to get the disease. Sure data suggests less likely to get serious illness - cool. But singapore clearly shows it still spreads, so fact would appear to be that people still get infected. And they are spreading what they do have.

Gladys' statement that cases are going to go through the roof is based on something someone told her right? Or you reckon she just made it up?

Literally every dude with letters next to their name is saying we will all get exposed/infected. If nearly everyone is vaxed then thats gotta be vaccinated aswell right? People know its gonna spread and they know via vaxed as likely as unvaxed.

Ive said all along, we have to stop obsessing with cases. Cases are just positive tests showing a presence. Your body can be happily fighting it and you wont get sick. Nothing has changed there - vax is helping this, cool.

Being vaxed will help protect you. No one is disagreeing. By vaxing you are looking out for your own health and stopping yourself getting ill, no one is disagreeing. But you are not stopping yourself getting infected and potentially passing it on. So i think the notion of protecting others by being vaxed is a very hazy one and more a warm fuzzy notion used to encourage people to vax. You are still likely passing it round.

Asymptomatic spread is the core of how people think this has gone crazy. I think there is a risk this is even more likely if vaxed are not getting clear symptoms. They will think they are bulletproof and just carry on.
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,161
Sure. But chances would of been low is what I am saying. Same as mine even though the Swedes and time frame match up. I reckon there was a chance I had it but a higher chance I didn't.
I reckon the chances of getting it in 2019 early 2020 without contract tracers knowing about it were pretty slim.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
72,987
Sure. But chances would of been low is what I am saying. Same as mine even though the Swedes and time frame match up. I reckon there was a chance I had it but a higher chance I didn't.
Sure. But how do we know how much of it was around?
 

hindy111

Immortal
Messages
42,822
Sure. But how do we know how much of it was around?

I assume people going into hospital. That would of been the only way. They would of been able to look back at records and go ok we see a huge difference in people requiring ventilation etc. But also keep in mind once it did break out and testing was done there wasn't many cases. One would guess if it was around then by time we started testing numbers would of soared right?
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,161
Sorry, still dont see your fact about less likely to get the disease. Sure data suggests less likely to get serious illness - cool. But singapore clearly shows it still spreads, so fact would appear to be that people still get infected. And they are spreading what they do have.

Gladys' statement that cases are going to go through the roof is based on something someone told her right? Or you reckon she just made it up?

Literally every dude with letters next to their name is saying we will all get exposed/infected. If nearly everyone is vaxed then thats gotta be vaccinated aswell right? People know its gonna spread and they know via vaxed as likely as unvaxed.

Ive said all along, we have to stop obsessing with cases. Cases are just positive tests showing a presence. Your body can be happily fighting it and you wont get sick. Nothing has changed there - vax is helping this, cool.

Being vaxed will help protect you. No one is disagreeing. By vaxing you are looking out for your own health and stopping yourself getting ill, no one is disagreeing. But you are not stopping yourself getting infected and potentially passing it on. So i think the notion of protecting others by being vaxed is a very hazy one and more a warm fuzzy notion used to encourage people to vax. You are still likely passing it round.

Asymptomatic spread is the core of how people think this has gone crazy. I think there is a risk this is even more likely if vaxed are not getting clear symptoms. They will think they are bulletproof and just carry on.
I shared the data last week which was interpreted by a graph of how quickly the viral load dissipates in a vaccinated person . So the exponential spread comparison with a unvaxxed vs vaxxed is significant.

OIDP_Gif_CommunityImmunity_thumb_0.gif


content-1488280999-animation-7.gif
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,161
I assume people going into hospital. That would of been the only way. They would of been able to look back at records and go ok we see a huge difference in people requiring ventilation etc. But also keep in mind once it did break out and testing was done there wasn't many cases. One would guess if it was around then by time we started testing numbers would of soared right?
Our borders were shut pretty much immediately when it landed in Brisbane Melbourne. Considering how quickly it spreads in the community, I think we're drawing a long bow to suggest that it was lurking in Sydney late 2019.

