USE IT OR LOSE IT is officially dead (and other broadcast issues)

[Knight87]

Cheers on behalf of the non-Sydneysiders for sticking it to him, Nick.

Thanks a million, Calixte. I may have not been for around as long as most ppl on the forum or most of the callers, but I feel exactly the same way as them and feel the pain and frustration that they do over the events that have unfolded.

May I ask: how far away from Sydney are you?

 

[Canard]

Also why would news ltd want games on melb tv at prime time, then no one would sign up for their paytv just to watch the league.
Where is the accc in all this? a busniess pratice like that, forcing people to pay for something that should be on free to air.

I doubt thats the real issue on this front though, that scenario occurs in QLD and NSW and I think you will find Pay TV League rates its arse off there.

I think the real issues is Channel Nine's gutlessness in taking the "ratings" hit of showing the league in this market. Yes we know it want be a massive ratings winner initially but eventually its exposure will help boost the game in Victoria and flow on to its ratings. AFL has done the same thing in Brisbane/QLD and as much as I hate those guys, its worked/working out for them.

 

[Knight87]

I doubt thats the real issue on this front though, that scenario occurs in QLD and NSW and I think you will find Pay TV League rates its arse off there.

I think the real issues is Channel Nine's gutlessness in taking the "ratings" hit of showing the league in this market. Yes we know it want be a massive ratings winner initially but eventually its exposure will help boost the game in Victoria and flow on to its ratings. AFL has done the same thing in Brisbane/QLD and as much as I hate those guys, its worked/working out for them.

Another area where I feel league fans have been dudded (in regards to Ch9) is the new times and dates of the finals this year.

Firstly, Ch9 wanted a 7pm night time Grand Final. Most of the fans wanted the traditional 3pm day time Grand Final. What does David Gallop do? He puts a 5pm late afternoon/evening Grand Final, which is neither what the fans nor Ch9 wanted.
However, secondly, as a compromise, Ch9 then get Week 2 and Week 3 Finals as Friday Night and Saturday Night matches. This was already tried in 2006, and it didn't go down well with the fans and general public to the point where it was changed back to Saturday Night/Sunday finals last year. So, Channel 9 are the big winners here, because they get more matches in primetime, but its the rugby league fans, the ppl who have kept the game alive, that are the losers. Ch9 already gets great ratings throughout the year, but tried to play Adolf Hitler with this, and yet, its the fans who get screwed over again.

So, Ch9 didn't get their 7pm GF, but that doesn't matter to them, because they picked up more than what they initially bargained for. PATHETIC! But, this does all fall back on Gallop though. Firstly, giving an outcome that nobody wanted (in regards to the GF), and then giving the compromise that should've never been offered.

And I just loved to hear Gallop's poor excuse on Day Grand Finals. Today, someone rung up in regards to the Day GF, and Gallop said that it isn't good, as fans have to look into the sun????????? I mean, what a crap excuse!!! Fans look into the sun all the time on clear Sunday afternoon matches, why should this be any different? You might as well ban all Sunday afternoon matches then (which would perfectly suit Fox/Ch9). Fans had to look into the sun all those GF's in years from before 2001, when conditions were perfect, why should it be any different? He further said that conditions would be hot at that time of the year for the spectators: Well, it's only played one week after when GF's use to be played (first Sunday in October, one week after the last Sunday in September, when it use to be played). And also, if thats the case, then what about all those ppl who go to the cricket? I went to the A-League GF earlier this year, and it was 27 degrees. Australians are use to hot weather. And if they're worried about the whole daylight savings thing, well, move the GF back to the last Sunday in September (like what it use to be) so the date elapses outside of daylight savings, sunset is earlier, hence eliminates the whole "looking into the bright and hot sun" argument for the whole match, if they're so worried about that.

I'm not saying I'm not a fan of the 5pm kickoff; what I am saying is that this is what those fans lobbying for the daytime GF didn't ask for.

 

[Marshmallow Butt]

well parra-matters, although you have nailed certain aspects on the spot, the issues in regards to tv rights run a lot deeper than this from a long time back, years before what is now being exposed. Questions that do need to be asked are:

1) Why, in 2000 (when the tv rights post-SL expired) did the NRL reject C7 Sports bid in favour of Ch9/Foxtel, when C7 Sports bid was substantially a lot larger?

2) At the last tv rights renewal, why was Ch9 and Fox Sports allowed to renew their deals, which hence blocked Ch7 and Ch10 from being allowed to bid? (I thought in a fair market, all contestants are allowed to bid: This renewal process was in complete contrary to it)

3) Why were the World Cup 2008 rights given to Ch9 on a platter, when there had been talk of Ch7 being interested in the bids? And how much did Ch9 pay for it: Well, although it hasn't been released, I won't be surprised if it was for peanuts. Same can be said for Fox Sports

4) Why were broadband rights and major sponsorship given to Telstra on a platter (and for the relatively mediocre amount they paid), with virtually with no questions asked at all?

