Wellington in shock plan to join Super League

[RLIF]

http://www.rugbyleaguenz.com/index.php?Page_ID=2&News_ID=1416

It's the most audacious bid for a sporting franchise in history. The Sunday Star-Times can today exclusively reveal a Wellington rugby league team are to apply for a place in the English-based Super League competition.

The backers of the Southern Orcas - who two years ago failed in a bid to join the NRL - have been engaged in secret negotiations for more than a year with senior officials of the English Rugby Football League to join their elite 12-team league, if as expected, it expands to 14 sides in 2009.

Fingers crossed this happens...highly doubt it though

 

[ozbash]

will be interesting.

 

[Skinner]

yeah right

 

[Evil Homer]

Surely an April Fool's gone wrong?

 

[aarondoyle]

This is so stupid. They're going to be spoilt for choice for those critical 2 extra spots without a friggin New Zeland team.

Toulose
Crusaders
Castleford
and about every other team that been relegated in recent years...

*Edit* The NRL and Super League should get together and talk about this. Surely Wellington should be in the NRL, whereas European teams should be in the Super League.

 

[Copa]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sundaystartimes/4019284a6444.html

League: Orcas to target ABs in Super League bid
By STEVE KILGALLON - Sunday Star Times | Sunday, 8 April 2007

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AdvertisementThe Southern Orcas would aggressively target key All Blacks to give their new franchise a huge boost in playing strength, publicity and support if they were to win a place in the English-based Super League competition.


The Orcas' positioning document lists Daniel Carter, Jerry Collins, Ma'a Nonu and Piri Weepu among six key targets they would pursue as marquee signings if they were accepted into the competition.

And because the salary cap would be in English pounds, not Australian or New Zealand dollars, the Orcas are confident they would be able to offer salaries that would be significantly large enough to persuade some union stars to switch.

Although Carter and Collins may be unlikely to change codes, the Orcas believe Wellingtonians Nonu and Weepu have a background and interest in league that would help convince them to sign. The Orcas' pitch says: "We've designed the style of package that means they'll be excited to come on board."

The English salary cap stands at 1.8 million, roughly $A4.36m: a million dollars more than the NRL salary cap of $A3.366m. That would allow the Orcas to also offer increased wages to key NRL stars, such as Wests Tigers' Kiwi international standoff Benji Marshall.

"To have a quality, first-class team to be able to enter the competition is absolutely essential and it would come off the back of a rugby union world cup," said Orcas front man Andrew Chalmers, the acting chairman of the New Zealand Rugby League.

"The way the market is, there is a real opportunity to pick up some quality players and of course, provide pathways for the enormous number of junior high-performance athletes coming through."

Former Warriors and Kiwis coach Daniel Anderson comes off contract at English club St Helens at the end of 2008, and is likely to be targeted as coach - especially as Anderson was lined up to head up the Orcas' NRL bid. Chalmers would not be drawn on that issue.

Chalmers was involved in a 1991 proposal for a team from the Hutt Valley, the Dolphins, to secure a place in the old Australian Winfield Cup competition (effectively now the NRL) and led the Orcas' bid in 2004-2005 for a place in the NRL when it was expanded to 16 teams. Neither was successful.

He said the NZRL had begun talking about Super League as soon as the NRL handed down a decision in May 27, 2005, that the Gold Coast had beaten the Orcas for the extra NRL place.

"From an NZRL point of view, we have wanted a second franchise playing in a professional competition for some time and I think it is fair to say at the point that the NRL chose to expand into Queensland ... we started giving thought to what an alternative might mean," he said.

Chalmers said they had concluded the NRL would not consider further expansion until the expiry of their existing television contract, in six years time, and more likely not until after the next contract, in 10 to 12 years: "We don't believe the NRL view (expansion) as a priority."

He said it became clear the Super League was seriously contemplating adding two teams to the competition in 2009, and the NZRL moved quickly to be among the first to register their interest.

Chalmers said not much would have to be adapted from the basics of the Orcas bid and a full business plan and proposal could be ready almost instantly, once Super League signalled how the franchising process would operate.

Chalmers pointed to Sanzar's discussions over the prospect of adding a Japan-based team to the Super 14, which already straddles New Zealand, Australia and South Africa, of evidence in a trend in world sport to international club competition.

"It's all about how you grow the game globally and increase its value," he said. "From the NZRL's perspective, we believe this is in the interests of rugby league and our high-performance programme, it would increase pathways (for young players) and strengthen the Kiwis."

One potentially money-generating aspect would be taking games to other markets.

Chalmers noted that several Australian state governments outside traditional rugby league areas were now offering significant financial packages to attract NRL games and was confident the Orcas could be a drawcard in venues such as Perth, Melbourne and Adelaide. And those venues and others, such as Dubai, could serve as stopping points for the Orcas to travel to England.

