Should Mary's Contract Be Extended For another 3 Year Term?

Discussion in 'St George Illawarra Dragons' started by possm, Feb 11, 2019.

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Sould Mary's Contract Be Extended?

Poll closed May 12, 2019.
  1. No

    85.6%
  2. Yes

    14.4%
  1. possm

    possm Coach

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    There are contentious views on the forum regarding the idea of extending Mary's contract. Have your say and let's see what the popular view is.
     
  2. Brutalitops

    Brutalitops Juniors

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    I can't answer yet because the season isn't over.

    A shame the board doesn't also hold this stance
     
  3. possm

    possm Coach

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    Strange, you mean you don't have a view on this even though Mary has been head coach, making on decisions and gaining no GF representations over the best part of the last 5 years? Why would we wait even one more year given the repetitive nature of Mary's mistakes and his inability to notice them and take remedial action.
     
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  4. muzby

    muzby Village Idiot Staff Member

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    I love stacking a poll with a false answer..

    I think we should all vote yes..
     
  5. grouch

    grouch First Grade

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    There's no false answer. Straightforward poll
     
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  6. tumbidragon

    tumbidragon First Grade

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    3 years just isn't enough time to rebuild the team, and take us from 7th to 6th... Make it a 5 year deal!
     
  7. possm

    possm Coach

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    Your post is no surprise to me!
     
  8. muzby

    muzby Village Idiot Staff Member

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    is that a false answer too?
     
  9. Brutalitops

    Brutalitops Juniors

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    Well no, as this was not the question. I would wait out this year as there are no other coaches really pushing down the door to be hired (that opportunity was last year), but that absolutely doesn't mean I think Mary should be extended.

    Any contract talk with Mary should be on the back burner pending our performance this year. He's done nothing to earn an early extension yet
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
  10. dragon thomo

    dragon thomo Juniors

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    No I believe we need to wait to see if we finish in the top four at least or he has to go.
    I can’t work out why there is a rush as I don’t think we have any concern of another club chasing him.
    If we don’t make the Grand Final he should go.
     
  11. Crush

    Crush First Grade

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    Its not rocket science, if he takes us to a top 4 finish then yes he should be extended. Because top 4 is where all teams want to be and why not renew someone who delivers that.
    But if he doesn't he should be let go as he has had 5 years building up to this year.
    He definitely shouldn't be extended before the end of the season though, its not like other clubs are chasing him?
     
  12. grouch

    grouch First Grade

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    Copy pasting my fkn essay:

    ..

    Rumour has it that the St George Illawarra Dragons are poised to extend the contract of Paul “Mary” McGregor by three years, which will make him the longest-serving coach in the history of St George, Illawarra and St.George Illawarra.

    Roy Masters (St George) 162 games
    Nathan Brown (St George Illawarra) 151 games
    Ken Kearney (St George) 141 games
    David Waite (Stg and Stgi) 129 games
    Harry Bath (St George) 118 games
    Brian Smith (St George) 118 games
    Paul McGregor (St George Illawarra) 114 games*
    Graham Murray (Illawarra) 91 games

    McGregor is the only coach listed to have NOT reach at least a preliminary final, while 4 of the coaches have made grand finals, with 2 winning them. Of the coaches listed above, McGregor has the lowest winning percentage, with just 50.9%.


    One might ask: why would St George Illawarra extend his contract? Let’s go through the likely answers to that question Dragons HQ will come up with, as well as proof they are rubbish.


    He’s achieved great results so far and is an elite coach.

    When Steve Price was sacked after round 10 of 2014, the Dragons sat in equal 11th (13th due to for & against) two competition points outside the top 8. His assistant, Paul McGregor elevated into the top job and steered the team to 7 wins and 7 losses, including a 10-40 thrashing in the final round, to finish in outright 11th place, four points outside the top 8.
    Since then he has had 4 full NRL seasons as head coach, with 2 top 8 finishes and 1 finals win, and as mentioned, a winning percentage of just 50.9%.

    Recent coaches with 4+ years experience with only one or less finals wins are: Jason Taylor, Neil Henry, John Cartwright, Anthony Griffin, Stephen Kearney and Brad Arthur. That is not elite company. On the flipside, Craig Bellamy and Trent Robinson both won 5 finals matches in their first 4 years of coaching, and Paul Green won 8. The last coach to win a premiership having won 1 or less finals games in their first 4 years of coaching was Chris Anderson in 1995 – however he was dealing with a 5 team finals series (and he made a grand final in year 5, and won the comp in year 6).


    McGregor has put together a strong squad of players.

    He's certainly working with a much stronger squad than his predecessor. However, he deserves no credit for that, as the recruitment duties were quite publicly stripped from him in late 2016 and handed to Ian Millward.


    The players are loyal to McGregor.

    Aside from Gareth Widdop, the club captain no less, leaving the club mid-contract under McGregor’s tenure, he has also seen big name players Josh Dugan and Trent Merrin (among others) leave the club in his time.


    Rival clubs may poach him.

