Jim Beam cup expansion

[***MH***]

With the introduction of WA next season, will there be any further additions to the Jim Beam Cup competition for 2008?

I am also interested in your responses for putting forward a prospectus together to add a 3rd and even a 4th Canterbury-Bankstown team to the competition based at the Revesby Workers club and the Moorebank Sports club.

The Revesby Workers club would use 4 strong junior clubs in the area (East Hills, Milperra Colts, St. Christophers and Revesby Heights) as their foundation and help feed up and coming players.

The Moorebank/Holsworthy area is a stronghold in itself. With its soccer club already in the Sydney-wide club competition, a Jim Beam League team is only a natural progression.

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

With the introduction of WA next season, will there be any further additions to the Jim Beam Cup competition for 2008?

That would all depend on what the NSWRL (and to some extent the ARL) is trying to achieve with the Jim Beam Cup and to what extent the NRL clubs are willing to use the JBC as a development league.

I don't think the NSWRL know what they're trying to achieve. In 2003 it seemed that they wanted to create a genuine State-wide competition below the NRL - expanding the old Metro Cup out of Sydney and away from it's Western Sydney base... the vision now seems to be in limbo especially now that PL is going to be reformed somewhat to be more standalone, catering to the retro crowd.

I am also interested in your responses for putting forward a prospectus together to add a 3rd and even a 4th Canterbury-Bankstown team to the competition based at the Revesby Workers club and the Moorebank Sports club.

Moorebank used to have a club in the Metro Cup.

It's surprisingly expensive to run a JBC club and most of the organisations that would be in a position to spend the money (i.e. big Western Sydney pokie palaces) probably can't justify spending it. I seem to remember when St. Mary's dropped out of JBC they did so because it cost them $500,000 a year to run their team in the competition. I've heard that during the mid-90s Ryde-Eastwood were spending even more than that.

So it all depends on what those organisations are trying to achieve business-wise and whether the Bulldogs are willing to use them as development platforms and what kind of deal they can put together for numbers of players each week, etc.

The NSWRL will probably be allowing applications for the 2008 JBC season up until the end of this year so we have another 6 months before we know who will be in and out for 2008...

 

[Nfed]

I seem to remember when St. Mary's dropped out of JBC they did so because it cost them $500,000 a year to run their team in the competition. I've heard that during the mid-90s Ryde-Eastwood were spending even more than that.

Actually St Marys dropped out of the Metro Cup after they won in 2001 because the NSWRL refused their application to play in the NSW 1st Division (now Premier League) as the St Marys Roosters with 6 home games at Westen Weekender and the other 6 at SFS. They returned in 2003 in a joint venture with Penrith in P/L and JBC as St Marys-Penrith Cougars. The JBC team discontinued after that season when Penrith limited the JV to P/L. St Marys then dropped out P/L at the end of last season to focus on property development.

Ryde Eastwood's grants to the football club as recently as 2002 were $285,000 and an identical amount is now given to the Balmain Ryde Eastwood Tigers RLFC.

 

[The Wrong Eye]

would there be enough interest to have 2 divisions in the jim beam cup.
If rumours are correct Windsor and St Marys will not be in Penrith A grade next year but Jim Beam.Doesn't leave many 1st division sides except Brothers and Doonside.Maybe they can stand up to a 2nd division Jim Beam Cup

 

[The Engineers Room]

I think that Jim Beam Cup may merge with Premier League and they run a 2 tier competition.

The remaining NRL clubs that want to run a Premier League team would combine with the Jim Beam Cup teams and some extras as stated above and the NSW Cup (naming) would be born. All they need to do is have the grandfinal the week before the NRL and they could play NSW cup winner V Qld Cup winner on GF day.

 

[mono_mal]

Guildford announced they had registered an expression of interest in joining the Jim Beam Cup in 2008.
The club cited the end of PL as a major reason as they wished to provide juniors with further opportunities in open age league. The NSWRL has since advised PL is likely to remain in 2008 with several clubs intending to field feeder clubs, including current JBC clubs.
Financial restrictions have been mentioned in this thread though there is a large number of extremely rich leagues club that are currently contributing little to rugby league. The money in these clubs need to be further utilised for rugby league development.
The majority of NRL clubs are running at a loss currently, though the abolition of PL would save clubs approximately 500 000 to my knowledge.
It will be extremely interesting to see how the PL and JBC progress in coming years. The JBC is currently in a stronger position than ever, with 12 clubs competing and strong exposure due to Foxtel coverage.
PL clubs such as Newtown and Norths are also currently experiencing great success. If the NSWRL can successfully mould these comps into a tiered rep level open age league I believe we could have an extremely strong State Cup in operation.

