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SJ.

Messages
2,961
The Warriors to be fair have been excellent in their management of injuries since Webster took over.

I have a medical background (not as high as a Doctor lol so not pretending to be Doctor know it all but I have degrees and nearly three decades in health science so not a guy making stuff up out of the ether either).

To answer your question. why the F would the Warriors bring SJ back injured requires a long post because as with all medical discussion it is a mixture of 'it depends' and a case by case basis.

Bear in mind that older players like Johnson on year by year contracts are judged medically in terms of their ready to play status differently than other staff. Compared to a young man you are signing for three or more years, someone you can park on the sideline and not worry about, Johnson is on a one year leash. Meaning his value to the organization is week by week and therefore someone you force to give you a good week here and there while they are in their potentially last ever season.

Ergo it makes zero sense to park someone like Johnson until they achieve perfect health if they only have potentially six months or less of football left in their legs (for medical reasons that will not change no matter whether you play him or not) you might as well run them injured and Nurse them through their injuries week by week and see how much juice you can get out of the tank.

And this week by week thing is very much where the management of Johnson has been since he returned to the Warriors. This is a guy who only had one season on his contract last year. Almost won Dally M and was only given one year after those heights....because our medicos are telling Webster he is going to fall apart no matter what the club does, father time is stalking him hard.

Lets remind ourselves that he was let go by the Sharks because he was older and suffering injuries.

And this is the exact same context in which the Sharks let Metcalf go.

While both players are at the opposite ends of their arc health and age wise, the Warriors medicos looked at their health history and signed off on trialing both 'medically retired' reject halves of the Sharks.

So consider the Sharks Medicos did not want to take on Metcalfs chronic hamstring injuries and consider that the Warriors medical unit got stuck into it boots and all.

In Metcalfs case the Warriors medicos employed a bio mechanics PHD to retrain him in his gait, his stride, the way he runs, the very thing the Sharks should have tried when Metcalf had that first hammy injury, but we took it on after multiple chronic problems and managed him onto the field, some will dismiss this and say the Sharks were right we are wrong, but as someone interested in health science, I find it incredible that we re trained a player from Australia into how to run.

Even if the Metcalf experiment fails, you can bank on him recommending the Warriors to any Shark that texts him in future about a Warriors offer they recieved.

Getting back to Johnson, since the start of last season the Warriors have been managing his groin injury (long term, will not go away no matter how much he rests or rehabs) this is why Johnson our best goal kicker is not allowed to kick goals.

The Warriors medicos deserve medals for working with that issue and banning his goal kicks, a success story in injury management that almost saw a player in their absolute last run of games almost win Dally M injured.

The Achilles Webster mentions with Shaun was picked up in preseason, so this is now a discussion about how our medicos are managing old legs with a permanent groin issue, and a ankle that is stuffed, yet they get him out there week in week out. So this should help fans understand why Webster has SJ playing in a relative dinner suit and bombing on the last like a robot...because Webster knows he has an old man with buggered legs who is still the best kicker in the Warriors Roster. I feel sorry for Webster that Fans think this sport is as simple as pick my player not yours coach.

The fact Webster wakes up to every day is that If SJ stops playing injured he will never pull on a Warriors jumper ever again.


All that aside, the medical case that is my all time favorite in following the Warriors is how they recovered Mitch Barnett who has a neck so bad that he is at risk of Quadriplegia, yet the Warriors nursed him back off a crusher and took their time (there were reports he bounced back right away, but the Warriors pulled him till they could run a full rehab assessment of his neck).

I have been the Warriors medical set ups biggest critic since 95. True story, I could rant about all the screw ups and medical mishap, it stuns me that a few players I saw did not sue the club.

SJ is being played because he is getting through three simple tests while injured, a speed metric, a strength metric, and a flexibility metric.

The Hamstring is a worry, not because it is a hamstring, but because Johnson has been playing on borrowed time for about three years.

Given everything we know it will be a miracle if Johnson ever plays in the NRL again.

lastly, you guys do realise that Doctors and NRL coaches ask patients if they are up to play first?

And that the patients feedback from that question is basically king...which is why your Doctor has let you go back to work when you wanted to and your doctor was not so keen?

There is no Universe where Shaun Johnson said he was not medically ready to go while carrying an injury and was forced to play by Andrew Webster. That crap happens at other clubs and the Warriors have been guilty of it in the past too.

But not anymore, the signs are all there that we have among the best Doctors, Physios, and dietitians in the NRL just now.
Love your explanation here. This is why fans aren't coaches lol

The week to week thing with SJ was known but they decided to let him play knowing his achilles isn't healed.
I get SJ is on limited time and they needed to get him game time, but it's still crazy to even risk him.

Perhaps the club should've waited for the foot to heal more or fully?

It makes zero sense to put a compromised player out there, senior or not, when weeks before the machine was humming nicely.

Whilst Webby and co have been pretty good with managing the players injuries this year, I feel they have let the team down by risking someone who's not fit.

This in fact has sealed his RL career IMHO, he won't come back in time and we will have better fit players winning for us.

I hope people are prepared for no SJ.
 

Meth

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
35,736
Would you stick with CHT/TMM for 2025?
Or do we sign up Brown or another established half that may become available?

Not sure.

I'd probably see Metcalf as our 6 as full strength.

