The off-field issues bringing down crowds

[adamkungl]

Big talk about TV deals in the squillions at the moment but unfortunately more cash will only be a paper band solution to the NRL's problems at the moment.

Don't get me wrong, this isn't a Rothfield-esque NRL IN #CRISIS bitch. The game is going strong in a lot of areas but the thing HQ should be concerned about is why crowds aren't rising at the same time.

The first step is addressing the rulebook and refereeing issues, but I already made a thread looking at the on-field stuff, so I'll skip over that.

One of the big issues is the fan mood. Enthusiastic, positive fans turn up in droves. Disillusioned, negative fans find other things to do. NRL seems to have fallen a couple of notches down the priority list for a lot of fans in the last couple of years. Conversation is too focused in the negative.

The NRL needs to change the tone of conversation. Asking fans "Hey guys stop complaining about refs and stuff" obviously isn't going to cut it. So two things need to actually happen -

1) Flex some muscle in the media, particularly with the game's broadcasters. Censoring fair criticism is not the way to go, but there needs to be an expectation that part of the role of the major broadcast partner is to positively promote the NRL.
The quality and tone of Rabs and Gould's commentary is terrible. I'd argue that these two clowns are causing more damage to the game than any amount of off field player discretions.
The unjustified attacks on the NRL by ACA and Nine's News need to end.
The best way for the NRL to deal with this is to make it quite clear that these kind of factors will be strongly considered in the next broadcast deal.

2) Address the major criticisms and clearly communicate how they are doing it.

There is a growing perception of poor refereeing and the game going soft - as I said earlier these are an issue for another thread but it needs to be addressed in some way.

Shorter, smarter, season. Ditch the extra games that are dragging down the crowd averages. Chop a month off the length of the season. Use the extra time for standalone rep weekends so Origin doesn't cripple the club comp. Schedule games for crowds rather than TV - people are always going to watch TV footy regardless of who is playing. The same doesn't apply for showing up and buying a ticket. Monday night is a bust unless its a public holiday. Thursday night will be no better once the initial novelty wears off.

Ticket prices. You can't charge $40-70 a ticket if you aren't even half filling up your stadium. Some clubs need to take a chance on a supply and demand system of ticket pricing. It's ridiculous that we're still having the same conversation 10-20 years later about how much tickets cost. Furthermore the NRL, now flush with cash, could subsidise clubs to help them lower their prices.

Expansion. A successful expansion can bring a big morale boost for the game, freshen up the competition, bring in new revenue streams and kill the perception of an East-coast/Sydney-centric game.

Similarly, internationals. That month chopped off the season I mentioned earlier? Fill it with interesting international matches. It might take a while to reap the rewards here but someone needs to look long term. In the internet age the NRL isn't just competing with Union and AFL. Overseas football codes are big business here and often provide a better fan experience. We need our international game competitive. A successful international tournament can provide a wave of positivity for the next season.


The gist of it is this - the NRL needs to turn the fan conversation around. There needs to be more good, exciting things happening than negative shit. Drown it out with positive steps forward. Make the most newsworthy story every week something great for the NRL rather than another disaster.

 

[LineBall]

If they broadcast every game live in the new deal. Expect crowds to stagnate or even get worse. Having matches scheduled to suit TV networks, and playing too much at night will not help either.

They really need to add more teams and enable them to play two matches live at the same time, while broadcasting them live into different markets.

 

[adamkungl]

If they broadcast every game live in the new deal. Expect crowds to stagnate or even get worse. Having matches scheduled to suit TV networks, and playing too much at night will not help either.

They really need to add more teams and enable them to play two matches live at the same time, while broadcasting them live into different markets.

To go into the internet streaming age without every game accessible live would be utter insanity - despite the effect on crowds it might have.

The best way we can tackle it is by controlling the scheduling. 4 day games a week and Monday night f**ked off or somehow improved.

 

[Juju]

Big talk about TV deals in the squillions at the moment but unfortunately more cash will only be a paper band solution to the NRL's problems at the moment.

