AFL 2005 - Round 16

[CyberKev]

Dirty day for the Tigers who again came up against quality opposition and got belted.

The Tigers did start well, but can be very thankful that conditions were less than ideal during the first half or the margin could have been in three figures. Richo was well held and concerns surround Gaspar who looks set to miss a few weeks with a hamstring injury. Interestingly enough, the Tigers again dominated in the ruck and seem to have found a sound ruck pairing in Knobel and Simmonds. Predictably, Tuck (surely the most improved player in the entire competition) and Coughlan fought all the way, but the Tigers had few bright spots outside of this pair.

That being said, Deledio continues to show strong signs for the future and - most gratifyingly of all for the club - Shane Morrison really stood out in the final term. Facing an impending KPP crisis the Tigers are desperate for players like Morrison & Shultz to come on and they would have been rapt with Shane's efforts late in the game.

The Saints started slowly and needed the opening quarter to adjust to the (for them) unfamiliar conditions. Initially the Tigers entertained a greater workrate, but once the Saints found their tempo it was largely one way traffic toward the Saints forwards. Hayes, Dal Santo & Hayes were fab out of the centre for the Saints, Hudghton & Maguire teamed beautifully in key defensive roles, and a rejuvenated Kosi was a constant handful for the Tiger defence. Luke Ball was totally blanketed in the opening half by Chaffey, but came alive in the second half and his unswerving courage was a feature of the afternoon (as per usual).

Considering they were missing: Hammil, Reiwoldt, Penny & Harvey the Saints were fab, and will trouble any opposition in the finals, which they should make it to regardless of personnel issues.

 

[CyberKev]

In other matches thus far:

And then there were three... Essendon became the latest side to escape the 'priority zone' with an upset win over fellow battler Collingwood last night. The Magpies were well beaten across the night, although they did manage to return some respectability to the scoreboard in the last term. There's only really pride on the line for these sides at this stage anyway, but the Bombers will readily take a win against the black & white wherever they can get it. Realistically both sides will struggle over remaining games and, in all probability, will continue to do it hard throughout 2006.

The Cats are BIT! Or so it would seem, after the Cats trounced indifferent reigning premier Port in the hostile confines of the Cattery. Port have no rights making the finals on many showings they've dredged up this season and this was as forgettable as any. I expect they'll stay alive by beating Richmond next week, but how many performances like this can a side put in and expect to be around in September? Good effort by Geelong who happily find themselves back on the winners list and anticipating the return of key personnel in the run home to the finals. Geelong will almost certainly make the final four and will give a good account of themselves in September.

 

[CyberKev]

On a sadder note, best wishes to Nick Holland on his retirement. :C:

Nick's career ended this afternoon, in a harsh but almost perversely fitting manner, when his shoulder collapsed in a contest. Perversely fitting because it was shoulder injuries that were the beginning of his end in 2001. I saw both of those injuries occur and they were as innocuous a pair of incidents as you could ever see, but the impact from them was devastating. Other injuries followed and the big man was cut down in his prime, never to be the same again.

Holland has certainly attracted a lot of negative press over the past two years, but all elite sportsmen deserve to be remembered for their positive contributions, and the great Carey was the only KPP in the game ahead of Holland between 1998-2001.

Looks like its time to up Ruory Kirkby from the rookie list.

 

[camsmith]

Nice wrap up.

Its bad news about Holland... he should have been playing for the Hawks so it should have never happened (imo)

I disagree that the Tigers should be thankful that the conditions were less than ideal.. We had a pretty tall side in today and Simmonds, Richo etc. were struggling all day with the conditions. I just wished the rain kept comming, we were playing smart wet weather footy when it was pelting down, but as soon as it cleared up we turned our heads off and played dumb footy.

Yes, we are losing to quality teams and cant seem to be able to match it with them (except the West Coast game) but what im happy about is we're winning the games that we should be winning!

Either way i was just happy to get home and jack the heater up, thore out and enjoy a few beers.
Till next time...

 

[CyberKev]

Things that make you go, hmmm...

I've had a look at the Bulldogs a couple of times in recent weeks and have noticed that they're enacting a gameplan that looks suspiciously akin to that being used by Hawthorn. Surprising then that Mr Eade doesn't appear to be copping the barrage of criticism that Mr Clarkson has been.

I'm not having a go at the Hounds, as they clearly don't have the tall and strong forward presence to be going long and direct inside 50, but it is noticable that they get far more latitude with the experts despite the extended length of time they've already spent in the bottom four.

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Matthew Pavlich...

For sometime now the Hawks have copped plenty for their decision to take Hodge before Judd in the 2001 draft, although the former's form this season has taken much of the edge of that issue. Not surprisingly, given the brilliant form of Matthew Pavlich this season, the heat has transferred to Collingwood and their decision to run with Fraser ahead of Pavlich in 1999.

Its all a bit silly of course, given that just as 10 clubs (excluding Hawthorn) made it clear post draft that they would have ran with Hodge at number 1, its difficult to perceive of other clubs doing anything other than running with Fraser had they had pick 1 in 1999.

