will the titans snare Lote

[DeeGan]

Lucky for the Broncos - we can't 'break the bank' attempting to sign him.

Here we go ... :roll:

And why is it the Gold Coast Titans would be "breaking the bank" in an effort to sign Lote?

Do you honestly believe Michael Searle would put our club in such a position after just being re-instated in to the competition? Think about what you're typing.

The majority, if not all of the top 25, have signed for "unders". Scott Prince and Luke Bailey for example could have signed for a lot more at other NRL clubs though too pay cuts for a chance to be part of the debutant club.

The Brisbane Broncos roster boasts: Darren Lockyer, Karmichael Hunt, Tame Tupou, Brent Tate, Shaun Berrigan, Justin Hodges, Petero Civoniceva, David Stagg, Corey Parker, Sam Thaiday, Brad Thorn, Tonie Carroll and Dane Carlaw - all Origin or International players. Add to that budding representatives Michael Ennis, Darius Boyd and Greg Eastwood - I think it is safe to say that if any club in the competition was at risk of "breaking the bank", it would be your Brisbane Broncos.

Do the math - I think a good guesstimate would put Brisbane way ahead of the Titans and any other club in the NRL competition in terms of spending the allocated $4.0M cap.

What it comes down is this: we "expert" fans are not privy to how clubs structure their annual spending when it comes to the cap. There is a lot of slicing and dicing to best ensure clubs do not exceed $4.0M.

Can the Titans fit a marquee typle player in Lote? I would hazard a guess we are as best positioned as any to make a play on the dual international.

 

[McCrud]

Here we go ... :roll:

And why is it the Gold Coast Titans would be "breaking the bank" in an effort to sign Lote?

Do you honestly believe Michael Searle would put our club in such a position after just being re-instated in to the competition? Think about what you're typing.

The majority, if not all of the top 25, have signed for "unders". Scott Prince and Luke Bailey for example could have signed for a lot more at other NRL clubs though too pay cuts for a chance to be part of the debutant club.

The Brisbane Broncos roster boasts: Darren Lockyer, Karmichael Hunt, Tame Tupou, Brent Tate, Shaun Berrigan, Justin Hodges, Petero Civoniceva, David Stagg, Corey Parker, Sam Thaiday, Brad Thorn, Tonie Carroll and Dane Carlaw - all Origin or International players. Add to that budding representatives Michael Ennis, Darius Boyd and Greg Eastwood - I think it is safe to say that if any club in the competition was at risk of "breaking the bank", it would be your Brisbane Broncos.

Do the math - I think a good guesstimate would put Brisbane way of the Titans and any other club in the NRL competition in terms of spending the allocated $4.0M cap.

You are obviously struggling with the point I was making - it referred to FREE SALARY CAP SPACE. The Broncos don't have a lot of free room to wiggle - however clubs like yours - who according to you signed everybody for a cheap lunch - have a lot more room to accomodate Lote.

If your club wants to spend most of its free cap room buying Lote, good luck to you. The Broncos can't, therefore it's a test of Lote's loyalty to the club.

So you are insinuating that the Broncos are breaking the salary cap? Jesus, did not take you long to stick the boot in to your local rival. Feeling the strain of a controversial off-season perhaps...

If you are telling me Luke Bailey signed for the Gold Coast Titans for LESS then what he could of received at the Dragons, I'm dead-set calling you a liar. Where is your proof of this? As for Prince, I'm dubious on your claims as well.

 

[TITAN1]

Ah,keep it in your pants...:crazy:

 

[Willow]

If you are telling me Luke Bailey signed for the Gold Coast Titans for LESS then what he could of received at the Dragons, I'm dead-set calling you a liar.

Saints invited Bailey to look elsewhere as soon as they realised they had to work within their own cap.

It has been documented that Bailey wanted to stay at St George but he simply got a better offer from the Gold Coast. The Dragons let him go.
In fact, they assisted him in making it a happy transfer.

 

[DeeGan]

So you are insinuating that the Broncos are breaking the salary cap? Jesus, did not take you long to stick the boot in to your local rival. Feeling the strain of a controversial off-season perhaps...

I think it is quite clear in my post that I am not alluding to that fact.

If you are telling me Luke Bailey signed for the Gold Coast Titans for LESS then what he could of received at the Dragons, I'm dead-set calling you a liar. Where is your proof of this? As for Prince, I'm dubious on your claims as well.

