WE HAVE NO SPEED

[Dragonslayer]

The debate concerning Nightingale is interesting to say the least and both sides of the arguement have merits IMO.
The important issue for me is not wether he is too old/too slow or wether he is a club legend/never let you down the issue for mine is what does he hope to gain in 2018.
Now we know McGregor has "favourites" and indeed Nighty is one of them and we also know McGregor doesn't like to change things unless forced to. So in reality we all should be prepared for Nighty lining up on the wing in round 1. I'd be suprised if he wasn't.
However, is there a guarantee that McGregor will select him? Maybe he signed a new one year deal already knowing his fate for 2018 and let's face it he costs us nothing under the long serving player allowance.
Another thing to remember is that he is 28 games short of Ben Hornby Club record number of games played so even if he played ALL games in 2018 (and lets throw in finals as well) he going to be short. Could he possibly sign again for 2019 just to break the record?
Again, what is HIS motivation? And we would have to ask him direct to solve that riddle.
Nighty is a dead set legend to the Dragons but I just hope his motivation is dead set in the right place.

 

[BennyV]

Basically Jason is a top class winger. There are 4 or 5 I prefer above him in the comp but that's about it. He has never been a fast winger. Even at his best when we won the comp 2010, he could never strike from long range. I have seen him hold on to score from 50 metres out but chasers were making ground on him.

4 or 5 above him? A few years ago I'd agree but there are plenty of wingers above him - again, I can't see a Top 8 side that he'd definitely walk into from last year.

That acknowledged, so much up side:

-Moves quickly and has initial take off drive. A slow winger but not slow player.

Umm what? I'll concede that on his scoots he manages to beat the markers but it often involves a palm off or two.

-Uncanny positional sense and awareness of the space where he needs to be in the moment.

Untrue - over the past few years he's struggled to keep up with half breaks from his centre and his positioning in defence has gone downhill.

- Scores plenty of trys each season in a team which has struggled in past 5 seasons. Yes, like all wingers a fair degree of catch and score but can beat opposition players and scramble over. The guy is a try scorer regardless of which side of field he plays.

Ummm, 2016 - 6 tries. 2015 - 5 tries. Got up there this year, which coincided with Widdop and Lafai being inenormous form for most of the year.

- Very spectacular swan driving trys at times. That's pretty funky!

Cool - should have signed Sandor Earl.

- A good attacking and defensive high ball catcher

I'll give him this.

- A good defender with deceptive defensive strength

Good tackler, yes. But his positioning is well off and he doesn't have the speed to compensate.

- Very good in heavy traffic carries. Good stamina all round.

I don't know what this means - good in heavy traffic carries? Such a wishy-washy statement!

- A competent fullback

Who, if placed there, stands in the way of our above-competent young fullbacks getting a run.

- Long term player discount so cheap on salary cap.

Doesn't apply since JDB is also eligible, so we already get the rewards.

Sum up / Therevaa few better wingers around than nighty but a plenty worse.

As a different POV, there's not enough upside to guarantee his auto-selection in first grade over some of the youth who are ready to step up. I've watched club legends end their careers here on a bad note or play a year too long, I don't want to see that happen to Nightingale and I'm worried that it will in 2018.

 

[possm]

yeah.. but.. he scored the most tries for us last season..

which says to me the issue with our attack is not found in the happy haka...

Your reasoning is very selective. First consider:
Could have any other winger in the Club scored those tries?
Were most just 'fall-over' tries created by Widdop/Lafai?
How many potential long range opportunities for tries were lost?
How many defensive problems were the result of lack of pace?
How much junior development opportunities were lost?

I haven't been following the World Cup this time round, so maybe some on here could let us know how many tries Nightingale has scored for NZ in this World Cup series.

 

[muzby]

Your reasoning is very selective. First consider:
Could have any other winger in the Club scored those tries?
Were most just 'fall-over' tries created by Widdop/Lafai?
How many potential long range opportunities for tries were lost?
How many defensive problems were the result of lack of pace?
How much junior development opportunities were lost?

I haven't been following the World Cup this time round, so maybe some on here could let us know how many tries Nightingale has scored for NZ in this World Cup series.

Ahhh.. the old hypothetical vs stats debate..

How many more tries could he have scored if we had an effective no.7?

How many more tries may have been let in via bad positioning from an inexperienced winger?

How many supermodels would I have hooked up with if i’d attended the Victoria’s Secret show this week?

 

[Saint_JimmyG]

I don't think it is the age that matters, it's the ability to do the job. In the Dragon's case it is the lack of speed in our backline. It's alright to sacrifice a spot in our NRL squad as a sign of respect and gratitude for all Nightingale has done for the Club but is another step to hold up the progress of a young outside back who may just have the speed to win us an important game or two.

The operative word is "may".

While a young outside back may have speed, he will also be inexperienced that might cost a game or two.

With Nightingale, it's a case of "better the devil you know" (thanks Kylie M.), especially as he is still playing good footy.

 

[ALSGI]

Nighty is too slow.

He scored one try this year that took extraordinary skill, but all were inside the 10m and most were without a hand on him. FFS he scored two tries untouched in a game this year where he struggled to get up afterwards. He was beaten several times because of speed, pushed back in many of his kick returns or produced ineffective short yardage with his trademark wrestle, sideways backwards zig zag making 3m and taking an eternity to play the ball.

I’m over the sentimental BS on here, he’s too slow, past it and we have young men waiting for Mary to give them a crack.

His tries this year are an irrelevant stat, most on here agree we need to see McInnes do more with the ball yet he topped the tackle count in the NRL.

BTW, McDonald should also go on this years form but he can improve - Nighty can’t.

 

[muzby]

His tries this year are an irrelevant stat, most on here agree we need to see McInnes do more with the ball yet he topped the tackle count in the NRL.

Au contraire..

Making a tackle vs doing something creative with the ball are completely opposing areas of play..

Whereas scoring a try is kind of the whole objective of a team’s attack..

 

[red rocket]

Au contraire..

Making a tackle vs doing something creative with the ball are completely opposing areas of play..

Whereas scoring a try is kind of the whole objective of a team’s attack..

 

[red rocket]

Next year all our backs will look faster playing outside a quality half back the speed is there hunt will unlock it

 

[Crush]

Nighty too slow
Hunt is the messiah
Inject the youth
Sack McGregor
Starting 17
How many times do you reckon we can go around in circles talking about the above 5 topics before the Charity Shield?

 

[Saintsified]

Nighty is too slow.

He scored one try this year that took extraordinary skill, but all were inside the 10m and most were without a hand on him. FFS he scored two tries untouched in a game this year where he struggled to get up afterwards. He was beaten several times because of speed, pushed back in many of his kick returns or produced ineffective short yardage with his trademark wrestle, sideways backwards zig zag making 3m and taking an eternity to play the ball.

I’m over the sentimental BS on here, he’s too slow, past it and we have young men waiting for Mary to give them a crack.

His tries this year are an irrelevant stat, most on here agree we need to see McInnes do more with the ball yet he topped the tackle count in the NRL.

BTW, McDonald should also go on this years form but he can improve - Nighty can’t.

So if he scored within 10 metres, i would say he had a knack to know where to be.

 

[Life's Good]

Nighty too slow
Hunt is the messiah
Inject the youth
Sack McGregor
Starting 17
How many times do you reckon we can go around in circles talking about the above 5 topics before the Charity Shield?

You forgot:
Widdop to fullback
Hunt to hooker