Five Gone - Confirmed

[Slippery Morris]

In terms of backs they have Duffty, Perreira, Mann, Aitken, Lafai, Lomax, Nene. I can't see any one better out there available than these 7. That leaves 2 spare as back up. No need for backs. You can even throw in Jai Field but he is a great back up for the halves.

Saints need more forwards depth for the bench.

What if Saints move Hunt to No.9 and Field to 7? McInness was good last season but Hunt would be much better. McInness can be used on the bench.

 

[hazzbeen]

Let's just hope there are no Cooks amongst them , as our lot could not identify he would be the next Australian hooker .... He came back to us after leaving ( I think that's right ) and we still let him go ...

 

[denis preston]

Herbert was a very talented and versatile prospect. It is hard for me to understand why SGI did not want to retain him given the poor form shown by our outside backs and the question mark of Dufty. Herbert and Lomax have been selected as the best ISP centres for 2018. I wouldn't be surprised to see him become a star for the Warriors.

I suggest if WTC's thread on Jubilee is on the money than there is a reason we didn't renew a outside backs contract ,even though he had a great year in the reggies Same goes for Garrick & Matherson. Must be a high profile player like he says !

 

[BennyV]

In terms of backs they have Duffty, Perreira, Mann, Aitken, Lafai, Lomax, Nene. I can't see any one better out there available than these 7. That leaves 2 spare as back up. No need for backs. You can even throw in Jai Field but he is a great back up for the halves.

Saints need more forwards depth for the bench.

What if Saints move Hunt to No.9 and Field to 7? McInness was good last season but Hunt would be much better. McInness can be used on the bench.

Out of those, maybe Lomax and Nene would get a start at other top 8 clubs. None of the rest would. We need better.

 

[baggygreen man]

Doesn't have it

All eligible Kiwis and Pacific Islanders should be banned from playing in the NRL. Why should Australia nurture the careers of our future foes. MARSTERS AND HERBERT ARE WELCOME TO LEAVE ASAP. We want only Australian eligible footballers.

 

[Saints Forever]

We can't keep them all I am afraid.

Sele will become a handy FG player given the chance. He isn't big enough to be a front rower.

He is not going to displace JDB, Sims brothers, Vaughan or Blake Lawrie any time soon.

Host and Leilua are different types of players so Sele misses out on a contract.

Reuben Garrick has no progressed fast enough and in fact went backwards this year.

Pat Herbert probably wasn't offered a contract because Millward and McGregor felt his best position is centre.

For me, Herbert was competing with Mann for backline utility player.

Lomax, Mann, Lafai and Aitken must have been considered better centres.

McDonald, Pereira, Mann and Lomax must have been considered better wingers. I don't see Herbert as a winger.

Dufty &Field must have been considered better Fullbacks. I may have signed him as a Fullback or as a utility player.

 

[Wittenberg]

Herbert and Sele are players who will develop well elsewhere. It's amazing how quickly we write off some players. Prior and Beale wearing their premiership rings they won with Cronulla come to mind. Remember they weren't first graders according to some. Herbert will play first grade, Sele, well the jury is out there but we will see.

 

[Saint_JimmyG]

Basically though:

Ravalawa replaces Garrick
Pearson replaces Herbert (at least Pearson has played a few NRL games)
Blacker replaces Sele

All ISP

Has Blacket played ISP yet? I thought he was an under 20s player at this stage?

 

[Carlton]

I have no issue with the players that have been let go. They are young had a chance to show what they have in ISP and did not look like they would be outstanding first graders. The sensible thing is to let them go and sign some other young players and give them the chance to show what they have. If they dont show they are potentially top first graders then move them on when the time comes and try again.

Garrick had a chance but did not show he could step up.
Herbert was a great ISP player but did not show the speed or defence to be a top notch first grader.
Sele solid, good ISP player but did not look like he could be more than a passable first grader.

Some posters keep on about signing solid no frills back up first graders. For me the same applies to juniors. If they are not showing they will be top of the tree first graders dont persist with them. I say this knowing we need a certain amount of depth both experienced and youth and this is the balancing act of recruitment.

 

[ViceVersa]

I'm going to miss Ham Salad..

 

[Old Timer]

I have no issue with the players that have been let go. They are young had a chance to show what they have in ISP and did not look like they would be outstanding first graders. The sensible thing is to let them go and sign some other young players and give them the chance to show what they have. If they dont show they are potentially top first graders then move them on when the time comes and try again.

Garrick had a chance but did not show he could step up.
Herbert was a great ISP player but did not show the speed or defence to be a top notch first grader.
Sele solid, good ISP player but did not look like he could be more than a passable first grader.

Some posters keep on about signing solid no frills back up first graders. For me the same applies to juniors. If they are not showing they will be top of the tree first graders dont persist with them. I say this knowing we need a certain amount of depth both experienced and youth and this is the balancing act of recruitment.

Amusing how we let go our so called didn’t make its (some we never bothered to find out) whilst we then happily sign and embrace other clubs didn’t make its.
I am pretty sure our coaching staff can’t make other clubs cast offs into 1st graders but there is a chance other coaches can maybe do it with our cast offs.
IMO more chance of us being bitten on the arse than the other way round.
Vaughan the only exception to the rule that I can see.

