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Joshuatheeel

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
19,663
Agree


He is a project well worth persevering with.

An impatient coach would have done the same thing with Latrell Mitchell. His debut in FG was 2016 and he is only now slowly starting to bare fruit. Everyone saw his potential, but his errors and other faults made him a liability most of the time. Will be not far off an origin prospect soon.

Mitchell has size on his side and he is a powerful runner, so could play a few positions.

French really can only play fullback - yeah he can score a try on the wing but can't ruck it out satisfactory enough for a winger due to his size.

What other position can he play?

Anyhow I hope I am wrong (and you right) and he improves enough to hold a long term wing spot.
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
74,220
Mitchell has size on his side and he is a powerful runner, so could play a few positions.

French really can only play fullback - yeah he can score a try on the wing but can't ruck it out satisfactory enough for a winger due to his size.

What other position can he play?

Anyhow I hope I am wrong (and you right) and he improves enough to hold a long term wing spot.

My point was not to compare the two players. Moreso it was to use Latrell as an example that some players are worth sticking with.
 

lingard

Coach
Messages
11,265
I am always happy to acknowledge when people raise good points.

I also don’t believe I overestimate how many whingers and/or negative people that there are. It’s not everyone but it’s certainly more than two.

Baz and I aren’t the only ones who have commented on it. Whenever we lose or go through a bad trot multiple posters completely lose perspective. Happens all the time.

Anyway, I just made one observation and was not worked up about it when I made it. I was just shit stirring like I always do.

It must have hit a nerve as you appear more interested and trying to highlight that I am wrong than I ever was in making the point I made.

It didn't exactly hit a nerve, Gaz. It's just that a bit of a culture has developed whereby any fan (and that's all we are) who vents when things are going bad, is labelled a death-rider or whinger. I hate that (even though maybe I'm not being labelled with that myself). A lot of these 'whingers', though reactionary (and who of us isn't at times), are very loyal and knowledgable fans.
To call them deathriders and whingers is indulging in a form of political correctness that I hate.
I have another interesting observation.
I put Pou Pou Escobar on 'ignore' about a month ago. Since then I have been able to think far more objectively about the situation Parra find themselves in (since the forum ceased to be fans just venting and processing, him arguing against them, and them coming up with more 'whinging' arguments to counter him). Because of that I've become far less reactionary in my thinking (and maybe less of a 'whinger'). From what I can gather, I needn't have bothered 'ignoring' him, since he seems to have taken a break from here himself. And there's the funny thing. MOST posters are now taking a more philosophical view of things lately (and I don't just mean since our first win; I mean over the past few weeks). Have you not noticed there are now fewer 'whingers'?
Pou encourages 'whingeing', sadly. He encourages people to argue that the coach is f**ked, long after they would have normally mellowed following an initial dummy spit. He did it with Kearney and he's doing it with Arthur. That's why I say there aren't many 'whingers' on this forum; because there aren't.
 

Gary Gutful

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Messages
52,036
It didn't exactly hit a nerve, Gaz. It's just that a bit of a culture has developed whereby any fan (and that's all we are) who vents when things are going bad, is labelled a death-rider or whinger. I hate that (even though maybe I'm not being labelled with that myself). A lot of these 'whingers', though reactionary (and who of us isn't at times), are very loyal and knowledgable fans.
To call them deathriders and whingers is indulging in a form of political correctness that I hate.
I have another interesting observation.
I put Pou Pou Escobar on 'ignore' about a month ago. Since then I have been able to think far more objectively about the situation Parra find themselves in (since the forum ceased to be fans just venting and processing, him arguing against them, and them coming up with more 'whinging' arguments to counter him). Because of that I've become far less reactionary in my thinking (and maybe less of a 'whinger'). From what I can gather, I needn't have bothered 'ignoring' him, since he seems to have taken a break from here himself. And there's the funny thing. MOST posters are now taking a more philosophical view of things lately (and I don't just mean since our first win; I mean over the past few weeks). Have you not noticed there are now fewer 'whingers'?
Pou encourages 'whingeing', sadly. He encourages people to argue that the coach is f**ked, long after they would have normally mellowed following an initial dummy spit. He did it with Kearney and he's doing it with Arthur. That's why I say there aren't many 'whingers' on this forum; because there aren't.
I don't think any and every fan who vents gets called a 'whinger'. Not even close.

I also don't think a 'culture' has developed either. All that's happened is that a few people have called out a few other people for constantly bitching and moaning about every last thing about the club and offering nothing intelligent in the process. Clearly, some people felt that the reaction to Parra's poor start and the way that other people turned on BA so early in 2018 was the 'final straw'.

