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WA BEARS

Perth Red

Immortal
Messages
48,521
Wouldn’t it be nice if we could have an adult discussion for a change!

the way I see it is (and I come at it with an acknowledged bias that I would prefer to see the WC Pirates as 18th club)

pros
. instant strong jnr pathway with which we know nrl is super keen on
. potential to pick up a secondary fanbase in sydney(unknown how big this might be)
. LC could put in up to $1million a year
. adds to games in sydney and overcomes to some small degree the usual sht crowds when out of town teams play a Sydney team
. recognised foundation brand, all be it a bit tainted due years of failures aNc dropping out of comp
. vlandys is very Sydney centric and this idea is likely to win his approval

Cons
. WA gets a hand me down club rather than it’s own unique brand
. constant risk and speculation of bears moving back to nsw ft
. potential conflict around the board table
. joint location clubs have faired pretty badly in nrl so far
. will it be thought of as north Sydney playing in perth or a genuine perth club?
. will it put other perth investors offside
. Desire for the ns element to see more games played in Sydney and less in perth
 

Menaiduck

Juniors
Messages
349
Wouldn’t it be nice if we could have an adult discussion for a change!

the way I see it is (and I come at it with an acknowledged bias that I would prefer to see the WC Pirates as 18th club)

pros
. instant strong jnr pathway with which we know nrl is super keen on
. potential to pick up a secondary fanbase in sydney(unknown how big this might be)
. LC could put in up to $1million a year
. adds to games in sydney and overcomes to some small degree the usual sht crowds when out of town teams play a Sydney team
. recognised foundation brand, all be it a bit tainted due years of failures aNc dropping out of comp
. vlandys is very Sydney centric and this idea is likely to win his approval

Cons
. WA gets a hand me down club rather than it’s own unique brand
. constant risk and speculation of bears moving back to nsw ft
. potential conflict around the board table
. joint location clubs have faired pretty badly in nrl so far
. will it be thought of as north Sydney playing in perth or a genuine perth club?
. will it put other perth investors offside
. Desire for the ns element to see more games played in Sydney and less in perth
I’d rather see a stand alone Perth Club. But if this gets you over the line with ten home games minimum then it’s a win. The structure has to be right to avoid a north Sydney take over. I could not see that happening tbh. Once you’ve got it I’m betting that’s it.
 
Messages
12,212
You're thin skinned and cannot handle any criticism of the NSWRL and its clubs. Before I entered the thread it was basically a wankathon about the return of North Sydney Bears by NSWRL fans, just like the thread on the Bears buying the Titans five years ago.

The NSWRL fans talking up this story were deathriding the Perth bid just a few days ago, but now they're on board because it's the bloody Bears. Some of them were crazy enough to promote PNG Pride @ Cairns ad nauseum in every thread while saying Perth cannot have a team. It's hard to take anything these turkeys say seriously. They're biased and too emotionally invested in the NSWRL to make a proper and informed judgement on expansion that will benefit the game. Every idea they champion is based around aiding the Sydney clubs to some extent, even if it is detrimental to the game outside of Sydney.

You've got nine teams to follow. F--- off and let Perth have one of their own without the baggage associated with Sydney.
Mate I honestly think you need to see a doctor. Really.
 

Perth Red

Immortal
Messages
48,521
I’d rather see a stand alone Perth Club. But if this gets you over the line with ten home games minimum then it’s a win. The structure has to be right to avoid a north Sydney take over. I could not see that happening tbh. Once you’ve got it I’m betting that’s it.
Yeh look if this is the only way then as long as it’s set up right then so be it. I dont believe it is the only way and I think there is a better way but I’m not totally adverse to it as long as done properly and the big thing is it can’t be seen as north sydney bears playing in perth. That would be the death of the club before it started. They would need to think very carefully about how they ensure that perception doesn’t happen And it is a genuine WA Bears club with a junior partner in Sydney.
 