That being said, I'd love to have Pavlich at Hawthorn. Wonderfully diverse footballer who can play anywhere but the ruck with aplomb... He's been absolutely killing it for my dreamteam this year. Two words... Franchise Player!
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Jason Kozitschke...

Up until this season he is best remembered for having as sensational a debut year as an key position player in memory. Injuries served to limit his effectiveness over recent seasons and Reiwoldt quickly replaced him as the elite tall at St Kilda. Over the past few weeks, however, we've all been given a timely reminder of Kosi's quality as a young footballer. His ability to continually present and pull in the strong mark was fantastic in adverse conditions on the weekend.

Yet another player I'd kill to have at Hawthorn

 

[meltiger]

Facing an impending KPP crisis

Is that right??

 

[meltiger]

Richo was well held

Once again only because of tactics that the media seemed to beleive were utterly disgraceful when it was Barry Hall who was suffering.

What made it worse is the filth were paying frees up the other end of the ground for much softer indiscretions than what backmen are allowed to get away with against Richo.

Leave him one on one with his opponent and umpire him under the same rules applied to the 'Star' forwards and lets see how well anyone in the comp can hold him.

Only one player have I ever seen do it legally - Dustin Fletcher.

 

[meltiger]

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Matthew Pavlich...

For sometime now the Hawks have copped plenty for their decision to take Hodge before Judd in the 2001 draft, although the former's form this season has taken much of the edge of that issue. Not surprisingly, given the brilliant form of Matthew Pavlich this season, the heat has transferred to Collingwood and their decision to run with Fraser ahead of Pavlich in 1999.

Its all a bit silly of course, given that just as 10 clubs (excluding Hawthorn) made it clear post draft that they would have ran with Hodge at number 1, its difficult to perceive of other clubs doing anything other than running with Fraser had they had pick 1 in 1999.

That being said, I'd love to have Pavlich at Hawthorn. Wonderfully diverse footballer who can play anywhere but the ruck with aplomb... He's been absolutely killing it for my dreamteam this year. Two words... Franchise Player!
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Utter crap.

A confidence player who can very easily be put off his game & is completely incapable of leading his team out of dark situations. So he kicked 9 goals in a team that was flogging the worst team to take an AFL field since Fitzroy circa '96... So what?

Hawthorn made the right choice.

 

[CyberKev]

Is that right??

Time will tell as it always does.

Frawley did get a good number of young talls into the club, but the jury remains very much out on the quality of these players.

Shulz would be the best of them, but its sobering to note that he has averaged 5 possessions a game throughout his career to this point. Richmond would be wise, however, to run him at CHB as its an easier gig than CHF and he may be better suited to the role.

I was thinking that Morrison may have been set for delisting at season's end, but if he can continue the sort of output he came up with in the last quarter at the weekend he'll be more than useful.

After that we have: Archibald, Pattison, Limbach, McGuane, Moore & Thursfield.

Pattison has reasonable wraps, but conventional wisdom appears to be that he'll be more of a Simmonds type than a Thompson. By that I mean he looks to have plenty to offer as a mobile ruckman, but may struggle when put up forward. Worth perservering with however.

Thursfield is an interesting one. Should prove a handy player with time, but I'm not certain he'll end up being a KPP defender. He doesn't seem to have the body type for it, but time will tell.

Moore hasn't shown a lot to this point, and the other three are still well short of the mark, although all have age on their side still.

With Gaspar set to retire at the end of 2006 and Richo looking increasingly wonky, Tez me lad will be eager to see marked improvement in these players next year with the prospect of big gaps opening up in 2007.

To this end, the potential KPP crisis is more in terms of quality than available quantity. Still, it may be that some of them just need greater exposure at the top level to shine.

 

[CyberKev]

Once again only because of tactics that the media seemed to beleive were utterly disgraceful when it was Barry Hall who was suffering.

What made it worse is the filth were paying frees up the other end of the ground for much softer indiscretions than what backmen are allowed to get away with against Richo.

Leave him one on one with his opponent and umpire him under the same rules applied to the 'Star' forwards and lets see how well anyone in the comp can hold him.

Only one player have I ever seen do it legally - Dustin Fletcher.

I'll have to take your word for this, as from my TV side view, I didn't think he was particularly harshly done by. He had plenty of opportunity in the opening quarter, but Hudghton played smart and had much the better of him when the ball hit the ground.

I do recall one occasion in particular where he received a free despite initiating holding contact with Hudghton. On a few occasions there were a few lineballers that can either be paid or not paid depending on the umpires mood on the day (but these are generally ones I loathe seeing paid anyway).

I really don't see that he copped it worse than other full forwards I've seen this season and, at any rate, I think the modern game is generally too tough on defenders anyway.

 

[CyberKev]

Utter crap.

A confidence player who can very easily be put off his game & is completely incapable of leading his team out of dark situations. So he kicked 9 goals in a team that was flogging the worst team to take an AFL field since Fitzroy circa '96... So what?

