Trade Ivan to Penrith for 2019

Discussion in 'Wests Tigers' started by Mario chalmers, Sep 19, 2018.

  1. Mario chalmers

    Mario chalmers Juniors

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    WT need the following
    - clarity around their coaching situation
    - injection of new talent (up to 5 spots available on the roster according to some)

    Penrith need the following
    - Ivan to come sooner rather than later because nobody wants the Penrith role as caretaker for 2 seasons
    - Salary Cap relief. Nathan is signing a huge contract that I would think includes an upgrade for 2019.

    WT bargaining power is actually quite strong. They can a) hold Ivan to his contract or b) come to an agreement with Penrith now. Tigers can get more in terms of compensation the sooner they start negotiations with Penrith. If they wait until the end of 2019 they will find Penrith have already started shedding talent and Panthers incentive to trade with the Tigers is reduced because they will get Ivan in 12 months anyway.

    With all of that in mind:

    To Penrith
    Ivan

    To Tigers
    Ciraldo (New WT Head Coach)
    Jarome Luai
    Tamou

    In my view, the Tigers must insist on getting Ciraldo in exchange. It puts a lot of heat on Gus and Penrith if we insist on getting him. Ciraldo gets rave reviews from everyone who has played under him. If the Tigers install another coach and then Gus Gould gets off scott free.

    Name what you think is a fair trade?
     
  2. Tiger05

    Tiger05 First Grade

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    Waqa Blake would be perfect. Luai would be really good as well. Tamou would be a good option as well especially if we aren't footing the entire bill.

    My take though is to just relax and either keep IC here or get a good deal.
     
  3. Vic Mackey

    Vic Mackey Coach

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    They can take Ivan but also have to take Rochow, McQueen and Benji.

    In return they give us Kikau, Blake and Aqua Golf.
     
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  4. Das Hassler

    Das Hassler Juniors

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    Ciraldo...no..it's one thing coaching guys youve known for awhile...quite another to take control at a new club when you dont bring an earned reputation..either as a coach or former player. Could you imagine Farah?....It would be JT Act 2.
    I'd be happy enough to just have Gould dance on the NRL float in a pair of Tiger stripe undies at this year's Mardi Gras if that would get it all done.
     
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  5. Das Hassler

    Das Hassler Juniors

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    We dont want players who didnt want to come...they're not machines..attitude produces results good and bad.
    Money is emotionless and gives 100%....take the money and throw it at THE best coaching option that ticks all the boxes
     
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  6. Tiger Ted

    Tiger Ted Juniors

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    ....Madge is the obvious coach for us to target & would turn us into a contender.Great coach & very savvy recruiter & talent identifier.

    Our fertile(currently infertile) & under-achieving west’s junior region has been dormant for a while & Madge would address what’s required to optimise our junior development.
     
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  7. Vozzy

    Vozzy Juniors

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    The agenda to coach his son needed to be put forward by Ivan before we signed him. I agree best option would be to part ways now if the rumors are true. If he signs for panthers 2021 then the 2020 season will be a right off when it should be the true reflection whether he turned the club around I always think it's the 3rd year when a clubs in a rebuild you can tell if it's working that would be 2020 but his while focus will be with Penrith by then.

    As a fan I don't really feel let down anymore contracts don't mean much anymore. The club has given away players who were good players that wanted to stay so it has happened both ways. Just shows that there is still a bad reputation at the club where players/coaches think it's a short term point in their career.

    I would give Brett Hodgson a shot. Ivan has put the club in a direction at least and Hodgson is the one under him. The way Hodgson played he should be easy to play for. I think teams who go with someone new with fresh ideas seem to have success like roosters and Souths. A coach who has been part of the mary go round seem to always be lost for ideas.

    The walker brothers could be something fresh aswell.
     
  8. Shredder

    Shredder Juniors

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    Im a no for Ciraldo - hes coached what 5 first grade games?

    Surely even we could do better than that.
     
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  9. Tiger05

    Tiger05 First Grade

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    Money gives us nothing. Yes we don't want players that don't want to come but I bet players want to come if they get a pay rise. Surely we can work something out that improves our squad.
     
  10. Das Hassler

    Das Hassler Juniors

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    You know who Guss would give us...
    THE most problematic player or players they have.. ...you can bet on that
     
  11. Tiger05

    Tiger05 First Grade

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    Gus shouldn't get to choose. We need to make a deal that is beneficial for us. If not no deal. In my opinion it's a good situation to be in.
     