Don't get me wrong, this isn't a Rothfield-esque NRL IN #CRISIS bitch. The game is going strong in a lot of areas but the thing HQ should be concerned about is why crowds aren't rising at the same time.

The first step is addressing the rulebook and refereeing issues, but I already made a thread looking at the on-field stuff, so I'll skip over that.

One of the big issues is the fan mood. Enthusiastic, positive fans turn up in droves. Disillusioned, negative fans find other things to do. NRL seems to have fallen a couple of notches down the priority list for a lot of fans in the last couple of years. Conversation is too focused in the negative.

The NRL needs to change the tone of conversation. Asking fans "Hey guys stop complaining about refs and stuff" obviously isn't going to cut it. So two things need to actually happen -

1) Flex some muscle in the media, particularly with the game's broadcasters. Censoring fair criticism is not the way to go, but there needs to be an expectation that part of the role of the major broadcast partner is to positively promote the NRL.
The quality and tone of Rabs and Gould's commentary is terrible. I'd argue that these two clowns are causing more damage to the game than any amount of off field player discretions.
The unjustified attacks on the NRL by ACA and Nine's News need to end.
The best way for the NRL to deal with this is to make it quite clear that these kind of factors will be strongly considered in the next broadcast deal.

2) Address the major criticisms and clearly communicate how they are doing it.

There is a growing perception of poor refereeing and the game going soft - as I said earlier these are an issue for another thread but it needs to be addressed in some way.

Shorter, smarter, season. Ditch the extra games that are dragging down the crowd averages. Chop a month off the length of the season. Use the extra time for standalone rep weekends so Origin doesn't cripple the club comp. Schedule games for crowds rather than TV - people are always going to watch TV footy regardless of who is playing. The same doesn't apply for showing up and buying a ticket. Monday night is a bust unless its a public holiday. Thursday night will be no better once the initial novelty wears off.

Ticket prices. You can't charge $40-70 a ticket if you aren't even half filling up your stadium. Some clubs need to take a chance on a supply and demand system of ticket pricing. It's ridiculous that we're still having the same conversation 10-20 years later about how much tickets cost. Furthermore the NRL, now flush with cash, could subsidise clubs to help them lower their prices.

Expansion. A successful expansion can bring a big morale boost for the game, freshen up the competition, bring in new revenue streams and kill the perception of an East-coast/Sydney-centric game.

Similarly, internationals. That month chopped off the season I mentioned earlier? Fill it with interesting international matches. It might take a while to reap the rewards here but someone needs to look long term. In the internet age the NRL isn't just competing with Union and AFL. Overseas football codes are big business here and often provide a better fan experience. We need our international game competitive. A successful international tournament can provide a wave of positivity for the next season.


The gist of it is this - the NRL needs to turn the fan conversation around. There needs to be more good, exciting things happening than negative shit. Drown it out with positive steps forward. Make the most newsworthy story every week something great for the NRL rather than another disaster.

Great post - a lot to mull over

 

[Babyface O'reilly]

While there's a lot of contributing factors that effect crowds, scheduling is the biggest concern for me. According to Big Sports Breakfast (grain of salt?) $1.7 billion is one of the figures being trotted out for the next TV deal. Unfortunately, figures like that means the networks are going to make demands as far as the draw/fixtures are concerned and apparently having permanent Thursday night matches in place of Monday night is one of the proposals.

Given that the NRL are in a pissing contest with the AFL, I can't see them taking less money in exchange for more control on how the season draws out. I think the game will enjoy better outcomes in the long run if they did. Empty seats is never a good look.

 

[Card Shark]

IMO, TV is the greatest killer of crowds.

So much easier to watch it live in your own home & not have to fight traffic & cues.

It will never change unless the NRL takes a big cut in revenue....it will never change.