 

[The Engineers Room]

So if the current 12 Jim Beam Cup teams continue and we add:
St Marys
Guildford
WA
Windsor
Doonside
Brothers
Moorebank
Revesby

That's 8 extra + some existing PL teams like:

Canberra
Newcastle
Newtown
Wests
Balmain RE
Norths

We could be looking at 2 13-14 team comps on two tiers

The problem is working out who would play in each competition. Some clubs would probably prefer to be in the lower tier and not have to fork out as much cash.

 

[The Engineers Room]

Top Tier
Canberra Raiders
Newcastle Knights
Newtown Jets
Wests Magpies
Balmain RE Tigers
North Sydney Bears
Windsor Wolves
Cabramatta Two Blues
Sydney Bulls
The Entrance Tigers
Belrose Eagles
Wentworthville Magpies
WA Reds
Mounties

Second Tier
Doonside
Brothers
Asquith Magpies
Chester Hill Rhinos
Erina Eagles
Seven Hills Demons
Shellharbour Marlins
St Marys Cougars
Guildford Owls
Moorebank
Revesby

+ add a few more

 

[Nfed]

Canberra will not be entering a team next year. Squad members who do not play in the NRL will be farmed out to Wests in P/L and Souths Logan in the Qld Cup.

 

[Henson Park Hornets]

Top Tier
Canberra Raiders
Newcastle Knights
Newtown Jets
Wests Magpies
Balmain RE Tigers
North Sydney Bears
Windsor Wolves
Cabramatta Two Blues
Sydney Bulls
The Entrance Tigers
Belrose Eagles
Wentworthville Magpies
WA Reds
Mounties

F*ck the NSWRL gives me the sh*ts.

If they'd done the right thing and promoted the PL competition in the right way, paying for weekly coverage in the telecrap, getting the PL on the ABC, having an up to date website, we would now have a viable alternative to the slop that is the NRL these days.
In the PL we have clubs that people can identify with, that they have grown up with supporting and if it was done correctly I know that people would rather watch Balmain vs Newcastle at Leichhardt, for example, paying $5 to get in and being able to let the kids run around on the hill while having a few lazy beers. At a time when the NRL is pricing it's self out of the market the NSWRL had and opportunity to aim at the families and say "We're the second best RL comp in the country, we're affordable and you can follow YOUR team - not some franchise".

If this had happened I don't think that the NRL clubs would be so willing to punt their PL teams. Instead we end up with an upgraded A-grade comp. Well done NSWRL.

Newtown successful rebirth has been due to their ability to win fans back to they way footy was, while keeping an eye on the future. If Newtown can do it, why not the NSWRL?

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

Canberra will not be entering a team next year. Squad members who do not play in the NRL will be farmed out to Wests in P/L and Souths Logan in the Qld Cup.

When was that announced?

I'm sure it will be the first of many similar announcements.

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

If this had happened I don't think that the NRL clubs would be so willing to punt their PL teams. Instead we end up with an upgraded A-grade comp. Well done NSWRL.

Newtown successful rebirth has been due to their ability to win fans back to they way footy was, while keeping an eye on the future. If Newtown can do it, why not the NSWRL?

My sense of it is that the NSWRL are hoping to copy the Newtown 'success model' for PL in 2008. I understand the selling-point of the new PL competition will be the foundation clubs Balmain, Newtown, Wests, Norths all playing one another in boutique stadiums. At least they understand the appeal of this and probably want to ramp up the 'retro' value... Though, encouraging the NSW NRL clubs to depart seems to be a bit counterproductive (robbing the competition of its biggest game - Eels v Jets at Henson.)

I guess the argument would be that for the non-Foundation NSWRL clubs the following for the PL teams dosen't have the same attraction - Eels would an the exception, but that's largely explained because of our excellent record in that grade recently. What other NRL clubs have traveling fans for their PL side?

