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To all the Kiwi fans.

Twizzle

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
151,597
In light of your current sucess.

Where do you rate the Kiwi's teams world ranking in test cricket, and ODI cricket.

Some brief justification please.
 

Dr Crane

Live Update Team
Messages
19,531
#3 or 4 in tests. Considering performance in past 10+ tests, excluding one batting collapse in the second test vs Pakis. However, if ICC gave us a real test series New Zealand could have drawn the series or even come back to win it.

ODI...Jury still out. Can perform at times (vs South Africa at WC) but can fall apart horribly (Aussie at World Cup). I won't bother to rate yet...
 

ozbash

Referee
Messages
26,922
if we beat the boks in the odi,s i reckon around 3

if we beat the boks in the tests i reckon 2 or 3 , closer to 2 than 3.

there is an air of confidence about our team and a lot of it is thanks to john bracewell.

when ritson was our coach was the last time i felt like that..

time will tell though.
 

Anonymous

Juniors
Messages
46
In tests we were 3 for a long time. Optimistically I would still have us there but the loss to Pakistan was a set back. ATM the official rankings have us about 5 (I think) and I'll accept that.

In ODIs, in all honesty we are about 6th. We haven't performed in one-dayers for a while. We are behind Australia, South Africa, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, and India. I would put us above WI, England and Zimbabwe.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
I think one day cricket we need some serious improvement. There were signs of it for sure in the Pakistan series - recent history has shown New Zealand falling down in a lot of one dayers due to two elements - fielding, and running between the wickets. I'd estimate the difference per match in advantage to the Kiwis over the Pakistanis was 40 runs from these two skills. New Zealand were sublime. Can't say enough for the philosophy John Bracewell - who's a successful one day coach with Gloucestershire - has brought to the Black Caps. I think we're about 7th/8th in the rankings, one day players like Astle, Bond, Fleming, Styris, Oram, Tuffey, to go along with the fielding and running between the sticks under Bracewell should push us up to the top 3. From recent matches, we've been close to nailing Australia on a handful of occasions, but its been those fundamental areas, and Michael Bevan that has got Australia over the line. We're close to being on a level with Australia in the field and running now, I suspect one or two of those close games would in the current situation go NZ's way.

The test side is always pretty well performed, especially at home. Very rarely beaten at home. Away, we fight hard but probably lack a real dynamo to take us over the line sometimes. About 4th in the world is fair enough. We have a real gusty opener in Mark Richardson, and his fight goes through the rest of the top order. Fleming is in extremely good form, and Oram and Tuffey are both taller 6'6" and bowl a good line and length. Vettori is coming good with the bat, out of form with the ball. As soon as he's back, the attack would look settled.

The other good thing currently about NZC is the past two seasons has thrown up a lot of good promising cricketers. Players you may hear more of are Peter Fulton, Hamish Marshall, Michael Papps, Tim McIntosh, Rob Nicol, Ross Taylor. We have very high hopes for them, most of whom have come through the recently formed New Zealand cricket academy under Dayle Hadlee.
 

bayrep

Juniors
Messages
2,112
I think we still rank 3rd in Test and only about 8th ODI. Which I think is pretty acurate for the amount of ODI's we have lost over the last 18 months.
 

salivor

First Grade
Messages
9,804
We're definetly in the top 4 for tests and have been consistantly for a number of years now.

In ODI's, I think the biggest problem is our batting. Bring back Bond into the bowling mix and we can knock over any side in the world with Tuffey bowling line and length from the other end. But batting is more important than ever in ODI's and it's only going to go further down the track with Australia getting rid of the consume period and hitting hard right throughout an innings now. The NZ batting lineup has the potential but I don't think mentally and in terms of players taking responsibility that we are up to the level of most ODI sides at the moment.
 

Anonymous

Juniors
Messages
46
recent history has shown New Zealand falling down in a lot of one dayers due to two elements - fielding, and running between the wickets.

Maybe, although as far back as I can remember we've always been one of the best fielding sides going around.
 
Messages
12,402
We're better than India.

I'd put us at 2nd in tests...if we had a fully fit side including our two best players...which we dont at the moment. And havent for quite some time now. So that would drop us down to 3rd.

One Dayers we're inconsistent. But I'd say 4th maybe.
 

Anonymous

Juniors
Messages
46
India :roll:

How are we not better than them (at tests) when we murdered them last summer at home and outplayed them 2 months ago away? How about the fact that we didn't lose a test series for over 3 years while they are hopeless away from home against anyone but Australia?
 

Anonymous

Juniors
Messages
46
I'd love to know how, at least as far as PWC is concerned, it can be that Jake Oram is your best ODI bowler? Even with Bond out I'd have him behind Tuffey and Vettori.

He's allright but nothing special.
 

salivor

First Grade
Messages
9,804
Oram on the surface just looks like your average medium pace bowler but being a tall man he gets quite a bit of bounce and has managed to consistantly take wickets as well as having a very good economy rate. Time has told that it wasn't just the green pitches that made him look good against the Indians last year.

Daniel Vettori is going through a very tough time with NZ pitches being unfriendly to spinners and having to change his action after the back problems in 2000. He's well down on what he's proved that he's capable of.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
Aside from the Indian tour where he had a virus I believe, Oram's been our best ODI bowler for the past season or so. Damn tall alright. He was decent in South Africa, and performs fine at home on tailor made tracks.

I certaintly can't make out how we could be behind India given the absolute hiding we gave them at home. And the fact we drew with them and probably should have beaten them in India. Considering they haven't won a series outside of India since the mid 80's or whatever it is, they are certainly not above New Zealand for mine. You have to have the ability to take 20 wickets in a match, and I don't think their current attack consistently has that. If its due to their performance in Australia, New Zealand drew their last test series in Australia and beat Australia out of the World Series finals.

3rd=with Pakistan in test cricket, 7-8th currently in ODIs but I can sense an upward slope on that.
 
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