5) Why, although NRL consistently dominates the top of the ASTRA PayTV ratings and performs very well on FTA, is our deal nearly half that of the AFL's deal? And no, you cannot use Gallop's reasoning that its because AFL have an extra game on FTA and their coverage is an extra hour more than NRL's. That still doesn't compensate for the massive difference in prices.

I think, you'll find that it's pretty safe to say that Ch9/Foxtel/Fox Sports/Telstra/News Limited are virtually all on the same boat (each is either owned by the other or has a % share in the other). The fact that one of the callers tonight said to Gallop that Ch9 and Foxtel should be made to BID against each other, not COLLABORATE with each other (which in economics is called a Cartel (Collusive Agreement), which is illegal in a 'fair market' situation). But, that will never happen, as because what I said: They're all one of the same.

So yes, the ACCC would have a very huge and fun investigation on their hands, if they were called in to analyse the situation

Well researched Nick, I heard your call & cracked up because even I could hear Gallop shite himself when you asked the question. It was typical of Gallop, as has been said he has no spine & is just a figure head for News Ltd. I ended up switching off after 1/2 hour as it was just the same old answere we've heard before.

 

[Knight87]

Well researched Nick, I heard your call & cracked up because even I could hear Gallop shite himself when you asked the question. It was typical of Gallop, as has been said he has no spine & is just a figure head for News Ltd. I ended up switching off after 1/2 hour as it was just the same old answere we've heard before.

As I said before, after what happened tonight, I highly doubt that Gallop will agree to another one of these 'forums' again. Infact, I'm still surprised he agreed to this, as there was always going to be the risk of this happening on a station where there was no censorship (unlike something like 2GB, where you would have to tell the question to the operator, before you got let on air). Compound this with the embarrasing interview he had with Hughesy nearly 2 yrs ago, enough holes have been punched through the armour and people are now starting to open their eyes and see what's been really happening.

 

[Brutus]

Is there a complete transcript of the radio broadcast anywhere? Being in Perth, I didn't get the chance to hear it.

I taped most of it. Will transcribe the Perth questions for you later in the day. You won't like it.

 

[nqboy]

As for "professional lawyers", there aren't too many amateur ones in my experience.

I've met plenty. They go by other names generally, bush lawyers or law students.

 

[johns_reds]

Sounds like NRL didn't write up a very good contract or did nine write it for them?
Also why would news ltd want games on melb tv at prime time, then no one would sign up for their paytv just to watch the league.
Where is the accc in all this? a busniess pratice like that, forcing people to pay for something that should be on free to air.

Do you know in England you can not watch any of the english premier league on free to air tv, you have to buy skysports package if you want to watch the games.

The only games aired on free to air is half the champions league games and the league and fa cup matches.

Sport is a product, unfortunately you need to pay for products these days. If the NRL was smart in negotions they'd only negotiate with foxsports, and demand twice as much as what they are getting now, foxsports would be able to pay for it because they'd get an influx in subscriptions of people wanting to watch league, players and clubs would be happy with the extra money, the only people complaining would be the fans...

 

[nqboy]

Do you know in England you can not watch any of the english premier league on free to air tv, you have to buy skysports package if you want to watch the games.

The only games aired on free to air is half the champions league games and the league and fa cup matches.

Sport is a product, unfortunately you need to pay for products these days. If the NRL was smart in negotions they'd only negotiate with foxsports, and demand twice as much as what they are getting now, foxsports would be able to pay for it because they'd get an influx in subscriptions of people wanting to watch league, players and clubs would be happy with the extra money, the only people complaining would be the fans...

Pretty much the way it is now.

 

[Brycey]

As for "professional lawyers", there aren't too many amateur ones in my experience.

lol nice punchline.

 

[johns_reds]

To be honest NQboy i'm not complaining, although i have foxtel at home so i get to see all the games every week.

To be honest i prefer to watch them on fox as i hate listening to the ch9 commentators, if ch9 lost their 3 games a week to foxtel it wouldn't be so bad and the amount of money from the tv deal should be enormous.

The game will eventually go down that road, just a question of when i think.

 

[Brycey]

I hear that lawyers are supposedly good at public speaking, but after hearing all the ahhhhhhs and ummmmmmms of Gallop, I now how second thoughts on it. That is pretty mediocre for someone who use to be a professional lawyer to be speaking with such a lack of confidence.

Most lawyers are just as bad as Gallop, they're very weak and crumble when put under pressure by a judge.