Menaiduck

Juniors
Messages
349
Yeh look if this is the only way then as long as it’s set up right then so be it. I dont believe it is the only way and I think there is a better way but I’m not totally adverse to it as long as done properly and the big thing is it can’t be seen as north sydney bears playing in perth. That would be the death of the club before it started. They would need to think very carefully about how they ensure that perception doesn’t happen And it is a genuine WA Bears club with a junior partner in Sydney.
100% agree.
 

Perth Red

Immortal
Messages
48,521
How about we dont derail the thread further by talking about posters and instead stick to the topic at hand? Novel idea I know lol
 

The Penguin #6.

Juniors
Messages
203
What I guess it also does is gives us an instant rivalry with Manly lol. Was there anyone else that was classed as "rivals" to the Bears?
That was the one game that Billy Moore said they`d be very keen to host at NSO every year. Looks like that`d be your trip to Sydney.
 
Messages
12,212
How about we dont derail the thread further by talking about posters and instead stick to the topic at hand? Novel idea I know lol
Really?
It was, and I definitely was until your little mate came along going on and on about horse shit upon horse shit.
Maybe tell your your protege to calm the f**k down.
 
Messages
5,775
Wouldn’t it be nice if we could have an adult discussion for a change!

the way I see it is (and I come at it with an acknowledged bias that I would prefer to see the WC Pirates as 18th club)

pros
. instant strong jnr pathway with which we know nrl is super keen on
. potential to pick up a secondary fanbase in sydney(unknown how big this might be)
. LC could put in up to $1million a year
. adds to games in sydney and overcomes to some small degree the usual sht crowds when out of town teams play a Sydney team
. recognised foundation brand, all be it a bit tainted due years of failures aNc dropping out of comp
. vlandys is very Sydney centric and this idea is likely to win his approval

Cons
. WA gets a hand me down club rather than it’s own unique brand
. constant risk and speculation of bears moving back to nsw ft
. potential conflict around the board table
. joint location clubs have faired pretty badly in nrl so far
. will it be thought of as north Sydney playing in perth or a genuine perth club?
. will it put other perth investors offside
. Desire for the ns element to see more games played in Sydney and less in perth
Does an arrangement with North Sydney provide juniors?

It's a serious question.

For years I've heard NSWRL fans rant and rave about the need to bring back the Bears because everyone on the North Shore gave up rugby league and became a dyed in the wool fumbleball fan of the Swans when North Sydney was punted!

They cite Swans crowds around the late 90s and 00s as evidence.

Why should I believe there's all of these kids playing rugby league on the North Shore when I've been told for 20 years that the game is dead?

They've either been lying for 20 years or are lying now.

Even if there are kids playing rugby league on the North Shore, who's to say they won't sign with one of the nine Sydney clubs to remain close to family?

Perth's best bet is to focus on developing players from WA. If the NRL was serious it would send develop officers to Perth and build an academy to fast track development.

I'm not convinced there's many North Sydney fans left in Sydney. The club had an active fanbase of 8k to 12k. Their best year saw them draw 15k fans through the gates. This is from 23+ years ago. I doubt these fans exist in great numbers. Even if they have 2k or 3k fans willing to travel around Sydney, the limited benefit from their patronage will be surpassed by the negatives of trying to build a fanbase in Perth with a team that was created specifically for Bears fans in Sydney.

The best way to fix shit crowds in Sydney is to build more events, such as double headers and triple headers to get casual fans into the habit of attending games. With SFS, Parramatta Stadium and Penrith Football Stadium getting a full rebuild there's a chance to sell out these venues with the right clashes. A Roosters vs Rabbitohs / Sea Eagles vs Dragons / Sharks vs Eels triple header at SFS would surely draw 50k and provide an atmosphere that makes people want to attend more games. It would also be great value for money. You could even make it a Roosters vs Rabbitohs / Sharks vs Dragons double header and get a near sell out crowd. It would be great for a Sunday arvo.