Let's look at Scott Prince:

The Clive Churchill medallist has agreed to a deal worth a reported $1.4 million -- about $100,000 less per season than he would receive at the Tigers.

Source: http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/417227/671965

Lukle Bailey could have gotten more $$$ from the Stg Illawarra Dragons who have lost Trent Barrett, Shaun Timmins, Colin Best, Clint Greenshields, Aaron Gorrell, Matt Bickerstaff, Daryl Millard, Reece Simmonds and Michael Henderson from their first grade squad.

Bailey made no secret in the fact he was looking to test himself on the open market after June 30. 2005. I will conceed one point, initially, the Dragons would not have been in a position to offer the $$$ Bailey was going to be looking at to stay at the club.

I have no "beef" with the Brisbane Broncos - in fact - I hope we can emulate their success on the field over the coming years.

It seems "wires were crossed" here with your original post - the written word on a forum like this can be easily misinterpreted ... I am sure you would agree.

 

[DeeGan]

Bailey signing: http://www.abc.net.au/sport/content/200506/s1401314.htm

Speaking today, Bailey said that the chance to start at a new club was the main factor in his decision to leave the Dragons.

He said he told his manager at the start of the year that if the Gold Coast was successful in its NRL licence application he wanted to move.

"I think it's just a team starting from scratch, which sounds appealing to me," he said.

"As I said before, I got family up there. I've been with the club, the Steelers and the Dragons for over 10 years so I thought it'd be a good challenge."

 

[TITAN1]

Compelling arguement,deegan..probably enough to keep horsehead quiet!;-)

 

[Willow]

The thing about Bailey was that he was a big coup for the Titans. In relative terms, he came as bargain. And he was signed over 12 months ago.
In fact, Bailey's signing to the Gold Coast was reported in the Dragons 2005 season review.
Quite frankly Le Kook, you couldn't have picked on a more worse example.

A combination of events:
Bailey was invited by Saints to look elsewhere.
Bailey saw the Gold Coast as a new challenge.
He said it was good for his family.

The Dragons encouraged him to go to the Gold Coast.

Plus I understand the money was close to what he was getting at Saints in 2005. The problem for Bailey was that if wanted to stay at Saints, he would have to fall in line with the club's burgeoning cap issues. So many juniors rising to the top, becoming internationals, the St George Illawarra nursery was becoming a victim of its own success, and players were being cut loose. You only have to look at some of the stars Saints have released in recent years to know this.

The way the Dragons and Bailey's management handled this should be applauded. As much I hated to see Bailey go, I was impressed in how it was done. No fuss, all parties in agreement. A similar thing occurred when Michael Henderson was also signed by the Titans.

I have a feeling that when it comes to business, the Dragons and the Titans get on well.

 

[McCrud]

Saints invited Bailey to look elsewhere as soon as they realised they had to work within their own cap.

It has been documented that Bailey wanted to stay at St George but he simply got a better offer from the Gold Coast. The Dragons let him go.
In fact, they assisted him in making it a happy transfer.

So...that means I'm correct, no?

 

[McCrud]

It seems "wires were crossed" here with your original post - the written word on a forum like this can be easily misinterpreted ... I am sure you would agree.

Agreed.

 

[McCrud]

The way the Dragons and Bailey's management handled this should be applauded. As much I hated to see Bailey go, I was impressed in how it was done. No fuss, all parties in agreement. A similar thing occurred when Michael Henderson was also signed by the Titans.

I have a feeling that when it comes to business, the Dragons and the Titans get on well.

Wow - quite a strong dissenting opinion there mate.:shock:

 

[McCrud]

To continue the discussion, here is a very interesting article:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21119173-2722,00.html

Does not sound promising for any RL team to be honest.

 

[Willow]

So...that means I'm correct, no?

no?

No.

I mean, given the research and all that... he was signed in 2005 after all. Bailey was released, invited to look elsewhere. Did you know that?

I thought you were inferring that Bailey was signed above the salary cap. Are now telling us that this is not the case?

 

[McCrud]

no?

No.

I mean, given the research and all that... he was signed in 2005 after all. Bailey was released, invited to look elsewhere. Did you know that?

I thought you were inferring that Bailey was signed above the salary cap. Are now telling us that this is not the case?

WTF are you on about?

I simply made the argument that I couldn't believe that Bailey and Prince took less then what they would have been offered at their original clubs to join the Titans. This argument was made because DeeGan wrote that these two players accepted Titans offers that were less then what other NRL clubs offered financially.