Chalmers could suggest copying the Super 14 example and playing games in blocks to ease the issue of travel, with the Orcas potentially playing a game in Wellington, then one en route to England, then three away fixtures, one more on the way home, and their next back at Westpac Stadium.

The team - which would wear a white shirt with black and green trim -would base its staff and players at a new Wellington Rugby League base in the Hutt Valley, with strong links to the NZRL Academy programme at Petone.

 

[Sam_the_man]

Go for it i say, the NRL was short sighted in bring the GC back.

I hope the Orcas get in.

 

[Ari Gold]

Hmm... don't really know what to say. Could be a huge waste of money if it goes pear-shaped.

However by 2016 we could have 4 countries represented in the ESL if the wellington, celtic bids are serious.

 

[Quidgybo]

This is so stupid. They're going to be spoilt for choice for those critical 2 extra spots without a friggin New Zeland team.

Toulose
Crusaders

But if you look at it as a short term prospect then it could be just the breathing space that the RFL needs. There is obviously a desire to bring both a second French side and a Welsh side in, but there are still a lot of doubts that they'll be up to the grade in time for 2009 - especially in the case of Celtic. But if instead they bring in Toulouse and Wellington but on the understanding that Wellington will move to the NRL with next Australian TV deal, then that would give Celtic the extra few years to develop before moving up to replace Wellington in 2013. And it serves Wellington's purpose in allowing them to build a stable club to prove their worth to the NRL prior to the decision on expansion for 2013.

Leigh.

 

[AlbertRosenfeld]

And for the Orcas' home games is the plan for the Concorde to brought out of mothballs, to enable the club to cut the travelling time between Wellington and Manchester from 20 hours to 14 hours, with the addition of 4 hours in refuelling stops in Singapore and Dubai? I am sure that the players will love that flight experience.

And is the billionaire going to use some chump change to pay the massive fuel prices for the trip?

Or is the plan to have a weekly Concorde flight costing $20,000 each way for all the Kiwi billionaires to help finance it all?

Or do Kiwis run their April Fools jokes a week later than the rest of us just for Kiwi chumps?

 

[ozbash]

NRL chief executive David Gallop says he wouldn't oppose the Southern Orcas' plans to chase a place in Super League - and the Warriors have also given their blessing to the proposal.


An amazed Warriors chief executive Wayne Scurrah, when told of the plans, said: "Good luck to them if it is something they think could work. It is hard to contemplate the logistics, it would be a massive challenge, but whatever is good for rugby league is positive."

Scurrah was comfortable with the Orcas using Wellington's playing resources, given many players already went offshore to Australian NRL clubs, and said he'd welcome an annual fixture between the teams.

Gallop said he wasn't aware of the project, but noted: "It's hard to see where we would have a basis to object to it. We will watch further developments with interest."

However, long-time Wellington league stalwart Ken Laban, who organised the original 1991 bid for a Hutt Valley team to join the then Winfield Cup, was scathing.

"My initial reaction is I think it is ridiculous," Laban declared. "Why would you bring Huddersfield, Wakefield and Warrington to Westpac Stadium when you can get Brisbane, Newcastle and the Melbourne Storm?"

As with others told of the plan, Laban questioned the travel, costs and time-zone issues which would be difficult to resolve and said while Wellingtonians were well aware of NRL stars' identities, they would struggle to name any player in the lower-ranked Super League teams. "They would be regarded as a novelty factor, and you would go if they were successful ... but if they weren't, it would be a hard sell," he said. Laban said he felt the last NRL bid had "credibility issues" given the anonymity of their backer - who is once again protecting his identity.

One of Wellington's most prominent NRL exports, former Canberra and Cowboys prop Johnny Lomax - now coaching the city's under-16 rep side -said halting the decline of the local game was more important.

"We need to concentrate on our backyard here ... it would be pretty tough to get through to people here otherwise," he said. "Spending money on this would be a bit ridiculous, and would it be wasted: how long would it last for?"

Elsewhere in the league community, the response was amazement, followed by cautious support.

Former Warriors chief executive Mick Watson said the Orcas might struggle to take a Super League place from English applicants.

"I applaud Andrew Chalmers for taking the initiative. However, I think second division Super League clubs will oppose it," Watson said.

"If (RFL executive chairman) Richard Lewis can address the relegation issue and if there is enough depth in the playing ranks to maintain the quality of the game then it could happen. I imagine the NRL would oppose it, but is refreshing to see someone thinking outside the square."

Former Kiwis coach Frank Endacott, who coached in Super League with Wigan and Widnes, agreed with Watson. "They (the RFL) are more obligated or committed to looking after a second French side before a team in the southern hemisphere," he said. "Clubs such as Castleford or Widnes (former Super League clubs relegated to second division) might have something to say too.

"From a New Zealand perspective, it would be a very exciting concept."

The former acting chair of the Wellington league, Rodney Moore of the Te Aroha club, was enthusiastic: "The game in New Zealand has lived in the shadow of Auckland for 100 years now ... something is needed to give the game outside Auckland a shot in the arm."