 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
72,987
I shared the data last week which was interpreted by a graph of how quickly the viral load dissipates in a vaccinated person . So the exponential spread comparison with a unvaxxed vs vaxxed is significant.

OIDP_Gif_CommunityImmunity_thumb_0.gif


content-1488280999-animation-7.gif
Hasnt literally everyone decided herd immunity isnt possible since delta?
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
72,987
Our borders were shut pretty much immediately when it landed in Brisbane Melbourne. Considering how quickly it spreads in the community, I think we're drawing a long bow to suggest that it was lurking in Sydney late 2019.

How do you identify something you dont know exists? That you dont even have a test for? That you arent even looking for?

People accept this was in china in oct/nov - and now people are even suggesting it could have been earlier .... what was stopping it going to other parts of the world then?
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,161
Hasnt literally everyone decided herd immunity isnt possible since delta?
"Herd Immunity" may not occur like it has with polio, but the term is still used in science.

IS HERD IMMUNITY STILL AN ACHIEVABLE GOAL FOR COVID-19?

Yes—but “herd immunity to COVID-19” does not mean that we will soon achieve a level of immunity in the population, like what we see with measles, and coronavirus will be “over.” Returning to life as it was before the pandemic, without seeing large coronavirus outbreaks, is unlikely to happen for several years, for a few reasons.

First, it has proven much harder to get people vaccinated against COVID-19 than against measles. As of September 2021, just over half of the US population was fully vaccinated against COVID-19—even though we know that the FDA-approved vaccines are extremely safe and have remained highly effective, even against new variants like the delta variant.

Second, young children are still not eligible for the vaccine, and new children (who are susceptible to COVID-19) are born every day. So, until we get vaccines that are approved for use in all ages, there is likely to be ongoing transmission of the coronavirus in kids, who will in turn be able to infect adults, especially unvaccinated ones.

Third, while our vaccines against COVID-19 are very effective and dramatically reduce the risk of infection, they do not reduce that risk to zero. People who have gotten vaccinated can still become infected (so-called breakthrough infections), and some people who have had COVID-19 can get it again. This means that we would need an even higher level of vaccination against COVID-19 to achieve herd immunity.

For all these reasons, it will be very challenging to get to the level of population immunity against COVID-19 that we have seen with measles in the U.S. We should therefore expect to see some level of ongoing coronavirus transmission in our population for many years (if not forever). But as we build immunity to SARS-CoV-2, the risk of severe illness will decrease, and future waves of infection won’t be as disruptive.

SO, HOW SHOULD WE BE THINKING ABOUT HERD IMMUNITY TO COVID-19?

Because we can’t eliminate SARS-CoV-2, there is a real risk that it will continue to circulate until the vast majority of the population will be exposed—but vaccinated individuals are less likely to be infected when exposed, and they are largely protected from the worst outcomes of infection. In the U.S., someone who is vaccinated has less than 1/10th the risk of getting seriously ill as someone who is not.

This level of protection against severe disease makes it possible that—even if we can’t eliminate transmission of the coronavirus soon—we can get to a level of population immunity where COVID’s effects can be manageable. For example, by achieving high levels of vaccination before the summer of 2021, countries like Germany, Spain, and Canada have kept their COVID-related death rates much lower than what we have seen in the U.S.—even though they have seen surges in cases like those seen in the U.S. COVID mortality rates in these countries are similar to the death rates from suicide or motor vehicle crashes in the U.S. Each of these deaths is a tragedy, but this comparison suggests that, if we can increase vaccination levels, we can eventually get COVID-19 to a level where its effects are like those of other major public health concerns in this country.

 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,161
How do you identify something you dont know exists? That you dont even have a test for? That you arent even looking for?

People accept this was in china in oct/nov - and now people are even suggesting it could have been earlier .... what was stopping it going to other parts of the world then?
This is where you need to sit back and trust science.

They have been testing sewerage for quite a long time.


 

Latest posts

Top