Why do crowds plummet?

[langpark]

...during the finals? A few examples;

Leeds v Hull FC - 9,075 (14,809 for same fixture during the season)

Wigan v St Helens - 12,893 (24,057 "___")


Surely the "Sky" factor can't be blamed here, nor can sub-zero temparatures this time of year. So what is it, are we seeing masses of people getting season tickets for too low of a price, that they become spoilt cheapskates when they actually have to pay for an individual match again?...

 

[Evil Homer]

Because season tickets do not include these games and they are scheduled on irregular matchdays at short notice. It's not really a problem at all, these are additional matches for clubs so it's not as if they are losing money because of the low crowds, and nobody really remembers these attendances anyway as they are not included in official statistics.

 

[nadera78]

I think it is the season ticket thing. People get used to paying low prices for games and then the play-offs don't seem so attractive. The clubs do push them very heavily because they provide guaranteed income in the off season.

Homer, I think the RFL take all the revenue from play-off games (also set the prices, etc) and it goes into the central pot.

 

[roughyedspud]

yeah i think it does

 

[langpark]

That's a shame, the playoffs are meant to be the pinnacle of the season. The matches where the hardcore fans + casual fans all come out of the woodwork. Each match in my opinion should have attracted double what it got.

Homer; of course it's a problem, we're presenting that shit (empty stands) to the world on TV, matches that are supposed to be the most important of the season....

 

[roughyedspud]

maybe the RFL should look at reducing the ticket prices??

 

[WireMan]

Because the playoffs are a over hyped sky contest coming at the end of a long season. It also costs money to go to games, and if you go as a family, finding £80-£90 plus food and drink for a game is a lot.

For me, i only pay for my own ticket, and the price is the same so i can easily afford it, hence i go to the games. £18 ain't bad to watch top level sport.
If Warrington had of come second in the league though, the crowd would have probably dropped down to around the 7k mark though.

Also coupled with the fact that Wigan and Saints knew it wasn't an elimination match, neither were there points on the line. It doesn't help that with the opening match they have played each other 5 times this season. Its hard to stay worked up after that many games. Especially when there may be a much more important 6th game coming up.

 

[WireMan]

Well we had 6,700 for a Wigan home match.

Coupled with the Giants on Friday, i think the RFL have to really look into the format.


Why do crowds plummet?

Because no one cares about this competition. Its not competitive, its boring, it goes on to long, it cheapens the league.

 

[Johnny_L_O]

Prices need to drop IMO. £15 instead of £20 will get a hell of a lot more through the doors.

But it's not always been the case that the crowds plummet. It just seems to be this season. Leeds' game against Hull last week was our lowest ever play off crowd. Our actual average playoff crowds since '98 before that Hull game was just over 14k.

Saying that, out of the 7,800 at Huddersfield on Friday there were pushing 5,000 Leeds fans. If Huddersfield would have turned out like it was a league game there would have been well over 10k.

 

[WireMan]

Prices need to drop IMO. £15 instead of £20 will get a hell of a lot more through the doors.

But it's not always been the case that the crowds plummet. It just seems to be this season. Leeds' game against Hull last week was our lowest ever play off crowd. Our actual average playoff crowds since '98 before that Hull game was just over 14k.

Saying that, out of the 7,800 at Huddersfield on Friday there were pushing 5,000 Leeds fans. If Huddersfield would have turned out like it was a league game there would have been well over 10k.

The playoffs are suposed to be the big finale to the season though. The world cup semi final is not cheaper than a qualifying game.

Leeds fans may not of turned up this year because of the likelyhood of them winning. This is not a pop at Leeds (although thats fun) because ALL clubs are the same. Which brings the problem that in a playoff series of 8 teams, only 3 sets of fans actually think they can win, and one set (Leeds) who are beginnng to warm to the idea.

Fan wise. Both Hull clubs gave up before they started, hence low crowds, the Giants gave up after 10 mins of the first game, hence the low crowd a week later, and the French were never going to bring anyone over on short notice but to be fair had a good last game at there place.


That coupled with the fact that Saints vs Wigan is turning into Celtic vs Rangers in Scotland. This will be the 6th meeting of the teams when they play next week. Its to many.

 

[Johnny_L_O]

That was the luck of the draw though. It's not like the RFL could predict they would get 3 unscheduled games against each other throughout the year.

As for prices, I went to watch a game of NRL at Wollongong a few years back and got a ticket on the Hill for $8... $8!!!! At the time that was £3 and a bit. Granted they are subsidised by the league clubs but still. Atthe time it was £17 to go watch Leeds.

With the current standard of the league though I would cut it back down to 5 or 6 teams. If they keep it 8 though they need to sort the format out. Its not right that 2 teams should play each other twice unless 1 earns that right in the Grand final.

 

[WireMan]

That was the luck of the draw though. It's not like the RFL could predict they would get 3 unscheduled games against each other throughout the year.