 

[Canard]

While there's a lot of contributing factors that effect crowds, scheduling is the biggest concern for me. According to Big Sports Breakfast (grain of salt?) $1.7 billion is one of the figures being trotted out for the next TV deal. Unfortunately, figures like that means the networks are going to make demands as far as the draw/fixtures are concerned and apparently having permanent Thursday night matches in place of Monday night is one of the proposals.

Given that the NRL are in a pissing contest with the AFL, I can't see them taking less money in exchange for more control on how the season draws out. I think the game will enjoy better outcomes in the long run if they did. Empty seats is never a good look.

Do you seriously think the major reason for getting more money into the game, would be "lets beat the AFL"???

 

[proto]

I'm not someone who has some blind hate for Gus Gould and i rarely watch Friday games with the sound on being out at a bar usually, so having a quiet one this last Friday i sat down and had the commentary on. Ive seen a lot of pretty terrible, dire League recently but this game was an absolute cracker and had everything really. So when I'm hearing Gus moan, whinge and throw toys out of the pram about things that weren't hugely important at all i was quite amazed. Also the BS, back and forth, 'comedy duo' schtick with Ray Warren has to be some of the worst shit I've ever heard. Do they think this is a good idea ? Do the 9 higher ups give the thumbs up when they hear this rollicking banter

To the point, how is the only FTA broadcaster allowed to just piss on its product ? i watch a lot of different sports from all over the globe and while no one wants smoke blown up their arse, there really is nothing like this going on anywhere. It totally breeds a culture of 'how crap were the refs aye" rather than "how great was that game?" I hear it everywhere and hardly anyone i know that isn't an absolute diehard has pretty much not gone to a game this season or the last few and guess what i hear them say on Monday morning or Saturday night. "how crap were the refs aye"

 

[MarkC]

I think the scheduling of games at night on a work day is a factor.
It can be hard to get from work to Friday night games for some fans, Monday night is a time that doesn't suit many fans.

In winter, Sunday afternoon is a time that suits many fans.
By expanding the comp, we could have more games, per round and that would allow more Sunday afternoon games.

You then need to look at other factors, transport, parking, food, costs, game day experience etc.

On thing I've noticed is it can take 1 hour to get out of a car park after some games, the reason is all fans leave at the same time.
You might be able to stagger that by having an after match function, or a lower grade game after the NRL game.

 

[Babyface O'reilly]

Do you seriously think the major reason for getting more money into the game, would be "lets beat the AFL"???

An exaggeration of course but I do remember a lot of 'AFL gets 1billion, so should we' banter on the the lead up to negotiations. I think it was at least a factor for a brand new CEO that wants to make his mark on a game he knows bugger all about.

 

[POPEYE]

Only good thing about the central west NSW being denied their own team is that supporters can drink and be merry all they like without inconvenience and not feel guilty. Would be no surprise to us if more country people per capita watch League than city slickers

 

[Canard]

An exaggeration of course but I do remember a lot of 'AFL gets 1billion, so should we' banter on the the lead up to negotiations. I think it was at least a factor for a brand new CEO that wants to make his mark on a game he knows bugger all about.

That was more on LU then the real world though, and lets face it LU isn't the real world by a long long margin.

 

[some11]

Could just be me but for the last couple of years I've felt the regular season is too long, there's so many nothing games around Origin time as teams really only start to ramp things up in the weeks leading up to the finals.

 

[gUt]

IMO, TV is the greatest killer of crowds.

So much easier to watch it live in your own home & not have to fight traffic & cues.

It will never change unless the NRL takes a big cut in revenue....it will never change.

Playing games in large stadiums is a shit look, we should forget that approach. I think the way forward is to embrace the change to TV/internet viewing, move most games to boutique grounds and/or specialized TV studio grounds, and/or have more derby/festival weekends where several games are played back to back etc.

 

[Red Bear]

None of the above mentioned game day experience, which IMO could be improved.

