The 2013 World Cup Thread

[Poupou Escobar]

I didn't see Mossop play but his stats show that he wasn't used as a front rower.

40 minutes, 4 hitups, 31 metres, 26 tackles.

That's only one hit up every 10 minutes.

Other English props:
T. Burgess: One hitup every 3.6 minutes
Hill: Hitup every 4.1 minutes
G. Burgess: Hitup every 5.1 minutes

Mossop's stats show he played more like a lock. Sam Burgess made a hitup every 7.3 minutes. Considering Big Sam played 80 minutes, this suggests that while Mossop was on the field, Sam Burgess joined the prop rotation. Or England played with two locks.

This is backed up by Mossop's defensive workrate:
Mossop: 0.73 attempted tackles per minute
Hill: 0.54 at/minute
G. Burgess: 0.50 at/minute
T. Burgess: 0.48 at/minute
S. Burgess: 0.45 at/minute

The other four English tight forwards all hovered around the standard prop workrate figure of an attempted tackle every two minutes, whereas Mossop was attempting almost three every four minutes; an increase of about 50% on the others.

It's pretty fair to say Lee Mossop isn't your out and out yardage prop. He is more of a worker (i.e. lock), in the mould of Lussick and Allgood, and I'd say we'll mostly be going with two of these on the field with one yardage monster (Mannah, Paulo). This is good for your defence, but means that if the prop doesn't get a quick play-the-ball you need to make your next hit up on one of the edges and hope to generate some ruck speed there. Hopefully Nathan Peats is able to help our tight forwards avoid being gang tackled.

We'll also be relying on our fullback and wingers to start our exit sets well.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

One can never have too many undersized prop forwards.

Like Moa and O'Donnell?

You can get away with some lighter forwards in the middle. Especially if you have some monsters around them (e.g. JWH and FPN). Anyway, Mossop (and Lussick and Allgood) are all about the same size as the Manly front rowers King and Kite, and bigger than Brenton Lawrence. Mannah is about the same size as Fa'aoso. Our only truly big forward is Junior Paulo, but Manly's only monster is George Rose. They also have a midget lock in Anthony Watmough.

I reckon we have enough size. Our only undersized tight forwards are Terepo and Moimoi, and they're both very quick and powerful. I doubt we would have them both on the field at once.

 

[Gary Gutful]

How many farts did Mossop do per minute stats boy?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Mate, if you can find where they've listed his total farts, I can divide it by minutes played.

#teamwork

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Like Moa and O'Donnell?

You can get away with some lighter forwards in the middle. Especially if you have some monsters around them (e.g. JWH and FPN). Anyway, Mossop (and Lussick and Allgood) are all about the same size as the Manly front rowers King and Kite, and bigger than Brenton Lawrence. Mannah is about the same size as Fa'aoso. Our only truly big forward is Junior Paulo, but Manly's only monster is George Rose. They also have a midget lock in Anthony Watmough.

I reckon we have enough size. Our only undersized tight forwards are Terepo and Moimoi, and they're both very quick and powerful. I doubt we would have them both on the field at once.

The operative clause in my post was 'too many'....not 'any' ;-)

And in the interest of clarity:
Lee Mossop = 103kgs 185cm

Jason King = 111kgs 192cm

Kite = 110kgs 190cm

 

[Poupou Escobar]

The operative clause in my post was 'too many'....not 'any' ;-)

And in the interest of clarity:
Lee Mossop = 103kgs 185cm

Jason King = 111kgs 192cm

Kite = 110kgs 190cm

I agree with King and Kite's figures, but Mossop look bigger than that. Here's his official numbers:

Lee Mossop = 110kg 185cm

Brent Kite = 111kg 193cm

Jason King = 111kg 191cm

The reliability of official figures aside, Mossop is shorter than Kite and King but slightly more solid.

Here's the official figures for:

Matthew Scott = 106kg 185cm

Now, I'm certain Scott is at least 110kg, but his height is the same as listed for Mossop. Obviously Mossop doesn't run the ball as hard; we can see that through observation. But he's not undersized.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

I agree with King and Kite's figures, but Mossop look bigger than that. Here's his official numbers:

Lee Mossop = 110kg 185cm

Brent Kite = 111kg 193cm

Jason King = 111kg 191cm

The reliability of official figures aside, Mossop is shorter than Kite and King but slightly more solid.

Here's the official figures for:

Matthew Scott = 106kg 185cm

Now, I'm certain Scott is at least 110kg, but his height is the same as listed for Mossop. Obviously Mossop doesn't run the ball as hard; we can see that through observation. But he's not undersized.

I reckon Mossop must have eaten some weet bix (or maybe bricks) before that weight in!
PS: The ERL site has him at 104kgs, and this is for the current cup squad members.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Plenty of players lose weight by the end of the season. And if he's playing lock he might have decided/been instructed to lose a few kilos to help his workrate.

I guess we'll see how big Brad Arthur's wants him to be when he appears in our jersey next pre-season.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Don't get me wrong I think he'll go ok. Just not sure he's the sort of player we were that short of, but who knows?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

I agree, it would have been better to get another monster. George Burgess would have been nice, but hopefully between Mannah and Paulo we can get it done.

I doubt Paulo is ready for 20+ NRL games next year but you never know. And the best running props tend to be ordinary defenders.

 

[I bleed blue & gold]

I didn't think Lee looked that small, he certainly wasn't huge either.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

He seems to me to be a fairly average sized front rower, but I haven't seen him since the ESL decider.

 

[Sensai Cobra]

So I watched the game and yes Mossop was underwhelming. Didn't seem to have much involvement and lacked impact when he did. Lacks aggression also. He is big enough

All up very disappointing.

Watching wales v Italy at the moment, so far Santi has been fantastic. He's a real workhorse, often makes 2-3 tackles in a row and always involved in attack, plays as a first receiver quite a bit. He seems to be doing a lot of talking, looks as though he' a leader.

Obviously a big gap in quality between the two games but Santi looks a great prospect, the jury is still very much out on Mossop.

 

[Sensai Cobra]

I'd love to know the stats from the Wales Italy game, Santi's involvement is huge.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

http://live.nrlstats.com/matches/nrl/match25397.html

Santi came second in the Italian tackle count to Mark Minichiello (by one tackle) but I suspect he played a lot less minutes.

 

[Sensai Cobra]

Cheers

 

[Sensai Cobra]

http://live.nrlstats.com/matches/nrl/match25397.html

Santi came second in the Italian tackle count to Mark Minichiello (by one tackle) but I suspect he played a lot less minutes.

Came on around the 20min mark

 

[Poupou Escobar]

I dare say Minichiello played 80 minutes at edge forward.

Anyway, Santi did well. Five one-on-ones (and none missed) is very good. Did he play in the middle or on the edge?

 

[Sensai Cobra]

I dare say Minichiello played 80 minutes at edge forward.

Anyway, Santi did well. Five one-on-ones (and none missed) is very good. Did he play in the middle or on the edge?

Mark minichello played on the right, pretty sure he played 80.

Santi played in the middle. He was talking a lot and seemed to calling the plays. He played as a link for the forwards in attack.

He went off around the 60 min mark.

For a guy his age was impressed that it seemed he was taking control and barking instructions. Looks like a leader.

 

[Runaround Man]

I generally agree with your thoughts re: Mossop, but what I did like about him was the fact that he seemed to just fit in with the team around him. I think he will be a good team man. When watching him he reminded me a little bit of Ian Hindmarsh.
If he turns out to be anything like hm I will be happy