My hope is this idea wakes parochial NSWRL up to the benefits of a Perth team. It took me a year to see the benefits but I came around eventually. Once the benefits are widely acknowledged and accepted then the Pirates consortium can come in and show how their bid has more money and an active history of developing junior RL in Perth, with funding by people who are passionate about the city and the game.

Because they are coined and want sports tourism and max use of their stadium investments
Has to be Pirates if they want 12 games. There's already talk of taking six games to Sydney. That sort of talk by the Sydney media will kill the deal before it has a chance to get off the ground.
 

Steel Saints

Juniors
Messages
145
I think this is quite exciting, especially if it's done right. As others have said, if the allocation of games is 10 at Perth, two at NSO, then that would be great.

You've got to look at the long term survival of a Perth club that's based in an AFL state. We are talking about a club to be around, not just for 5 years, but for 5 decades and beyond. If it can get support from Norths with juniors and revenue, then 'WA Bears' can become a strong club.

And also spare a thought for Norths. The last 25 years, they have been thinking about Central Coast. Norths will have to make a decision. Do they go with Perth, or do they still persist with Central Coast as their future?

WA/ Perth and Norths need to have dialogue with PVL and the NRL. Does Perth have a better chance entering the NRL with Norths by their side?

Does Central Coast have a chance to be the 18th team or 19th/20th team? For both parties, they need to figure out the best way to enter the NRL.
 
Messages
5,775
That was abuse?
I just saw someone with obvious issues. He needs help.
You're entitled to your opinion and thank you for your concern. I probably come across as highly strung when talking about the NSWRL, but it's not as if there's no merit to my criticism.

I'm not from Sydney so I don't have any emotional attachment to the NSWRL. That allows me to see past what Sydneysiders won't acknowledge. All of my life I've had to hear talking heads on TV focus on Sydney to the detriment of the game everywhere else. You don't understand how divisive and harmful it is because your club is a beneficiary. For years we had the same narrow-minded idiots, like Gould and co, advocate Central Coast as expansion while Brisbane remained a one team town, but rule out adding teams to Ipswich, Logan and Sunshine Coast because only Sydney is allowed to have its LGAs represented. It's an insulting double standard that lets everyone outside of Sydney know that you don't view us as equals and will never treat us fairly.

Adelaide and Perth have sat empty for a quarter of a century.

You cannot blame people from outside of Sydney for having no faith in the game's leadership when the last quarter of a century has been based around Sydney to the detriment of everyone else. That's the consequence of favouring one city over everyone else. Calling dissenters crazy won't quell their discontent.

If you want to see a raving lunatic in action, look no further than MugaB. He's wished harm on me in the past and obsessively stalks me across the board, twisting my words around and responding to my posts with an angry tirade of juvenile insults. I've put him on Ignore as he's a lost cause. He's a talented graphic designer, but his outbursts and intolerance for anyone with a different opinion are over the top.

I think this is quite exciting, especially if it's done right. As others have said, if the allocation of games is 10 at Perth, two at NSO, then that would be great.

You've got to look at the long term survival of a Perth club that's based in an AFL state. We are talking about a club to be around, not just for 5 years, but for 5 decades and beyond. If it can get support from Norths with juniors and revenue, then 'WA Bears' can become a strong club.

And also spare a thought for Norths. The last 25 years, they have been thinking about Central Coast. Norths will have to make a decision. Do they go with Perth, or do they still persist with Central Coast as their future?

WA/ Perth and Norths need to have dialogue with PVL and the NRL. Does Perth have a better chance entering the NRL with Norths by their side?

Does Central Coast have a chance to be the 18th team or 19th/20th team? For both parties, they need to figure out the best way to enter the NRL.

I don't think North Sydney Bears ever gave a f**k about Central Coast. They've refused to relocate their junior teams to Central Coast, which is a sign they still view themselves as a North Sydney club.

Imagine how much stronger rugby league would be on the Central Coast if we had a Central Coast Bears team playing in the NSW Cup since 2000?