As for prices, I went to watch a game of NRL at Wollongong a few years back and got a ticket on the Hill for $8... $8!!!! At the time that was £3 and a bit. Granted they are subsidised by the league clubs but still. Atthe time it was £17 to go watch Leeds.

With the current standard of the league though I would cut it back down to 5 or 6 teams. If they keep it 8 though they need to sort the format out. Its not right that 2 teams should play each other twice unless 1 earns that right in the Grand final.

Well it was down to luck a bit, but they are two top sides so there is always a fair chance they may meet in the cup, and the current playoff structure means they both should get to the semi final stage having already played each other. So its not just lucky.

As for prices, was that $8 a finals game? Also i think the fact that they were subsidised also means its easier to charge less. If we expect clubs to charge £8 for a game then we are in the realms of part time players.

 

[langpark]

13,134 was the crowd for the same match during the season...

I have never seen the JJB that empty before... Something is seriously wrong. I don't know if this is the place to discuss it, but here is the system I'd go with;

It's basically Mcintyre but THERE ARE NO SECOND CHANCES, it's do-or-die from the start.

Week 1;
1 vs 8
2 vs 7
3 vs 6
4 vs 5

Week 2;
1/8 vs 4/5
2/7 vs 3/6

Week 3;
GF

A three week finals series so that fans, knowing that it's a knockout from the start will get right behind their teams.

A home match and playing a weaker team is enough reward for finishing higher on the ladder, no second chances are necessary...

 

[deluded pom?]

Fan wise. Both Hull clubs gave up before they started, hence low crowds,

Don't talk bollocks. Hull took a decent following to Leeds and Rovers had to play in France with only a week to organise anything. :roll:

 

[LunarPark]

I'd return to the 6 team playoffs, either the previous system or a slight re-jig. Expanding the playoffs has proved unnecessary and mediocre. I've heard calls for scraping the playoffs altogether which is probably a bit too backward but the RFL definitely need to sit up and take action of some kind.


Also like to add that these playoffs haven't excitied me at all so far this year. Hopefully that changes this week.

 

[WireMan]

Don't talk bollocks. Hull took a decent following to Leeds and Rovers had to play in France with only a week to organise anything. :roll:

Yeah thats why the crowd at Leeds was a near sell out.

Leeds v Hull FC - 9,075 (14,809 for same fixture during the season)

oh...

I'd return to the 6 team playoffs, either the previous system or a slight re-jig. Expanding the playoffs has proved unnecessary and mediocre. I've heard calls for scraping the playoffs altogether which is probably a bit too backward but the RFL definitely need to sit up and take action of some kind.


Also like to add that these playoffs haven't excitied me at all so far this year. Hopefully that changes this week.

Problem is, due to a lack of relegation a top 6 would of made a lot of games pointless.

What the RFL have to do is stop messing around. If we want an NFL stlye super bowl and finish we need a NFL style league. If we want a super bowl style final after a round robin league then you get what we have. A hyped up premiership contest that fans are staying away from.

Its upto the RFL. Do we go for it or not? 2 Leagues of 7. Top 2 in each league into semi final sunday. A big final a week later. Frees up weeks to play NRL teams and international/invitational games. Bigger crowds, easier to sell games. etc.

Or do we play in a league. Round robin. Top wins. Then onto a seperate premiership comp. Lower ticket prices, knock out comp. A nice final at the end of it.

The current mix is just pandering to sky and pandering to flat cappers. It does nothing and we end up with the last home game at Wigan having 6700 people there.

 

[VictoryFC]

Nothing to do with interest. Really just down to pricing/not being included in season ticket. Since its not a matter of interest, it should be a relatively straightforward fix one would think. Just depends whether people at the RFL take the "its better if we get X amount of people for that price than Y amount for a lower price" line or not.

 

[deluded pom?]

Yeah thats why the crowd at Leeds was a near sell out.

Sorry I hadn't realised all the Leeds supporters had turned up and it was Hull's fault the gate was a poor one. :roll:

 

[Johnny_L_O]

Lets face it... this year hasnt really impressed anyone. Only 2 games out of 6 have been competative and even 1 of those a team led by 18 with 10 left. 3 games have been big scores to nil and the crowds have been down. Now I am a big believer in the playoffs but since this new system has come in its really fallen off. The first year was ok because of the novelty but last year and this year its clear no ones interested. As I said earlier (not sure which thread) my big issue is the fact that the week 1 semi finalists can play each other again in week 3 if all goes to plan. Wheres the fun in that. Either scrap the 8 and make it 5/6 again or go McIntyre (sp). I think the idea of 1st v 8th is much better with the bottom ranked losers dropping out. It's much fairer and makes sure theres no double matches before the GF.

 

[Evil Homer]

If anything the McIntyre is less fair than the Super League system, in week 2 this year we saw the team that finished 6th and lost in the first week on the same standing as the team that finished 4th and won in the first week.