I know people scoff at Locky/others who whinge about beer, but it's enjoyable to be able to drink a nice beer at the footy, particularly after playing an exhorbinant amount for a ticket or beer. I can easily go without, don't get me wrong, but at present the attitude on game day is one of "here is a game of footy. This is all that is needed, so lets not worry about anything else."

So you don't get great value of money out of your ticket, particularly if you aren't a dyed in the wool fan. I, of course, am just happy to be at the footy, but many casuals who pay a bunch for a ticket then are faced with a terrible range of food and drink options all at ridiculous prices, it doesn't sell the game to them at all. Gameday experience can be improved big time.

How scheduling goes with the new deal will be interesting. If it is still eight games, spread Thursday to Sunday with three games saturday/sunday, will one of the sunday games be a night match? I think Thursday is better than monday, but not much better.

I like the idea of better promotion of internationals, lopping a month off the season. Both pretty sensible.

 

[2010Dragons]

If the Dragons are not winning then the NRL crowds are always low. Check your history...its a fact !
Dragons make the eight, win premiership the crowd number go thru roof !!!
2009,2010 highest crowd numbers.
Sydney fans are not interest to follow the game if cowboys and broncos are leading.

 

[adamkungl]

None of the above mentioned game day experience, which IMO could be improved.

I know people scoff at Locky/others who whinge about beer, but it's enjoyable to be able to drink a nice beer at the footy, particularly after playing an exhorbinant amount for a ticket or beer. I can easily go without, don't get me wrong, but at present the attitude on game day is one of "here is a game of footy. This is all that is needed, so lets not worry about anything else."

So you don't get great value of money out of your ticket, particularly if you aren't a dyed in the wool fan. I, of course, am just happy to be at the footy, but many casuals who pay a bunch for a ticket then are faced with a terrible range of food and drink options all at ridiculous prices, it doesn't sell the game to them at all. Gameday experience can be improved big time.

How scheduling goes with the new deal will be interesting. If it is still eight games, spread Thursday to Sunday with three games saturday/sunday, will one of the sunday games be a night match? I think Thursday is better than monday, but not much better.

I like the idea of better promotion of internationals, lopping a month off the season. Both pretty sensible.

Yep forgot that one. Though it's more of a club responsibility than NRL to an extent.

How would you improve the game day experience, aside from lowering ticket and food prices?

Let's be honest, no one gives a f**k about the occasional band they drag up and any attempt at entertainment usually ends up worse than cheergirls and junior footy. I've got nothing here.

 

[LineBall]

^ Game day experience is a big part of the puzzle. They really need a concerted effort to tackle all aspects to get more people from their homes to the game.

 

[Canard]

I know people scoff at Locky/others who whinge about beer, but it's enjoyable to be able to drink a nice beer at the footy, particularly after playing an exhorbinant amount for a ticket or beer. I can easily go without, don't get me wrong, but at present the attitude on game day is one of "here is a game of footy. This is all that is needed, so lets not worry about anything else."

Gameday Experience for sure including all Food and Drink prices should be reviewed, not just beer. But that is only a small part of it

Beer especially is only appealing to a small segment of the market, i.e 18 to 40 year old males who want to go and drink warm beer at a sporting contest. And are happy to miss half of it whilst they stand in line for more beers or a piss.

The game needs to broaden its appeal beyond that.

I know this is a pretty niche thing also, but I love going to the game with the Sports Ears on. The experience is far better than TV for mine, as you can observe the entire field and hear what the referre and TV commentators are saying. Maybe these should be made available to all members??

 

[Last Week]

I can't help but feel that game day experience is a big responsibility of the fans. It's not something that clubs and the NRL can just set up and the fans should expect to suddenly go to the game and be amazed and instantly hooked.

I can't help but go back to the NFL and their tailgate parties. Now, I don't expect something like that for the NRL because we're different. However, atmosphere is very important and that's something I feel we need to work on. Not jumping castles, not stupid on field races with 4 fans, no bands, etc etc.

I don't know what the answer is because I find Australian sports fans, especially Rugby League, to be very fickle.