    This may be somewhat a subjective point, but, it seems incredibly unlikely another club will attempt to steal him from the Dragons. The bulk of NRL clubs are committed to their coaches for beyond next year, with the remainder (at a glance Bulldogs, Newcastle, Warriors and Gold Coast) employing coaches of similar career stature to McGregor currently. They’d be replacing like with like.

    In addition to that, McGregor has never been employed anywhere else in the NRL. He has no experience of organisations outside of Illawarra or St George Illawarra. Played his entire career with the one NRL club, and has spent his entire off-field career with the one NRL club – beginning with a training and conditional role under Nathan Brown, before returning as an assistant under Steve Price (he went back to a local Wollongong club in the Bennett years). Every single coach currently employed in the NRL has some form of experience at a different NRL club, be it playing or in an assistant role. It is almost an unwritten prerequisite of being a coach. Now, there is a notable exception to this rule in Geoff Toovey, who did guide Manly to a grand final. However, it’s also worth noting that aside from a gig with the relegated Bradford Bulls in England, he has not been engaged by any other clubs since.


    Recruitment stability. Incoming players want to know the coaching situation is stable.

    This is a difficult one to categorically disprove, as it is a myth that is widely believed in across the league, and the reason why many coaches are sacked (or advised they will not be renewed) at the very latest halfway through their final season.

    However there are two pieces of evidence that provide a sufficient counter to this myth.

    1. There are many examples that show players recruited by a sacked coach have no problem staying at their new club under a different coach. Dane Gagai signed by Michael Maguire in June 2017, Maguire sacked in September 2017. Jai Arrow was signed by Neil Henry but didn’t play a single game under him, yet became a rep player under Garth Brennan. Api Koroisau was signed by Geoff Toovey and never played under him. Tautau Moga was signed by Neil Henry at Nth Qld, he spent 3 seasons in Townsville coached by Paul Green. The list could keep going. I present these merely as evidence that a coach change has, in reality, minimal effect on new recruits. If a coach change has minimal effect, then a coach under a cloud would be the same.

    2. The Dragons recruitment situation for 2019 appears settled. Only fringe or young players are coming off contract, and no big names. Gareth Widdop has already been ostensibly replaced by Corey Norman, so one would assume the main recruit would likely be a fullback. There are no fullbacks on what you’d refer to as marquee (Widdop-style) money coming off contract in 2019 (the closest would be perhaps Gutherson from Parramatta and he’s a stretch), so you’d likely have that money available for an up and coming, potentially untried fullback . In that case, it’s safe to assume the player is moving clubs for a combination of the first grade opportunity, and the first grade pay packet. Head coach status would be well down the list.


    In summary, there is no good reason to extend McGregor’s contract right now, if ever.
     
  13. Mr Angry

    Mr Angry Not a Referee

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    I vote yes, cause Mary makes for good forum discussion.

    Plus he loses a lot good for my team.
     
  14. Overseas dragon

    Overseas dragon Juniors

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    16.7% of this forum are employed by WIN CORP.... ...
     
  15. hewi

    hewi Juniors

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    If and IMO it’s a big if the board wish to extend his contract then do it on the same terms as Brownie at Newcastle. Performance based, don’t make the hurdles in the contract you are gone, no compensation.
     
  16. blacksafake

    blacksafake Guest

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    Post of the year.
    Very well researched & presented Grouch.

    He's had enough time to produce,time to move on.
     
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  17. LINESPEED

    LINESPEED Juniors

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    If true, our Board’s preseason extension talks are impossible to justify ATM, unless it’s all just about consolidating mates’ political positions from CEO to waterboy - a defensive hunkering down fortress Kogarah mentality that’s symptomatic of unaccountable authoritarian regimes.

    FMD I would not sign a contract to play with this mob if I were a young fella - especially considering the flawed selection history over the 4 years of this buffoon’s tenure.

    These kids’ Dads must be beside themselves?

    By all accounts he has no idea of his team’s backline or bench structure for 2019. He chokes when the blowtorch is applied & reverts to the trusted and known.

    Waterboy must be a player/player manager’s nightmare in terms of future career direction planning

    Uncertain times ahead for some key youngsters, but the journeymen & arseli*kers will be fine.

    There are many scenarios, but I could envisage Widdop popping the shoulder round 3, post Dufty’s departure to the Sharkies, Field to the Cows,
    Robson to the Titans, Fittler luring Lomax to the Rorters after playing second fiddle to barnacle Aitken - & a couple of young forwards throwing their hands up in despair.

    Guarantee you these thoughts are in the above kids’ minds right now as Mary fumbles his way into another season.

    Oh yeah - and we miss the 8 after Waterboy’s 3 year extension in Feb & then finding the talent had taken their leave FMD.

    Talk about a fuc*ked up management outfit
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
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  18. muzby

    muzby Village Idiot Staff Member

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    That’s a very specific figure...

    How could you know...? Are you one of them?
     
  19. Saint_JimmyG

    Saint_JimmyG Bench

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    A more pertinent question is “Should McGregor have been appointed the Dragons’ first grade coach to begin with”?

    Answer: not on your life.
     
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  20. SBD82

    SBD82 First Grade

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    Voted yes. Just in case the alternative was 4 years.
     

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