 

[Nfed]

When was that announced?

I'm sure it will be the first of many similar announcements.

Canberra have always had a link with Souths-Logan but at the start of the season they stated they would not run a P/L squad in 2008 and that they would place 6 players with a JBC team. Then a few months ago, with P/L continuing, I read that Wests were now going to be their Sydney club.

Last I heard, Manly and Cronulla will still have stand alone teams in the top grade. Sydney Bulls will be in both grades.

 

[cumberlandsashes81]

Canberra have always had a link with Souths-Logan but at the start of the season they stated they would not run a P/L squad in 2008 and that they would place 6 players with a JBC team. Then a few months ago, with P/L continuing, I read that Wests were now going to be their Sydney club.

Last I heard, Manly and Cronulla will still have stand alone teams in the top grade. Sydney Bulls will be in both grades.

Right. So Bulls will be Canterbury's P/L Club?

I've really got to renew my subscription to Rugby League Review...

 

[Whats Doing]

Not that I have kept a real interest in the reggies foir 2008 but it would appear it will be a shambles in NSW. With the QLD residents belting NSW, the gap could become bigger. With all the faults in the running of the QLD cup, it is still a very strong competition with looks like more stability than what's happening in NSW.

 

[Nfed]

Not that I have kept a real interest in the reggies foir 2008 but it would appear it will be a shambles in NSW. With the QLD residents belting NSW, the gap could become bigger. With all the faults in the running of the QLD cup, it is still a very strong competition with looks like more stability than what's happening in NSW.

I think the results of those Residents games have more to do with the job done by selectors. Last year NSW won because they picked good players like Craig Trindall, Brett Finn and Grant Wooden. This year none of those players were picked and they got flogged.

 

[Nfed]

Right. So Bulls will be Canterbury's P/L Club?

I've really got to renew my subscription to Rugby League Review...

Yes. The Bulls and Bulldogs have had an on/off relationship since the Bulls inception. In their first season, 2000, the Metro Cup finished early, so Bulls halfback Paul Khoury went up and starred for the Bulldogs in the 1st division (P/L) quaters, semi and grand final wins. Then in 2002 Adam Tippett, Willie Grech and Ryan Asplet played for the Bulldogs in the 1st Division during State Of Origin and again in the quarters and semi finals when Metro finsihed early again.

There wasnt much interaction between 2003-2005 but during 2006 9 Bulls played Premier League. Some played a few games while Charlie Farah played about 15. When the Bulls had the first week off as Minor Premiers last year, 6 played for the Bulldogs against St Marys-Penrith Cougars.

In 2007, 6 memebers of the Bulldogs P/L squad have played for the Bulls - Fred Briggs, Nathan Wynn, Adnan Saleh, Jamie Judge, John Koborsi and Frank Winterstein. Also some other P/L squad members that dont rate a spot in the Bulls top side can play with the Bulls U/21 side if they are only 1 year out of Flegg.

I was told by an insider 10 weeks ago that the deal was done but RLR claimed in June that it was not a done deal.

 

[Nfed]

Last I heard St George would be continuing in P/L. With Manly continuing I think Belrose will stay in JBC. Over the last 3 years 16 players have played for both Belrose and Manly in P/L or the NRL. I think Belrose would want this relationship to continue and this would be unlikely if Belrose and Manly were competitors.

 

[The Engineers Room]

I think that running two comps would be ridiculous and the stronger clubs in JBC may be asked to enter the PL. With a number of other clubs interested in joining JBC the time is right to run a 2 tier competition.

 

[Nfed]

I think that running two comps would be ridiculous and the stronger clubs in JBC may be asked to enter the PL. With a number of other clubs interested in joining JBC the time is right to run a 2 tier competition.

The decision has already been made to continue a P/L grade. A number of NRL clubs wanted it but that does not mean they have to have a team in it.

Also any club can apply to play in P/L. The Sydney Bulls applied after the 2002 season when they had players of the calibre of Quentin Pongia, James Pickering and Ben Anderson in their Metro team, but the NSWRL knocked them back. But hopefully this time if a strong club like Cabramatta applies they will be accepted for P/L even if Parramatta connects with another club (say Mounties)