There's been a nice stadium on the Central Coast since 2000, yet the club has chosen to play out of the dilapidated North Sydney Oval under the North Sydney Bears brand.

Five years ago they tried to buy the Gold Coast Titans so they could enter the NRL as the Gold Coast Bears. Burleigh Bears told them to get f**ked and so did the NRL. I think they bought Tweed Heads Seagulls Leagues Club at one stage. This club is loyal to no one other than themselves and will use anyone and everyone to get into the NRL.
 
Last edited:
Messages
12,212
You're entitled to your opinion and thank you for your concern. I probably come across as highly strung when talking about the NSWRL, but it's not as if there's no merit to my criticism.

I'm not from Sydney so I don't have any emotional attachment to the NSWRL. That allows me to see past what Sydneysiders won't acknowledge. All of my life I've had to hear talking heads on TV focus on Sydney to the detriment of the game everywhere else. You don't understand how divisive and harmful it is because your club is a beneficiary. For years we had the same narrow-minded idiots, like Gould and co, advocate Central Coast as expansion while Brisbane remained a one team town, but rule out adding teams to Ipswich, Logan and Sunshine Coast because only Sydney is allowed to have its LGAs represented. It's an insulting double standard that lets everyone outside of Sydney know that you don't view us as equals and will never treat us fairly.

Adelaide and Perth have sat empty for a quarter of a century.

You cannot blame people from outside of Sydney for having no faith in the game's leadership when the last quarter of a century has been based around Sydney to the detriment of everyone else. That's the consequence of favouring one city over everyone else. Calling dissenters crazy won't quell their discontent.

If you want to see a raving lunatic in action, look no further than MugaB. He's wished harm on me in the past and obsessively stalks me across the board, twisting my words around and responding to my posts with an angry tirade of juvenile insults. I've put him on Ignore as he's a lost cause. He's a talented graphic designer, but his outbursts and intolerance for anyone with a different opinion are over the top.
If you'd actually read my posts I have said numerous times that I am not in support of the Bears/Perth merger, and prefer a stand alone team in WA, I've always felt this.
I've lived there and was a supporter of their first time round.
To be truthful, I think most people from Sydney in this thread have said pretty much the same thing.
My personal thought are: No teams to be kicked out, and hopefully in my lifetime a 24 team competition, with no more Sydney teams.
Lets leave it at that.
 

reanimate

Bench
Messages
3,365
This is such a stupid idea. North Sydney Oval is an awful ground for RL. The viewing angles are terrible there, it deserves zero games. If WA gets this idea up and running, they need to be in full control, with ownership of the brand and all home games played in Perth.
 

The Great Dane

First Grade
Messages
5,573
Yeh look if this is the only way then as long as it’s set up right then so be it.
Sure, but it won't be set up right...

The only way the Bears will agree is if they are steering the ship, and as soon as they have control their concerns will come first at which point Perth will just be an avenue through which to get the Bears back into the comp.

In theory joining with the Bears may get Perth into the comp quicker, especially with the current administration in charge, but the potential downsides aren't worth it. Perth are better off biding their time and getting it right than selling their souls to get a team that has a high chance of devolving into constant power struggles and/or treating Perth as an inconvenient necessity.

In other words Perth doesn't need the Bears, so why complicate things by creating an ill thought out merger?
 

The Great Dane

First Grade
Messages
5,573
This is such a stupid idea. North Sydney Oval is an awful ground for RL. The viewing angles are terrible there, it deserves zero games. If WA gets this idea up and running, they need to be in full control, with ownership of the brand and all home games played in Perth.
Maybe not ownership of the brand, but I understand what you are saying.

The only way it should happen is if Norths are minority partners who have no say in the day to day running of the NRL side and effectively just agree to let them use their assets and feeder system.

That's it, no power on the board, no home games in Sydney, no say in business decisions, just the above take it or leave it.

Of course they'll never agree to such a deal so it's a waste of time to even discuss it.
 

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