These good folks have responded in a way that is customary for this forum - they've ripped the piss out of those complaining and called them 'whingers'. What you've failed to acknowledge is how the 'whingers' also rip the piss out of people who appear to support the club without question calling them snowflakes etc. Baz, Pou, myself and even Gronk have copped these accusations over the years. It goes both ways, Ivor!

As for Pou, I think it is easy to blame him for everything but I think that is far too simplistic. Some people seem obsessed with trying to 'one up' him. These people are just as responsible for what transpires and are exactly the sort of people that should have him on ignore.

You raise some interesting points but lets agree to disagree. Good discussion.
 

lingard

Coach
Messages
11,265
Mitchell has size on his side and he is a powerful runner, so could play a few positions.

French really can only play fullback - yeah he can score a try on the wing but can't ruck it out satisfactory enough for a winger due to his size.

What other position can he play?

Anyhow I hope I am wrong (and you right) and he improves enough to hold a long term wing spot.

It's very unfortunate, but the salary cap forces clubs to be ruthless. I think French would be a good fullback at a club with a good half, five eight, hooker, and a well-balanced set of forwards. He might slay it at Melbourne or Easts. As it stands right now, he's no good to us and we should let him go. However, if we can buy a decent hooker and balance our pack he would probably be fine at fullback. Big question now is Gutho. If he becomes our permanent fullback, I say let Bevan go
 
Messages
19,217
Agree


He is a project well worth persevering with.

An impatient coach would have done the same thing with Latrell Mitchell. His debut in FG was 2016 and he is only now slowly starting to bare fruit. Everyone saw his potential, but his errors and other faults made him a liability most of the time. Will be not far off an origin prospect soon.

French is 2 years older than Mitchell. Mitchell debuted in FG at 18. French debuted at the age Latrell is now (20).
 

Gronk

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
74,220
It's very unfortunate, but the salary cap forces clubs to be ruthless. I think French would be a good fullback at a club with a good half, five eight, hooker, and a well-balanced set of forwards. He might slay it at Melbourne or Easts. As it stands right now, he's no good to us and we should let him go. However, if we can buy a decent hooker and balance our pack he would probably be fine at fullback. Big question now is Gutho. If he becomes our permanent fullback, I say let Bevan go
Well I say that nobody scores such a swag of tries like he has without significant talent. Teams have a game plan for Bev now. He is playing busted and no doubt has a touch of 2nd year syndrome about him.

Keeper.
 

hineyrulz

Post Whore
Messages
149,500
It's very unfortunate, but the salary cap forces clubs to be ruthless. I think French would be a good fullback at a club with a good half, five eight, hooker, and a well-balanced set of forwards. He might slay it at Melbourne or Easts. As it stands right now, he's no good to us and we should let him go. However, if we can buy a decent hooker and balance our pack he would probably be fine at fullback. Big question now is Gutho. If he becomes our permanent fullback, I say let Bevan go
I hate to say it but i agree with this, he's a great young kid but Guth is our long term fullback and his money could be used much better somewhere else. A real winger, a dummy half or in the middle.
 

Eelogical

Referee
Messages
22,620
Gutho has been the best #1 we have used this year.................and last year. Anyone else playing in the 1 jumper should be doing so only because of injury reasons, and we don't want that.
 

lingard

Coach
Messages
11,265
I don't think any and every fan who vents gets called a 'whinger'. Not even close.

I also don't think a 'culture' has developed either. All that's happened is that a few people have called out a few other people for constantly bitching and moaning about every last thing about the club and offering nothing intelligent in the process. Clearly, some people felt that the reaction to Parra's poor start and the way that other people turned on BA so early in 2018 was the 'final straw'.

These good folks have responded in a way that is customary for this forum - they've ripped the piss out of those complaining and called them 'whingers'. What you've failed to acknowledge is how the 'whingers' also rip the piss out of people who appear to support the club without question calling them snowflakes etc. Baz, Pou, myself and even Gronk have copped these accusations over the years. It goes both ways, Ivor!

As for Pou, I think it is easy to blame him for everything but I think that is far too simplistic. Some people seem obsessed with trying to 'one up' him. These people are just as responsible for what transpires and are exactly the sort of people that should have him on ignore.

You raise some interesting points but lets agree to disagree. Good discussion.

Absolutely I can agree to disagree. Not a problem. You make some interesting points as well.
For the record, I don't blame Pou for everything (and I certainly don't think he deliberately sets out to cause problems; I think it's just an unfortunate byproduct of the obsessive way he has to argue things to the bitter end). But the result is the same, and it's just something I've noticed.
 

Gary Gutful

Post Whore
Messages
52,036
Also, Gutho can be great from a range of different positions. That provides benefits that we should exploit where necessary.