 

[denis preston]

Whilst I probably agree that they had to go it still would have been interseting to see how Hubert performed in one or two games in the NRL. Some players lift a peg or two playing a higher standard.

 

[True_Believer]

Hopefully the guys can further their careers elsewhere. Sometimes you need a different environment to be able to take that step forward. Cook is a good example - it took him 2 clubs to find an environment he could thrive in.

Same with Vaughn and Sims here - they take that step out of their current club and find they take great leaps forward somewhere else.

As others have said, it's a balancing act and I could imagine a tough thing to balance players and spending. Hopefully any new recruits we have will thrive in our environment.

 

[Carlton]

Whilst I probably agree that they had to go it still would have been interseting to see how Hubert performed in one or two games in the NRL. Some players lift a peg or two playing a higher standard.

I also would have liked to have seen Herbert given a run in first grade, I personally think he would have been a better option at fullback than Dufty.

The thing I think is funny is the idea that the only way to determine if a player is worth persevering with is that they have to be given a run in first grade to see how they go. If they are not showing they are a class above ISP then they are fair game not to be played in first grade and potentially moved on. In all honesty we have some very good ISP players but they are not standouts demanding time in first grade.

 

[possm]

I also would have liked to have seen Herbert given a run in first grade, I personally think he would have been a better option at fullback than Dufty.

The thing I think is funny is the idea that the only way to determine if a player is worth persevering with is that they have to be given a run in first grade to see how they go. If they are not showing they are a class above ISP then they are fair game not to be played in first grade and potentially moved on. In all honesty we have some very good ISP players but they are not standouts demanding time in first grade.

Herbert was outstanding at centre and fullback in ISP. He and Lomax were recognised as the best ISP centres this season. So it is hard to understand why we let go one of the best ISP centres when our first choice centres, Aitken and Lafai struggled to find form in the second half of this season and were our worst performers in early season when our forwards were on fire.

 

[Dragonslayer]

I also would have liked to have seen Herbert given a run in first grade, I personally think he would have been a better option at fullback than Dufty.

The thing I think is funny is the idea that the only way to determine if a player is worth persevering with is that they have to be given a run in first grade to see how they go. If they are not showing they are a class above ISP then they are fair game not to be played in first grade and potentially moved on. In all honesty we have some very good ISP players but they are not standouts demanding time in first grade.

Herbert's biggest problem was his defense and that's what probably kept him out of 1st grade.
His ISP tackle efficiency was only 68% and 50 tackle misses.
Periera, for comparison, had a tackle efficiency at 84% and only missed 11 tackles.

 

[possm]

Herbert's biggest problem was his defense and that's what probably kept him out of 1st grade.
His ISP tackle efficiency was only 68% and 50 tackle misses.
Periera, for comparison, had a tackle efficiency at 84% and only missed 11 tackles.

Great job Dragonslayer, do you have the same stats for Lomax, Aitken and Lafai?

 

[New Dragon]

T

More interesting for me were the names not mentioned:

Nene - very strong mail he's gone. Maybe waiting to after the PM1X game and then say he requested a release to be closer to home.

Allgood - remains our only unsigned player but not mentioned as retiring or not being re-signed. Unless he is droppung back to a tier2 player.

Matheson Johns - wasn't he supposed to have signed with Penrith? Yet, he was presented last night as our young Dragons centre.

Thats what happens when you cut deals with players. Here’s a local junior who ends up playing as the under 20s origin centre and wins our player of the year and is not able to be offered a development contract because the 6th one was given to Hayden Lomax obviously as part of zacs deal. I’m only speculating of course but come on, there is No other explanation as he was fringe 20s and Trent peoples or Jayden Morgan were being picked in front of him. Disgraceful in my view and a bad message to our juniors. You got to remember this development system is new so not like before where you could train a player with first grade to encourage him these aare prized positions. So panthers jump on him and we loose a promising player and piss off our other good players. Great stuff... no wonder we struggle for depth.

 

[possm]

T

Thats what happens when you cut deals with players. Here’s a local junior who ends up playing as the under 20s origin centre and wins our player of the year and is not able to be offered a development contract because the 6th one was given to Hayden Lomax obviously as part of zacs deal. I’m only speculating of course but come on, there is No other explanation as he was fringe 20s and Trent peoples or Jayden Morgan were being picked in front of him. Disgraceful in my view and a bad message to our juniors. You got to remember this development system is new so not like before where you could train a player with first grade to encourage him these aare prized positions. So panthers jump on him and we loose a promising player and piss off our other good players. Great stuff... no wonder we struggle for depth.

Millward just doesn't have a clue. People think that because he can make the easy decisions (those that most on here could make), he is something special. Millward is a political appointment brokered by his father (Bob) from the Illawarra faction.

 

[Dragonslayer]

Great job Dragonslayer, do you have the same stats for Lomax, Aitken and Lafai?

Sure:

Lomax (ISP) - 88% 7 missed
Lomax (NRL) - 71% 2 missed
Lafai - 83% 28 missed
Aitken - 84% 45 missed
Dufty - 70% 39 missed
Nene - 84% 16 missed
Field (ISP) - 75% (sorry cant find stats for missed)
Tohi (ISP Part-time) 74% 20 missed
Garrick - 78% 55 missed
Johns (JF qualified player) - 87% 14 missed
Masters - 76% 26 missed

I think that covers it