You're thinking of Barristers, they're quite good at theatrics.

 

[nqboy]

I warned about this when the agreement was announced. Without penalties, the NRL was never in a position to compel Nein to do the right thing. Imagine leaving it up to Nein to play to the spirit of the game.

 

[nqboy]

To be honest NQboy i'm not complaining, although i have foxtel at home so i get to see all the games every week.

To be honest i prefer to watch them on fox as i hate listening to the ch9 commentators, if ch9 lost their 3 games a week to foxtel it wouldn't be so bad and the amount of money from the tv deal should be enormous.

The game will eventually go down that road, just a question of when i think.

Except that it will still be undersold because, as someone astutely noted, News Ltd are sitting on both sides of the negotiating table.

 

[Digga Hole]

Do you know in England you can not watch any of the english premier league on free to air tv, you have to buy skysports package if you want to watch the games.

The only games aired on free to air is half the champions league games and the league and fa cup matches.

Sport is a product, unfortunately you need to pay for products these days. If the NRL was smart in negotions they'd only negotiate with foxsports, and demand twice as much as what they are getting now, foxsports would be able to pay for it because they'd get an influx in subscriptions of people wanting to watch league, players and clubs would be happy with the extra money, the only people complaining would be the fans...

I think you are forgetting a little piece of legislation called the anti-siphoning list. As long as this remains sports in Australia will be paid less than they are worth.

In regards to the Melbourne situation, I already pay for Foxtel, yet still can't watch the Storm (or any other game) on a Friday before midnight if I want. This game should be on Main event in Victoria like Friday night AFL is in the Northern States. This is not an issue of getting it for free, I already pay!

 

[Knight87]

Do you know in England you can not watch any of the english premier league on free to air tv, you have to buy skysports package if you want to watch the games.

The only games aired on free to air is half the champions league games and the league and fa cup matches.

Sport is a product, unfortunately you need to pay for products these days. If the NRL was smart in negotions they'd only negotiate with foxsports, and demand twice as much as what they are getting now, foxsports would be able to pay for it because they'd get an influx in subscriptions of people wanting to watch league, players and clubs would be happy with the extra money, the only people complaining would be the fans...

I know what you mean, Johns_reds, but you've forgotten one very key point in all of what you said: WE'RE NOT ENGLAND! WE'RE AUSTRALIA! Rugby League is no where near as big and lucrative in the international media as Soccer (or Football, as the poms like to call it). Plus, there's a lot more dollars (GDP) available in England the market is a lot larger over there (not to also mention that the EPL is the premier domestic soccer league in the world, and 2nd most highest tv rights behind the NFL in the USA). I can guarantee you one thing: If Murdoch and his cronies had their way, you would have never, ever seen another Rugby League match on FTA again. And if that ever turned out to be the case, Rugby League in Australia would've gone right down the gurgler.

But Digga Hole mentioned, that isn't possible due to the 'anti-siphoning' laws in Australia.

I know AFL thought of a very smart technique, in regards to broadcasting Friday Night matches live into NSW/QLD via the Main Event channel on Foxtel. In regards to the Melbourne Storm, even then, why should Melbourne viewers (a city that has their own team in the national comp) have to pay to watch the game live, if it is free for those who are in NSW/QLD? It would be a bit different if there was no team in Melbourne, but the fact that the supporters of a premiership winning side can't even watch their own team at a decent time when they appear on FTA is ridiculous. And if you wanna get started on the whole 'ratings' talk, look no further than whats happening with the Sydney Swans and Brisbane Lions in the AFL. They can barely even crack 100,000 viewers in their market, yet they have all of their matches on mostly live, or if not, 1/2 hr to 1 hr delay. Funnily enough, Melbourne Storm rate better in Melbourne (on average) than the Swans do in Sydney and Lions in Brisbane, yet I hear some ludicrous excuse from Gallop about saying, "Well, at the moment, it isn't possible for Ch9"

 

[Knight87]

Most lawyers are just as bad as Gallop, they're very weak and crumble when put under pressure by a judge.

You're thinking of Barristers, they're quite good at theatrics.

What about QC's, such as Stuart Littlemore:lol: Remember him from "MediaWatch"? 'Good eeeeeeeevening':lol:

 

[nqboy]

What's the difference btw barristers and QCs?

 

[hutch]

exactly right, although if the nrl had any balls they would be forcing channel 9 to show all melbourne games into melbourne at a reasonable hour, but as usual we are being bent over without putting up a fight. if it isnt on 9, it should at least be live on fox.

 

[Jatz Crackers]

Most lawyers are just as bad as Gallop, they're very weak and crumble when put under pressure by a judge.

You're thinking of Barristers, they're quite good at theatrics.

Never a truer word spoken.