There is nothing wrong with having a ‘utility’ player. In fact, they are pretty f**ken handy.
 
Messages
19,217
Anyway, I'm thinking of competing with Hindy for electrical business. Please note that I have no electrical qualifications or training, but I know what most of the symbols mean (within reason) and find that wearing rubber shoes and the existence of circuit breakers gets me out of trouble most times I might turn up on the day you book me, but I might get a better offer. Oh, I'm not cheap either, I'll charge you consulting rates. Things I've done without dying: changed spark plug on mower (twice), replace circuit board on coffee roaster (three times), replaces control board on espresso machine (once), replaced internal hard drive on PVR. As you can see, I'm nearly there.
 

lingard

Coach
Messages
11,265
Don’t underestimate the impact that injury is having on Bevan.

Far too early to give up on him just yet and lots of other higher priority areas where we should be ‘ruthless’.

You could be right. Then again, we've heard similar arguments about Pritchard over the past four years. I hope Bevan doesn't turn into a Pritchard.
 

Eelogical

Referee
Messages
22,620
Anyway, I'm thinking of competing with Hindy for electrical business. Please note that I have no electrical qualifications or training, but I know what most of the symbols mean (within reason) and find that wearing rubber shoes and the existence of circuit breakers gets me out of trouble most times I might turn up on the day you book me, but I might get a better offer. Oh, I'm not cheap either, I'll charge you consulting rates. Things I've done without dying: changed spark plug on mower (twice), replace circuit board on coffee roaster (three times), replaces control board on espresso machine (once), replaced internal hard drive on PVR. As you can see, I'm nearly there.

I have a bulb that needs replacing in the dunny. How much and when can you come around?
 

T.S Quint

Coach
Messages
13,738
It didn't exactly hit a nerve, Gaz. It's just that a bit of a culture has developed whereby any fan (and that's all we are) who vents when things are going bad, is labelled a death-rider or whinger. I hate that (even though maybe I'm not being labelled with that myself). A lot of these 'whingers', though reactionary (and who of us isn't at times), are very loyal and knowledgable fans.
To call them deathriders and whingers is indulging in a form of political correctness that I hate.
I have another interesting observation.
I put Pou Pou Escobar on 'ignore' about a month ago. Since then I have been able to think far more objectively about the situation Parra find themselves in (since the forum ceased to be fans just venting and processing, him arguing against them, and them coming up with more 'whinging' arguments to counter him). Because of that I've become far less reactionary in my thinking (and maybe less of a 'whinger'). From what I can gather, I needn't have bothered 'ignoring' him, since he seems to have taken a break from here himself. And there's the funny thing. MOST posters are now taking a more philosophical view of things lately (and I don't just mean since our first win; I mean over the past few weeks). Have you not noticed there are now fewer 'whingers'?
Pou encourages 'whingeing', sadly. He encourages people to argue that the coach is f**ked, long after they would have normally mellowed following an initial dummy spit. He did it with Kearney and he's doing it with Arthur. That's why I say there aren't many 'whingers' on this forum; because there aren't.

I don't see why Pou should be blamed for others getting upset about him putting across his point. The man likes to argue, fair enough, but he does it in a reasonable way.
He prefers to see that the sky is not falling. He doesn't jump to conclusions. He gets called out on this often, to which he fights back, just as he calls out those who do tend to have knee-jerk reactions to things.

He seems like a pretty rational guy. He goes overboard some times, sure. But I like to hear opinions from both sides of an argument, and he normally offers up a good one from his.

Our club is pretty miserable. We've been a laughing stock for years, and things don't seem to be on the improve. We have every right to be negative about how the club and team has been progressing. Good posters who come up with ideas and arguments and can put them across well in this forum (such as yourself, mjc, Bazal, Barry, Joshua, Eele, among others) are great to read. But those 'The sky is falling' posters, you know the ones, who have barely anything of interest to say, while expecting the club to do every quick fix necessary and if it doesn't happen then we are all just accepting mediocrity (when in actual fact, they are accepting it themselves as long as they continue to be Parra fans).

We all know who these posters are.
They are the ones with the snarky comments normally aimed at what other posters have said about the team in the preseason like, "Its a good thing we have a very talented team" and so forth.

People can complain about us not having signed big props in the offseason all they like, but we all know that the club had already recognised that they need some size. It's just that some of those people can't seem to grasp that it's not as easy as just going out and signing the players you want. There are negotiations. They have to fit your needs. The club has to fit their needs. We have a salary cap to adhere to. Many, many factors.

Anyway, I think I have had quite the rant here now. I can't even remember how I started this post anymore, haha.
 
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