I just know that Johnson's body has had it. Time to move on
 
Messages
2,961
Not sure.

I'd probably see Metcalf as our 6 as full strength.

I just know that Johnson's body has had it. Time to move on
Metcalf wants to be a half-back apparently.
I haven't seen a five-eight or a half-back in his game play.
He looks to me like a full back.
I think CHT / TMM will work better together.
Metcalf is an individual player like SJ, let them roam but not always the best fit for the whole team.

Other options to consider:

- Signing another established half from the NRL. (Dylan Brown etc.)
- Ronald Volkman.
- Juniors given a chance.
 
Messages
10,074
Yeah you are probably right, comes from the right place I think but poorly word. The 80 minutes doesn’t define me bit I understand what he means, but it can be construed as the passion not being there

the short ball Johnson reference is just strange lol
 

Leber

Bench
Messages
3,957
Bro should have a job with sky for life when he retires. Hes good at analysing and commentating.

Might be time for him to take the option up.
 

SpaceMonkey

Immortal
Messages
40,497
WTF did they bring SJ back if he's still injured? We didn't need him and if anything, it has costed us 4 points in this competition.

Webby gets a thumbs down for this.
We put 4 tries on Melbourne, attack didn’t lose us that one, defence did.
The Titans game was just a debacle and the entire team is culpable for that.
 

SpaceMonkey

Immortal
Messages
40,497
I don’t buy that he’s necessarily shot though. Look at Foran, he looked way more busted than SJ a few years back. SJ just needs to not be rushed back. And when he’s fit give him a warm up on NSW cup, and maybe play him off the bench.
 
Messages
794
I don’t buy that he’s necessarily shot though. Look at Foran, he looked way more busted than SJ a few years back. SJ just needs to not be rushed back. And when he’s fit give him a warm up on NSW cup, and maybe play him off the bench.
Agree but somehow, between him, Webster and the medical staff, it’s seems that’s exactly what happened and I’m struggling to understand why.

If the team had lost all 3 games while he was away, then I’d understand the gamble. Desperate times and all that.

But that obviously wasn’t the case and whoever made the call to bring him back before he was fully fit - acknowledging it may have actually been SJ himself as a senior player who’s entitled to have a say - hurt not just the team but SJ. And for no other reason than not trusting the guys who were already doing the business to keep doing it.

It’s hugely disappointing on so many fronts.
 

SpaceMonkey

Immortal
Messages
40,497
Agree but somehow, between him, Webster and the medical staff, it’s seems that’s exactly what happened and I’m struggling to understand why.

If the team had lost all 3 games while he was away, then I’d understand the gamble. Desperate times and all that.

But that obviously wasn’t the case and whoever made the call to bring him back before he was fully fit - acknowledging it may have actually been SJ himself as a senior player who’s entitled to have a say - hurt not just the team but SJ. And for no other reason than not trusting the guys who were already doing the business to keep doing it.

It’s hugely disappointing on so many fronts.
100%. But the buck stops with the head coach imo. Of course SJ wants to play. Players always do. How often did you used to see clearly concussed blokes playing on?
 
Messages
794
100%. But the buck stops with the head coach imo. Of course SJ wants to play. Players always do. How often did you used to see clearly concussed blokes playing on?
Yes totally, buck stops with the boss regardless. I only wonder whether, due to his relative inexperience as a head coach, Webby is allowing himself to be influenced by senior players' desires more than say, a Bellamy would. Not suggesting that's the case or trying to make excuses for him, only that its a possibility.
 

sup42

Juniors
Messages
2,466
TgWould you stick with CHT/TMM for 2025?
Or do we sign up Brown or another established half that may become available?
I would be really surprised if the Warriors were even an option for Brown. We offered him Boku bucks when he was still unproven and he was not interested.

Should we chase him? sure, dreams are free and he is a genuine upper mid ranged talented half of NRL quality, a thing that is becoming rarer, or thinner in this modern era.

I dunno what it is, why halves are so depleted in Rugby League, some would argue that it relates to the giant Polynesian teenagers treading the little battler Toovey type kids into the turf to the point where their parents pull them from under 16's for understandable health and safety reasons.

There was a time where old damaged slow halves like Johnson and Reynolds would be Superleague fodder on their ages alone, but in this dearth of talent they have become the Yoda's of this age by being among the only blokes that can consistently long kick a ball.

Whatever. Gone are the days where NZ had Gary Freeman and Clayton Friend genuinely fighting for one spot as top half in the Kiwis.

Now it is a situation of is our only genuine 7 fit and or available, otherwise we will use blokes in the fashion the Warriors are using TMM just now, out of position but capable, just pray they have the kicking game of their lives week in week out.

We are well set with child star halves in our lower grades but. (Cappy's work). As always we have to be patient and pray they stay Warriors.
 
Messages
794
I would be really surprised if the Warriors were even an option for Brown. We offered him Boku bucks when he was still unproven and he was not interested.
From memory it wasn’t Brown turning down the club, it was George having to withdraw the offer because somehow O’Sullivan misinterpreted Brown’s contract situation and made the offer before he was allowed to. Unless there was more to it than was reported at the time.
 

Meth

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
35,736
We are well set with child star halves in our lower grades but. (Cappy's work). As always we have to be patient and pray they stay Warriors.

or wait until they start to show some promise and then send them to the storm in exchange for a bag of beans
 

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