  12. GongPanther

    GongPanther Coach

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    I'm certain Cleary won't be leaving until his contract ends with the WT. Ideally,I myself wouldn't want the WT progress to be stunted if he was released earlier then anticipated. It simply would be a bad look all round for Ivan and an unsporting move from the Panthers club.

    As long as Nathan Cleary is staying put,that is Penrith's ultimate goal ATM.
     
  13. Tiger Woody

    Tiger Woody Juniors

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    Fat 4 chins Gould would give us Merrin or that useless bearded prop Tamou....
     
  14. Tiger Woody

    Tiger Woody Juniors

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    Hodgo is too raw..has to pay his dues in ISP Cup for mine.
    They had a very good side on the field in ISP at times in 2018 and still lost those games...poor mid defence and bad discipline.
     
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  15. super_coach

    super_coach Bench

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    Now really what quality player is going to leave the Penrith for us????You May get a kid who is road blocked but you will never get a regular top 17 player. You have to remember Penrith just can’t say to a player...your off to the Tigers.
     
  16. TheFrog

    TheFrog Coach

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    You keep Ivan, we keep our players. That is a fair trade.
     
  17. Blues Riff

    Blues Riff Juniors

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    You guys have been all warm and fuzzy for the last year about the Clearys working together. You've fantasised about Nathan breaking his contract to be with dad. Now the tables seem to have turned you're all full of outrage.
    Personally I don't care if Ivan ever goes to Penrith. I don't think Nathan ever considered a move to Wests. Contrarary to popular myth, Gould had minimal involvement in the discussions between Ivan and his mate O'niell.
    The Penrith board are happy with Ciraldo,as are the playing group ,including it seems, Nathan Cleary. As far as players for compensation goes, we have two available - Jack Shit and Sweet Fanny Adams
     
  18. Vic Mackey

    Vic Mackey Coach

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    I’ve said plenty of times I didn’t want Nathan, not because I don’t rate him, but because our halves aren’t our problem. Spending $1mil on a half, any half, would IMO make us a weaker side. We would be much better off buying a strike center/winger and a rep level forward.

    However I don’t want to lose Ivan, I believe he is the perfect coach for us with where we are as club atm. If he stays here for the next 2 years, puts in as he has been and the team continues to improve then I would wish him all the best if he decides to leave.
     
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  19. BrotherJim05

    BrotherJim05 Juniors

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    I'm no expert in these matters but I don't think it simply works in a way that you can trade players like you can in other sports i.e. Baseball.

    Lets say all this speculation is true, we can't just say "okay Player's X and Y, you guys are now Tigers players. I know you had plans to stay in Penrith the next X years but we've made a decision and you have no say. Oh, but please make sure you play your absolute best and give your all for the team"

    The only way this could work is IF, the Penrith players were willing to move, and given our abysmal record over the past 8 years I doubt we would get anyone good.

    On top of this, we shouldn't be asking for Ciraldo. We need a coach that can deliver a Premiership and Mcguire can do this
     
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  20. soc123_au

    soc123_au Coach

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    I hope its all bullshit & Ivan stays where he is. He has done a great job so far with the rebuild as he did rebuilding us. He should stay & see it through. We should sign Ciraldo for next year & see how he goes, Then revisit the Ivan thing when it is reasonable contract wise to do so.

    If it isnt bullshit then you guys are in a no win situation. You cant keep a coach who has his eyes elsewhere. Gus isnt stupid & knows this. There is no way you get a player he wants to keep out of this. Ivan signs with us for 21 but honours his current contract you cant do anything to pressure or hurt him. In the meantime you sign no one because the future is too cloudy. Or you take it in the ass and negotiate the best way you can f**k him off now & not have to pay out his contract, you know you cant afford it & if the team isnt performing then the rebuild is behind another 3 years minimum. Let him go & pick up Madge or Toovey is about the best result you will get. Maybe you might get Merrin, but right now that would be helping us even more.

    Personally I was pissed when Ivan got the chop. I like him as a coach. But I do feel sorry for the Tigers out of this, after being shit for so long & then seeing some light, to have all this transpire is pretty bitter. I do think Madge would keep things on track though. I feel less sorry for those fans that were flogging themselves about getting Nathan to get a release to go to the tigers, that would have been shitty for us.

    The only positive is that hopefully this situation gives @Tiger Woody a brain tumour and he is unable to operate a keyboard, mouse or dictate to a carer. I think we could all take solace in that.
     

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