Obviously you didn't see him banging through 7 off his own boot in the final term against Adelaide the previous week?

He's been fantastic all season (save for two shockers, one being against the Tigers, which you are clearly making this judgement on), and is clearly the best utility player in the competition.

Tez me lad would cream himself silly at the mere prospect of getting him to Tigerland, as would all other coaches in the comp.

Gun!

Hawthorn made the right choice.

Yes, which is of course, not to intimate that the Saints or Eagles should necessarily agree with this assertion.

The Chaffmeister general did a fab job on Luke Ball in the first half on the weekend, but to his credit, young Ball got off the mat nicely in the second half.

Most courageous footballer in the comp for mine, and well worth St Kilda letting him sit out the first season for.

Hawthorn should take note if they get a crack at Xavier Ellis in this draft, as I hear the young fellow is thinking of not nominating so as to focus on his VCE. The club would be better off wooing him with the prospect of a lightened load next year and extra tuition.

 

[meltiger]

He's been fantastic all season (save for two shockers, one being against the Tigers, which you are clearly making this judgement on), and is clearly the best utility player in the competition.

Not the first time he has had a shocker against Richmond and the one I begin to base my assesment on was from a few years ago when their coach stupidly played him on Richo.

Richo made him look like he belonged in the VAFA, he was that much better than him it was laughable. To say Richo bent him over and flogged him silly is a vast understatement.

& what did Pavlich do? Dropped his head, gave away dumb free kicks and was completely inefectual all day long.

I am yet to see Pavlich produce in true big games, when his team needs him.

Richmond were the only team who can say they did worse out of the draft Pavlich went in but of course we drafted that superstar Aaron Fiora @ #3 before Pavlich went @ #4 & he certainly isn't as useless as Fiora.

 

[meltiger]

Time will tell as it always does.

Frawley did get a good number of young talls into the club, but the jury remains very much out on the quality of these players.

Shulz would be the best of them, but its sobering to note that he has averaged 5 possessions a game throughout his career to this point. Richmond would be wise, however, to run him at CHB as its an easier gig than CHF and he may be better suited to the role.

Whats that Hawthorn people keep saying about their two draftees? Young KPP's need several years of development before they come into their own.

Jay is 20 for christs sake and has had more than his share of injuries. He is killing them at Coburg, if he gets his off field attitude right, he'll be in our spine @ CHB for years to come.

I was thinking that Morrison may have been set for delisting at season's end, but if he can continue the sort of output he came up with in the last quarter at the weekend he'll be more than useful.

I'd say Morro is still primed for delisting, not that he neccesarily deserves it but some have to go to make way for new draftees and unfortunately, he'd be one of the ones to go, which is a shame cause he could have been a stop-gap measure until the kids come through.

After that we have: Archibald, Pattison, Limbach, McGuane, Moore & Thursfield.

Can only say I've seen three of the six play.

Pattison has reasonable wraps, but conventional wisdom appears to be that he'll be more of a Simmonds type than a Thompson. By that I mean he looks to have plenty to offer as a mobile ruckman, but may struggle when put up forward. Worth perservering with however.

Wallace seems to have big wraps on Patto. For mine, he looks more mobile than Simmo and can certainly kick set shots much more accurately. They are the two reasons I don't see Simmo as a CHF. If he puts on the weight Terry wants him too... See no reason he won't be a success.

Thursfield is an interesting one. Should prove a handy player with time, but I'm not certain he'll end up being a KPP defender. He doesn't seem to have the body type for it, but time will tell.

I'd like to see him keep the weight off and tackle the likes of Milne/O'Loughlin every week. Did a sensational job on both players.

Moore hasn't shown a lot to this point,

Kelv has played less than 10 senior games, being promoted off the rookies mid season last year. Another who has been injury plauged this year at Coburg. Has apparently been good the last few weeks for the Burgers, we'll see how he goes tomorrow night.

and the other three are still well short of the mark, although all have age on their side still.
With Gaspar set to retire at the end of 2006 and Richo looking increasingly wonky

McGuane is injured and from what I hear, not seen I agree, the others are well off.

Tez me lad will be eager to see marked improvement in these players next year with the prospect of big gaps opening up in 2007.

To this end, the potential KPP crisis is more in terms of quality than available quantity. Still, it may be that some of them just need greater exposure at the top level to shine.

My opinion is we have CHF & CHB most likely locked down.

Full forward once Richo goes is a concern, but I can see teams leading towards the Mark Williams type smaller spear heads over the next 5 to 10 years as this flooding disgrace gets worse. Full Back then would be my main concern and I honestly think we'll see Daniel Jackson there in 2-3 years time.

Our KPP situation is no where near as bad as people seem to beleive.

Of course, I'd love to have a young Jonno Brown playing for Coburg but they are once in a generation players mate. - Dermott/Carey/Brown
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On another note, I am apparently sitting in the middle of the members tomorrow night. Cross your fingers for me that I make it back to Melbourne alive! lol