Moore said big crowds for Bulldogs v Warriors games at Westpac Stadium showed the potential. "Wellington is the Melbourne of New Zealand, really: Wellingtonians will support quality events - I think that has been proven."

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,4019714a1823,00.html

 

[Dr Crane]

I would f**king love it to happen, i just have serious doubts it will.

Hopefully it would be nothing more than a stepping stone to the NRL, if done.

 

[thommo4pm]

Still not sure what to make of this.
Would like to see a Welsh side, an Irish based side, a Russian team and a possible 2nd French side before this happened in the ESL.
The cost of this would be massive.

 

[thommo4pm]

In saying that, good to see some initiative being shown in NZ with respect to the great game.

 

[ozbash]

surely the Orcas would have to be based in England.

 

[Tom Shines]

Still not sure what to make of this.
Would like to see a Welsh side, an Irish based side, a Russian team and a possible 2nd French side before this happened in the ESL.
The cost of this would be massive.

I'm the same — worry about cementing the game in Europe thanks to countries like Russia, Wales, Ireland, and Estonia.

 

[AlbertRosenfeld]

How can the RFL and Super League possibly justify flying 13 Super League teams to NZ? And the players will be too jet lagged after their flight to adjust to the time difference in time -- unless all previous UK games for each club were planned for a Friday night, with Saturday night flight departure, and playing again in NZ and the UK on consecutive Sundays.

The NRL should have planned to bring Wellington and Perth into the NRL this year along with the Gold Coast. The problem would have been getting a bigger TV contract to enable the NRL subsidy of each club to remain the same.

The NRL would say that there are not yet enough quality players to make this 18 team competition realistic. But as of now there are enough Kiwis (Bartercard RL and NZRU backline converts combined) to make the player situation viable for Wellington. And Perth could have struggled for a few years, with some South African RU converts perhaps to excite the tens of thousands of South African immigrants in Perth, until the Perth juniors started to come of age.

However once the RFL enforces a three or four import player maximum on the Super League (to encourage clubs to fund junior development in ENgland), then two teams worth of NRL quality players will suddenly be flying back to Australia and New Zealand to look for a place in the NRL. The 18 team NRL competition will then become realistic from a player quality perspective.

The barrier to expansion in the near future will then be a revised TV contract. But I think that News Ltd might agree to that, given the advantages of having the Perth and Wellington audiences added to their subscriptions.

 

[AlbertRosenfeld]

The big need in the short term for Super League is to get a second French team and a Welsh team.

Toulouse is the official French candidate. There are now 24 good French players with Super League experience. There are four other quality French international players who have never played Super League (Maxime Greseque, Christophe Moly, Olivier Charles, and Cedric Gay). That gives us 28 quality French players. You need 44 top quality French players to sustain two Super League clubs of 25 man squads (assuming that the foreign quota for SL will be cut to three). If the foreign quota is cut to five then you need only 40 French players. If the French clubs are given a six player foreign allowance for three years then you need only 38 players --- then we have a year to find and develop 10 more SL quality French players. This issue, along with Welsh development, is where the attention of the RFL should be focused for now.

The other development issue for Super League and northern hemisphere rugby league, is to build the game in London with a view to adding two more London clubs within the next 7 years. That is a tall order to be sure. But it can be done, given the growth of juniors in London already to the 4th or 5th largest junior catchment area in rugby league.

 

[langpark]

The big need in the short term for Super League is to get a second French team and a Welsh team.

Toulouse is the official French candidate. There are now 24 good French players with Super League experience. There are four other quality French international players who have never played Super League (Maxime Greseque, Christophe Moly, Olivier Charles, and Cedric Gay). That gives us 28 quality French players. You need 44 top quality French players to sustain two Super League clubs of 25 man squads (assuming that the foreign quota for SL will be cut to three). If the foreign quota is cut to five then you need only 40 French players. If the French clubs are given a six player foreign allowance for three years then you need only 38 players --- a we have a year to find an develop 10 more SL quality French players. This issue, along with Welsh development, is where the attention of the RFL should be focused for now.

The other development issue is to build the game in London with a view to adding two more London clubs within the next 7 years. That is a tall order to be sure. But it can be done, given the growth of juniors in London to the 4th or 5th largest junior catchment area in rugby league.

At the rate the Quins are going we'll be lucky to have one London team, never mind two.

 

[t-ba]

But if instead they bring in Toulouse and Wellington but on the understanding that Wellington will move to the NRL with next Australian TV deal

Exactly. Hopefully a well attended Wellington Franchise playing in the Super League can convince the NRL that it can stretch its financial base to 17-18 clubs come the next TV Rights deal.

I'm amazed the Wellington Bid is still around. It's good news for the game, particularly in NZ, but did this Belgian Brewers parents addle his brain when he was an infant with some finely brewed Belgian Beer or something?