You then wrote that the Titans made a better financial offer then the Dragons - therefore validating my argument.

I don't know what tangent you have gone on, but I never argued that Bailey was fitted into the cap through any type of 'rort' or anything illegal. I was simply questioning the validity of DeeGan's claim that Bailey and Prince choose the Gold Coast due to the 'aura' of the club and not the money that was offered to them.

 

[Willow]

WTF are you on about?

I just asked if you you were inferring that Bailey was signed above the salary cap.

Yes or no.

No offence but everything else you said was a bit of a defensive ramble.

 

[DeeGan]

WTF are you on about?

I simply made the argument that I couldn't believe that Bailey and Prince took less then what they would have been offered at their original clubs to join the Titans. This argument was made because DeeGan wrote that these two players accepted Titans offers that were less then what other NRL clubs offered financially.

You then wrote that the Titans made a better financial offer then the Dragons - therefore validating my argument.

I don't know what tangent you have gone on, but I never argued that Bailey was fitted into the cap through any type of 'rort' or anything illegal. I was simply questioning the validity of DeeGan's claim that Bailey and Prince choose the Gold Coast due to the 'aura' of the club and not the money that was offered to them.

I will stand corrected on the claim made re: Luke Bailey for the moment though reiterate Scott Prince could have got more from the Wests Tigers (check link on pg.2).

Luke Bailey signed in 2005 - it seems we were able to match if not better the Dragons offer.

 

[Willow]

I can see where people can get confused about the word 'offer' and think it immediately translates into a higher paypacket. In Bailey's case, I don't know the exact dollars detail, I don't think that's widely known. But I do know the prime reason for him making the move to the Gold Coast had less to do with money and a lot more to with the actual term of the contract. The Titans 'offer' was for four years - a very good offer according to Bailey.

Here's what Luke Bailey said in 2005:

"Originally my objective was to stay at the Dragons but when we started the year so bad contract talks dragged on a bit and I started to think its hard to get a three-year deal now, how hard will it be when that time runs out?

"When the option came to get four years at the Gold Coast from 2007 it was one I found hard to pass up..."
http://www.showroom.com.au/dragons/dragonshistory/history_stgeorge8b.htm#2005

Bailey was basically after job security for his family. Of course the Titans are not paying peanuts and all top tier NRL players are on lucrative contracts, but with Bailey it really wasn't about the money. The offer was attractive to Bailey mainly because it was a long term contract, something the Dragons couldn't guarantee.

I said this before, signing Bailey was a coup for the Gold Coast - they were simply in the right place at the right time.

 

[McCrud]

I just asked if you you were inferring that Bailey was signed above the salary cap.

Yes or no.

No offence but everything else you said was a bit of a defensive ramble.

If you can't read my response and realise I never inferred anything of the sort - I'm not going to waste my time dealing with you.

 

[Willow]

I'm not going to waste my time dealing with you.

Except you just did. lol.
Are you always such a testy little fella?

 

[Willow]

btw, I never said: "the Titans made a better financial offer then the Dragons" as you claimed. That's just you putting words into my post. And I never validated your argument. Again, this is just a claim you made up.

Your way of arguing is to call people liars who disagree with you, and then fall into a whinging heap when you've been struck out. To put it bluntly, you can dish it out, but can't take it.

In addition, you seemed to be concerned about people not reading your response. I suggest you try reading other responses before attempting to misrepresent what was said.

Now here it is again...

I don't know the exact terms of the offer to Bailey. I don't know if it was more money annually than what he was getting at the Dragons. I never made a claim about his wage packet. That was just your misreading. I imagine Bailey was offered something close to what he was used to getting in 2005 at Saints, and there was an annual pay rise of some sort built in (as with most contracts) but again, I don't know if this is the case.

What we do know is that Bailey was offered a longer term deal and the Dragons couldn't guarantee the same job security. Other players were being let go because Saints couldn't afford to keep them under the cap, and there were a number of young forwards coming through the lower grades. So the four year guarantee from the Gold Coast definitely got Bailey's attention. That's why the family man in Bailey saw the Gold Coast offer as too good to pass up. It was prinarily about job security. His quotes in the media back up this view. He never once said it was because there was more money, although we accept that NRL players are well paid.

Plus it looks like DeeGan has successfully shown that Scott Prince was not paid more.